Please prioritise the live game over Riot

[Flaws]

1 minute ago, Lign said:

dunno, based on arranged matches, ppl barely switch from ntec. And oca can be easily outplayed by ntec users with some brain

It depends on the player involved's skill level and understanding of the game. How well they play together as a team opposed to how much they lean on soloing. It also depends a lot on the spot, the objective, the opposition's weapons and weaknesses etc etc. If you don't need to switch from a versatile weapon because the opp is way below you, then you won't and that's generally fine. It's a bit like saying the FBW is op because top players beat newbies with it.

[GhosT]

2 hours ago, Flaws said:

Nah, the N-TEC is a great versatile weapon but at high/top level, SMGs and Shotguns melt it at CQC, oscar/carbine can shit all over it in mid range and HVR/OBIR/Obeya etc beat it long range.

 

People need to understand that just because a really good N-TEC player can beat casual players who don't know how to play their weapons, it does not make the N-TEC unbalanced. Just because of players who don't know how to aim/position themselves with the weapon they have in their hands and they lack team play.

 

Also, jumpshooting with the N-TEC isn't as good as people think. The only times it works is when you can catch someone by surprise (again talking about high level play). The rest of the time you will get yourself perfectly tracked as most good players known the jump and fall arc in the game which you cannot avoid when jump shooting. On top of that, most players play the N-TEC with IR3 which increases full auto + jump bloom and loss of accuracy significantly so it's a lot of RNG involved as well.

 

No offense to anyone, but if you are struggling with killing an N-TEC in CQC with an OCA (especially with CJ2/3 on it), I don't think weapon balancing is your biggest concern.

 

 

You make good points, but it's still undeniable that the NTEC overporforms a majority of the guns.

 

I for one formed my opinion about the N-TEC (and other guns) by playing it for a long time, not because "waaah i get killed by it a lot it must be overpowered!"

 

People like that shouldn't even talk about balancing at all, as they mostly don't even know the weapon they're talking about.

 

[LilyV3]

2 hours ago, Flaws said:

Nah, the N-TEC is a great versatile weapon but at high/top level, SMGs and Shotguns melt it at CQC, oscar/carbine can shit all over it in mid range and HVR/OBIR/Obeya etc beat it long range.

 

 

The problem in APB is the non static situations.

 

Yes there are ranges where some guns outclass the n-tec but for most of these guns the range outperforming the N-tec is pretty small.

But even during a mission crossing a bigger street already shifts some weapons out of those "advantage zones". The n-tec is pretty much the only weapon that can keep an extremely high level of efficiency in nearly any situation. So with an N-Tec in your hands you can, by the various approaches APB offers, nearly always shift the situation to your advantage.  This is something a pretty tight niche Weapon cannot do. As the weapon now dictates your tactic in many of the existing spots. And then these weapons quickly get outperformed by just altering your tactics during the mission. Sure there are some spots in San Paro where specific niche weapons are king because attackers cannot alter the situation. And then often the only possibility is to switch to the same weapon. But honestly, those situations are pretty rare and in long range scenarios are usually making Snipers the choice over the Obeya (if we stick with the Obeya as an example).  And that's the reason N-tec is so meta, since changing weapons on the fly is way too unreliable by the natural variance most objectives have.

 

I wonder if it would hurt balance that much if the Obeya gets the N-tec debloom. Since it is naturally slower than the N-tec with it's ttk will not outclass the N-tec at closer ranges. Yet the damage dropoff and necessarity to hit multiple shots in a row would also not outclass the N-HVR on extreme ranges. it would also help the Obeya with mobility. Sprinting to a location return firing is pretty much "hard" because the debloom from sprint to proper aim accuracy is rather "slow". At least, that's hard and slow compared to other guns you have which is why the N-tec can outperform the Obeya often because you can quickly return accurate fire, while the Obeya cannot do this after movement. And this makes the Obeya sometimes feel more like a defensive weapon instead of an offensive where you have to close into objectives or opponents.

I remember when I started APB, the OBIR and Obeya were used a lot more, but back then they had much lower ttk's as well so they were closer to the n-tec and closer to the N-HVR in competition. And After all those changes it received it's niche was getting too tight to be a solid choice for mid-long range encounters and the variety of ranges during the battle for the same spot.

[Fortune Runner]

13 hours ago, shhift said:

~Snip~

Not denying that there are valid things in your post about stuff that needs to be fixed.

However your post contradicts fixing anything the way you are saying this on your post.

It's already been in many threads by Little Orbit as well as SPCT members that the engine upgrade is needed to properly fix  a majority of APB's problems.

You can not put the cart before the horse or it just can not go anywhere.

[Weeb TheEpicGuyV2]

6 hours ago, DeadPixels said:

N-TEC 5. I really think it's too accurate with jumpshooting...

That's less of an issue with the jump modifier on it (it's tied in third worst jump modifier out of all ARs at 12 along with the Ursus, Frenzy & Scoped Ntec. The LCR has one of 13 in second and the issr-a is in first with a whopping 40) and more so to do with the gun itself

 

The jump modifier nerf LO drew up for the ntec a while back before vaulting the idea would only have served as a stop gap method at best

 

Wait how did the thread get derailed to about the ntec?

Edited May 16, 2019 by Weeb TheEpicGuyV2

[AxeTurboAgresor]

Bugs needs to be naturally highlighted. You are correct about it.

 

Regarding to suggestion to your balance changes. There is nothing I could DISagree more. The changes were not made, becouse what you suggest is a terrible thing to do.

 

Low-Yields. No.

 

Remote detonator. No

 

Yellow mods. Should not be touched as opposed to your opinion. People still do play with a field supply, becouse of different mode builds.

 

Shotguns. As an SMG specialized player I do not agree that shotguns are any superior to SMGs.

 

Cooldowns

I am not againts it, while not for it either. It does not give any significant tactical advantage. I could say that this is not why people lose the mission.

 

HVR. High damage is the point of HVR. Would agree it it was not nerfed already. Its perfectly ok as it is now. LO did a great job with HVR.

[swindIe]

i totely agree with @AxeTurboAgresor do you seriuesly think remote bomb need to get change???? so fkn redicules get a grip ppl and know whats better for the FUTURE of the fkn game..

 

hvr 850 dams is most balanced thing 2 this game so absoleutly NO COMENT!!!

 

yellow mod are perfect (even tho no one asked for em xD) becaus u need to be tactical like look at swat 4 instants they have armor shields n shit and ammo box so they can do breach charges on side of building and blow up criminel car

[majuler]

Mate its funny bro u literally whuld get knocked flat on ur behind taking a .50 cal round in real life balance or not bro 850 damage is been generous but its like w/e i get games need balance and what not so i mnot too concern they did there part and did no quick switchs im fine with that honestly thwe gun can still be used how it shuld be thats about all i got to say about the hvr , dueces - Majuler

[Shui]

16 hours ago, shhift said:

• Low-Yields

 We still have 3 low yields, should be reduced down to 2 to start with.

This will not be enough. You need to nerf the damage to something like 330 to 490 as well.
Or even better, just remove them.

 

16 hours ago, shhift said:

• HVR

HVR still deals 850 damage. 850 damage is way too much for any gun in this game to deal, the damage should be reduced and the zoom in nerf should be reverted, this just made the gun feel clunky and unfun to play. The quickswitching was never really the problem with the gun but more so the fact that it deals 850 damage and takes you out of the fight for 10-15 seconds  for minimal effort.  What you should've done was reduce the damage of the HVR to 720 and make it drop down to 50 at 90-100m so you don't get 1 tapped at render distance.

Haha I always think about all the "skilled" people who said damage is not the problem.
That happens when you listen to streamers and other scrubs.
How you said, QS wasnt the problem, it was and is the damage.
However, you should not do less damage on max range tho.

[AxeTurboAgresor]

@swindIe Its not even hard to avoid car detonator death...

HVR TTK = 1.75s. While its necessarry to stay still and wait for crosshair to get small.

Yellow mods made the game so much more fun. This is the first time I see some kind of protest againts it, and I am shocked how dedicated some people are to destroy the game to the ground by making it super boring by taking content away, or nerfing it to the point its useless. 

[vsb]

12 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Yellow mods made the game so much more fun. This is the first time I see some kind of protest againts it, 

consumables were railed since g1 first announced them and true to community expectations they've caused nothing but issues since, where have you been?

[AxeTurboAgresor]

32 minutes ago, Glaciers said:

consumables were railed since g1 first announced them and true to community expectations they've caused nothing but issues since, where have you been?

the only issue with yellow mods are thousands of mails. Yellow mods adds a lil bit depth to this game. Never seen ANYBODY to have an issue with this mods. Where did u guys even came from and who paid u?

[vsb]

35 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

the only issue with yellow mods are thousands of mails. Yellow mods adds a lil bit depth to this game. Never seen ANYBODY to have an issue with this mods. Where did u guys even came from and who paid u?

• ammo box is a direct upgrade over the mobile resupply mod
• ammo box also leads to more prolific use of alternate character mods (spotter/blowtotch/det) with no downside
• consumable reward system causes imbalance between players still ranking up and players who are max rank
• mail box spam (even the most minor issue still hasnt been fixed lol)
• shield rewards poor positioning with a "save button"
• 2 consumables are at best not worth using, and at worst completely worthless

the broad problems with consumables i can think of off top, satchel charges are the only consumable that doesnt have glaring flaws

 

 

Edited May 16, 2019 by Glaciers
typo

[Goldtiger]

Take notes LO 

[DeadPixels]

Since we are talking about consumables, can i ask a simple question. Do you get them only when you are max rank? I am leveling up characters and never get any mail, but i do remember i got mail when they first appeared in the game

[GhosT]

2 hours ago, majuler said:

Mate its funny bro u literally whuld get knocked flat on ur behind taking a .50 cal round in real life balance or not bro 850 damage is been generous but its like w/e i get games need balance and what not so i mnot too concern they did there part and did no quick switchs im fine with that honestly thwe gun can still be used how it shuld be thats about all i got to say about the hvr , dueces - Majuler

 

Why do people keep saying the N-HVR shoots .50 cal rounds? It uses 7.62mm.

[vsb]

10 minutes ago, DeadPixels said:

Since we are talking about consumables, can i ask a simple question. Do you get them only when you are max rank? I am leveling up characters and never get any mail, but i do remember i got mail when they first appeared in the game

you technically can get them at any rank

 

the problem is that they're classified as random mission rewards but know what else is classified as random mission rewards? every single symbol and every emote - when your max rank chances are you've unlocked all or nearly all of those already, so you roll "consumable" reward way more often than someone who has only unlocked half of them

 

this is what i meant here

1 hour ago, Glaciers said:

consumable reward system causes imbalance between players still ranking up and players who are max rank

a r150 with 3 or 4 consumables has is at a disadvantage vs a r250 that can spam ammo boxes for every stage of every mission

[AxeTurboAgresor]

1 hour ago, Glaciers said:

• ammo box is a direct upgrade over the mobile resupply mod

Problem? U can also sacrifice yellow resupply for healing or shield or any other yellow mode and use mobile resupply lol. 

• ammo box also leads to more prolific use of alternate character modes (spotter/blowtotch/det) with no downside

U cant have a shied (reference to ur other point). It allows more mode builds. Cant see a problem with that.

• consumable reward system causes imbalance between players still ranking up and players who are max rank
• mail box spam (even the most minor issue still hasnt been fixed lol)

Thats why I say, Lets have yellow modes permament!

• shield rewards poor positioning with a "save button"

Ok. Thats literally why it was made. It may save yo butt. May be used as a block. Or walking wall. Its a great item. Btw where s yo op resupply box! Oh I see, now mobile resupply comes handy.

• 2 consumables are at best not worth using, and at worst completely worthless

Dont u dare to name em. Even this 2 modes holds its tactical or fun value!

 

I see u have only problem with a certain builds that dont event break anything lol. Case closed.

 

 

I dont rly understand u guys. In the name of ballance, u want to nerf or remove everything to the point that sh*t happens boring, useless, and frustrating. Go ruin some other game, thanks

[Lign]

7 hours ago, LilyV3 said:

 

The problem in APB is the non static situations.

 

Yes there are ranges where some guns outclass the n-tec but for most of these guns the range outperforming the N-tec is pretty small.

But even during a mission crossing a bigger street already shifts some weapons out of those "advantage zones". The n-tec is pretty much the only weapon that can keep an extremely high level of efficiency in nearly any situation. So with an N-Tec in your hands you can, by the various approaches APB offers, nearly always shift the situation to your advantage.  This is something a pretty tight niche Weapon cannot do. As the weapon now dictates your tactic in many of the existing spots. And then these weapons quickly get outperformed by just altering your tactics during the mission. Sure there are some spots in San Paro where specific niche weapons are king because attackers cannot alter the situation. And then often the only possibility is to switch to the same weapon. But honestly, those situations are pretty rare and in long range scenarios are usually making Snipers the choice over the Obeya (if we stick with the Obeya as an example).  And that's the reason N-tec is so meta, since changing weapons on the fly is way too unreliable by the natural variance most objectives have.

 

I wonder if it would hurt balance that much if the Obeya gets the N-tec debloom. Since it is naturally slower than the N-tec with it's ttk will not outclass the N-tec at closer ranges. Yet the damage dropoff and necessarity to hit multiple shots in a row would also not outclass the N-HVR on extreme ranges. it would also help the Obeya with mobility. Sprinting to a location return firing is pretty much "hard" because the debloom from sprint to proper aim accuracy is rather "slow". At least, that's hard and slow compared to other guns you have which is why the N-tec can outperform the Obeya often because you can quickly return accurate fire, while the Obeya cannot do this after movement. And this makes the Obeya sometimes feel more like a defensive weapon instead of an offensive where you have to close into objectives or opponents.

I remember when I started APB, the OBIR and Obeya were used a lot more, but back then they had much lower ttk's as well so they were closer to the n-tec and closer to the N-HVR in competition. And After all those changes it received it's niche was getting too tight to be a solid choice for mid-long range encounters and the variety of ranges during the battle for the same spot.

God, you read my mind

 

Merged.

 

2 hours ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

HVR TTK = 1.75s.

It seems most ppl dont understand practical situations. It's the same If I say bishada is much better than pioneer because it's faster and you can catch objects very quickly or SAS PDW has faster ttk than FBW but I barely see someone using bishada or PDW nowadays.

 

And about hvr. Any damage source makes its ttk 0s, playing in team makes its ttk 0s.

Edited May 16, 2019 by Lign

[vsb]

6 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Problem?

do you just not understand the fundamental concepts of balance?

 

if item A and item B both have the same use but item B is superior, item B is not balanced

 

13 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

U cant have a shied (reference to ur other point). It allows more mode builds. Cant see a problem with that.

it "allows" more builds at the expense of forcing tradeoffs, the very concept apb is built on

 

e.g. instead of choosing between ammo resupply or blowtorch, a player can have ammo resupply and blowtorch  

 

18 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Ok. Thats literally why it was made. It may save yo butt. May be used as a block. Or walking wall. Its a great item. 

i sincerely doubt that shield was implemented so players could run into the open and magic up cover, but i guess there's no real way to know what g1 was thinking

 

20 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Btw where s yo op resupply box! Oh I see, now mobile resupply comes handy.

same issue as above

 

instead of having to choose between shield or ammo, you can have shield and ammo

 

21 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

I see u have only problem with a certain builds that dont event break anything lol. Case closed.

well yes obviously its only certain "builds", because only certain "builds" are unbalanced

 

use your brain

[AxeTurboAgresor]

What a word game. Ahah.

Its ballanced. Sometimes you need yellow ammo, sometimes orange ammo, sometimes both. Its perfectly ok how it is. If you dont see the reason behind using orange ammo Well dont freakin use it, but stop complaining about build, becousebuilds are not the reason why you lose the game. The problem is you.

 

Lemme enlighten you. Yellow modes do not have tradeoffs becouse they dont even need one. Just pick the damn mode u prefer, but u can have only 1. Totally game breaking.

 

I would be sad for u that u did not get kills bcs somebody else usedshiled but u r getting killed in open cuz of no plan B, if I cared about you.

 

Cloaking agent + healing spray is the worst combination plz buff logic.

[vsb]

5 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

What a word game. Ahah.

sorry will use small word so no hard

 

10 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Its ballanced

no balance

 

12 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

If you dont see the reason behind using orange ammo Well dont freakin use it

i say why use mod, i no think why is good

 

6 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

becousebuilds are not the reason why you lose the game

i no talk of lose game, why you talk of lose game?

 

8 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Yellow modes do not have tradeoffs becouse they dont even need one. Just pick the damn mode u prefer, but u can have only 1. Totally game breaking

all mod have trade why no trade for yellow mod?

 

9 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

I would be sad for u that u did not get kills bcs somebody else usedshiled but u r getting killed in open cuz of no plan B, if I cared about you

i no talk of kill, why u talk of kill?

 

8 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Cloaking agent

u spell bad

 

 

[AxeTurboAgresor]

4 hours ago, Glaciers said:

sorry will use small word so no hard

You like to take the words out of its intentional context, and twist it to your advantage just to prove your point. It not only makes you look dumb, but also a cockhead.

 

no balance

Yes balance

 

i say why use mod, i no think why is good

Now we are getting into something. Why whould you use Clotting Agent + Med spray if its useless? Same logic. While you dont see any use of orange ammo mode, I do. Its not my problem. Its yours.

 

i no talk of lose game, why you talk of lose game?

Again. Taking a sentence of its context. You just proved my point.

 

all mod have trade why no trade for yellow mod?

Yeah, now since I think about it, having a shield should give you +1strenght, and -2intelligence, and -1mobility. OCA should give +5mobility, +2 attack speed, -6% health. And baseball cap shoud give +3 perception. lol

...Its literally an items. If you want negative effect on you while carrying one, go play some RPG game.

Comsumables do not need negative effect. 

 

i no talk of kill, why u talk of kill?

Playing dummy again huh?

 

u spell bad

+

 

 

[vsb]

here we go again

 

50 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

You like to take the words out of its intentional context

do you understand what context means?

 

51 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

It not only makes you look dumb, but also a cockhead.

we'll circle back to this shortly dont worry

 

30 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Why whould you use Clotting Agent + Med spray if its useless? Same logic

what does a poor combination of mods have to do with anything?

 

is the hvr suddenly a weak weapon because you can use heavy barrel on it?

 

30 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

While you dont see any use of orange ammo mode, I do. Its not my problem. Its yours.

5 hours ago, Glaciers said:

instead of having to choose between shield or ammo, you can have shield and ammo

i literally provided an example of why a player would use mobile resupply box, good reading comprehension

 

34 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Again. Taking a sentence of its context. You just proved my point

what?

 

you're the one who just assumed i want consumables nerfed because i lose fights because of them - thats it, thats the entire context

 

pretty stupid assumption tbh, why would i put myself at a disadvantage by not using consumables?

 

41 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Yeah, now since I think about it, having a shield should give you +1strenght, and -2intelligence, and -1mobility. OCA should give +5mobility, +2 attack speed, -6% health. And baseball cap shoud give +3 perception. lol

which one of us is "taking a sentence of its context" now? am i allowed to call you a dumb cockhead at this point?

 

37 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

go play some RPG game.

fire up those brain cells i have a piping hot take for you

 

apb has tons of rpg mechanics already

 

42 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Comsumables do not need negative effect. 

6 hours ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Thats why I say, Lets have yellow modes permament!

so you've suggested (in this very thread) that consumables should be normal permanent character mods and yet you also dont want them to have a downside like a majority of current character mods?

 

48 minutes ago, AxeTurboAgresor said:

Playing dummy again huh?

yet again you're making wild assumptions, good job bud

 

 

using smaller words didnt seem to help you understand anything, thats a shame

[Fortune Runner]

Regardless of everyone's opinions over what to nerf which seems based on what they do good with vs what they are bad with

The title of this thread is "Please prioritise the live game over Riot"

Which means every last one of you seem to of derailed the meaning of this thread.

 

13 hours ago, Fortune Runner said:

Not denying that there are valid things in your post about stuff that needs to be fixed.

However your post contradicts fixing anything the way you are saying this on your post.

It's already been in many threads by Little Orbit as well as SPCT members that the engine upgrade is needed to properly fix  a majority of APB's problems.

You can not put the cart before the horse or it just can not go anywhere.

Which is why I said that the way I had said it.

In other words I also thought this thread would veer off course into what it did now and unfortunately I was right.

 

I mean really guys you even derailed the derail of the derail