LilyRain

Yes, PMG's range is definitely more appropriate atm than it was before. More so that it has 3 meters over OCA EW (20m vs 17m) and that its previous 35m range was identical to Carbine's. Even being at 30m kinda protrudes into carbine/OSCAR range. I'm just a bit concerned about OCA-Whisper overshadowing both most of the time with its staggering, built-in additional range of 10 meters over PMG's (Feels like it has Improved Rifling 4 with no downsides) AT the accuracy and ttk of OCA-EW. I wonder why the Whisper with its ttk and comparable accuracy to non-whisper-OCA (its accuracy is actually better due to better base at 10m and crouch modifier that is less than 1), was deemed fine at 30m rather than anything between 17-23 meters. Yep, it sure has the quick band-aid vibes behind it I hope so too. By delaying balancing till the new engine is ready (since making changes on it should be more seamless & easier), I hope they can achieve that level quickly because the time-pressure from marketing APB 2.1 won't let them have many casual-attempts at it.

I was hinting towards the hateful LTL-nerf that they have failed to justify but you aren't wrong, meta-weapons indeed got nerfed & not in the right way - PMG's nerf ended up being too much (this is coming from someone who doesn't like the PMG) as it always was meant to be a slower but more range-rich than OCA. Evidently, whomever is approving changes decided to have OCA-whisper on a league of its own that completely breaks this ideal. PMG's range went down from 35 meters to 20 meters while giving OCA-Whisper a solid 30 meters. If the player plans on playing super-close, they can go with the non-Whisper variant as it can kill faster, otherwise Whisper is the more reliable choice. PMG is just dead. They didn't balance the game, they just made CQC-players switch from PMG to OCA. - HVR's accuracy-damage mechanic would fit in a sci-fi game, not in here. HVR isn't a charge-laser sniper.. I'd like to see what they will do when they revisit HVR (if they ever do). - NFAS wasn't exactly nerfed. LO removed the shotgun ray-scaling they added a while back. Ray-scaling was set to be too generous & ended up having NFAS be super powerful. The weapon itself wasn't changed. - N-tec's destiny is what decides the general balance of APB due to its versatility. If LO wants every weapon to be dangerous in its own right, they'd balance around the N-tec. But they currently seem to want APB be an expanded rock-paper-scissors (a prime reason why this game won't appeal to too many Players outside this population). So they'll nerf N-tec to achieve a loadout-emphasized game. Yeah, OBIR rewarded faster & more fluid gameplay but as always shown, LO seems to be heavily against quick switching. So they applied the flag that prevents switching during firing on Sept. 19, 2020. They might've made things better another way but they chose the lazy way. They do plan on revisiting all weapons, so let's see if they make things at least consistent and functional throughout.

I couldn't agree more with this statement. Spot on.

Beautiful argument but it is out of place, just like the execution of recent changes to APB. - The previous Med Spray was already the best consumable, simply because it only competes with epinephrine that takes twice as long to cooldown (45s vs 90s). - We already asked for buffs but the 'Experts' ended up buffing OCA and nerfing non-meta, amusing isn't it? --------------------------------------------- There is simply no amount of sugar-coating nor beautifully-written dialogues that excuse out of place, sub-elementary execution.

But how will that solve NA's problem? There are numerous days where only 1 Bronze-district is populated... allowing higher-threats to join that bronze-district but not kill Bronzes is just as good as those higher-threats getting in a 4v4 District. It changes nothing.

Consider the drawbacks What kind of game APB would be if we see dethreaters /farting and tbagging Bronzes with oversized-butts? New Players would uninstall faster than ever before

Sad fact but the upcoming engine isn't particularly new. It is only Unreal Engine 3.5, not even 4. It only takes 1 Talented-hacker to crack it, which he/she probably already has the experience to do so from other games. The Engine Upgrade is the better choice here, because the gains from that are more at hand with sustainable results.

Imagine the Premium Extension turns out to be April Fools ----------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for the continued-streak of generosity, LO

It is nice to be nice but when it comes to feedback, being honest is actually the nice thing to do. There is no denying the great service LO did to APB & the bad things they reversed from G1's era, but this doesn't mean one should overlook hard-mistakes that shouldn't have happened. Hearing the community and acting based on that is one thing, listening and doing things proper is another. 'The patch accomplishing what it says' is where the vagueness & disagreements start & they do so heavily. SakeBee said that LO established a "baseline", yet nothing to this date disclosed a single hint nor word about it. That very patch is also all over the place. Strong weapons got stronger (e.g OCA), while weaker weapons got more weak. The changes were simple yet hard so the general-direction towards this baseline can NOT be clearly inferred, further hinting towards that the patch was in fact changing values without thinking and evidently so such a baseline may not even be present. I'll kill 2 birds with 1 stone. For instance: 1 » FAR's spraying accuracy was already in between STAR and N-tec as its previous maximum bloom of 1.45 is already higher than STAR's. The end-result is unquestionable because ALL accuracy related stats between STAR and FAR are identical. The only exception is marksman modifier but the difference in that isn't big enough to outweigh Max Bloom. FAR's rate of fire is also faster so its accuracy-degradation was also naturally faster due to recovery-delay and recovery not doing as much recovery between shots. 2 » APB's active-community is pretty small. I am genuinely interested in the group that asked for a FAR-nerf and how big in size it was compared to us all. Literally nobody asked for a FAR-nerf yet LO "listened" to it from somewhere. Where did the request for this come from and what was the basis for its approval? There is much more to be said but I'll keep it at this, this is already sufficient. ----------------------------------------------------------- I'll only give them the benefit of the doubt because they pulled off a very decent job with reducing the over-tankiness of vehicles. Having High-Burn Fuel equipped or not is actually a valid choice now., but there are no excuses for September 11th patch.. A splendid show of sheer underperformance and inadequate changes 'just because'. Once the New Engine is out alongside marketing APB 2.1, I really hope they pull another patch that changes things for the better, because they won't have a lot of chances at that due to it being late in the Roadmap.

G1 made it 4 shots to kill, it was also modified back in RTW (but that might be too old to be of high interest) Yep, this is golden The Equip Time nerf was certainly good, but was it really "a problem" by September 11th? OP asked this and now it sparks my interest as well, because Shotgun Ray scaling was effectively removed from Live-APB on March 7, 2020, literally just a bit over half a year from the date of change OP is asking about. I've honestly seen much more players speak about shotguns being less consistent than people complaining about JG+Snub, a combination that was so rare which now requires the person to be ultra precise because JG's forgiveness from ray-scaling is gone. #CSGisKingAgain The removal of Ray-scaling was an indirect nerf to JG+Snub, which wasn't even at the spotlight for 9 years. At close ranges, most players were busy just grenading and PMGing. Very, very few attempted JG+Snub & it wasn't common due to the limitations and risks to have a shot at it. Realistically and personally, I'd rather be dead in 0.1s to a capable player than be given false-hope against exactly the same thing during 0.5s, because the current ideals of Weapon Balancing give too much emphasis on loadouts that they literally dictate who wins at what distance. There is no common, consistent way to kill faster than 0.5s within JG+Snub's range, not even at point blank with cj3 Euryale. For this very reason, I would also agree with Snub having an equip time of 0.3-0.4s not only to be more consistent with other secondaries, but also because this way I get to spawn faster. This change makes sense on paper but all it does is slowdown the flow of the game because its foundation of having loadout-combinations shine at 1 thing makes it the case. 0.1s, 0.5s or anything in between changes absolutely nothing within JG+Snub's range because that is how currently APB is. If I allowed a JG+Snubber to get close, per APB's rules, I must go to the respawn screen. OP has a point, all things considered, SNR-switching being a problem is highly debatable. I would say that LO's current value of 0.5s Equip Time doesn't fix what they claimed to be "a problem". Snub should never have an equip time higher than 0.5s due to what you have said but then again this "problem" won't be fixed if Snub doesn't go above 0.5s. So why just slow everything down then? When there is no viable solution, the better course of action is to simply go with what yields faster gameplay till ALL weapons are balanced as a whole. ------------------------------------------------------- Bonus: Putting that 9-year timeframe onto the table, fairly recently, players like the streamer Darleenko (famous in EU) did JG+Snub every now and then and even for him, it wasn't consistent at all (I ARRESTED him on stream after he killed someone with JG+Snub but didn't work when he attempted to chain it against me in 2.1's beta). On another hand, Smothery (famous in NA) did Dogear+PIG. Magically, both tactics suddenly became the spotlight and got nerfed, despite all the risks involved in getting them to work... after famous players bringing attention to options in the game that WERE KNOWN for years, they simply get nerfed. Interesting, hmm?

Still not addressing what OP wants addressed. The video clearly shows the link to September 11th patch on the bottom-right corner and specifically talks about the change that happened on THAT patch, the 3-shot buff that happened afterwards didn't even take place on that date. The buff is more so irrelevant because it has no connection to SNR's switching-finisher capabilities. I've already said this.. And that's false, SNR became a meme since G1 nerfed it to give way to Nano's Joker Mystery Box. It is a meme that falls under the umbrella of 'Money'sFirst'.

Except you didn't address it right but sure. Btw, Colby SNR was a meme because G1 killed it as a standalone weapon & was in need for a rebuff, not because of the JG+Snub combo.

It seems you completely misinterpreted a crystal-clear sentence: "having Snub nose's damage tweaked a good while after increasing its equip time". There is zero% comparison here between which Snub-nose version was better for the game. The concern here is the fact that Snub's damage buff could've happened on the same patch it got its equip time increased. More so since patching weapons is harder on the current engine (according to Kyouki), it would've also been wise to do so right then and there. It was too simple and didn't really need 2 subsequent patches to be approved. Nice shadow-response btw, it would've been nice, ethical and more professional if you quoted directly.

This episode? Yes, it was fun to watch: One most certainly can polish a turd, but the phrase itself is used as an idiom to convey a bigger meaning.

Precisely. Whatever ideas they have about weapons and consumables (looking at you Med Spray) are always either one of the 2 extremes, either too strong or useless. They just never agree at having things at the middle where a scale would actually be somewhat 'balanced'. Yes, yes, it is easier to change things on the New Engine. But since LO is going for IMMEDIATE-marketing after the New Engine is out, core gameplay should at least be somewhat acceptable and thus, not delayed. Irrespective of 'omg, it is too much work to do so right now' (but it wasn't too much work to buff OCA & Med Spray, having Snub nose's damage tweaked a good while after increasing its equip time and nerfing LTL, now was it?) I like the fact that LO is much more transparent in comparison to G1, especially when it comes to MattScott posting news and updates. But I don't see any momentum in respect to Frosi's Weapon Balancing Sheet. And no, I'm not expecting changes overnight, but after the outright pathetic-reasonings in (https://www.gamersfirst.com/apb/news/2020/9/11/weapon-balance) it would be nice for LO's TRANSPARENCY to happen again and have whatever they are planning next to be openly discussed. Simply because APB shouldn't be attempted to afford another tournament of District-A & District-B changes after 2.1 going Live nor another weak-attempt at balancing the game when it is at peak-exposure to the gaming market.

But LTL was never touched 4 years ago? You can't even troll right. You don't belong in the forums.

I'd like to see you quote that, if you can.

This game doesn't need any more Pay4Advantage, things like the RFP-Fang back in the day did enough damage in that regard, even without being close to the peak of 'different functionality'. And no, even with ARMAS-weapons being available in the Joker Store in exchange for Joker Tickets, it would still drive New Players away because farming Joker Tickets takes time. So this will be another reason for Newcomers to not bother with the game. ARMAS should become cosmetic-only if APB ever wishes to have a shot in the gaming market.

Very interesting coming from the person who wanted LTL nerfed. Meme of the century.

If LO wishes to keep the current, epicly generous cooldown of 45 seconds, then: Make Medspray spawn an actual hand-held item (like blowtorch). Doing this makes Medspray a self-healing blowtorch with the following gameplay-requirements: 1 - Must hold down left-mouse button to heal (as if injecting one's self with a syringe), effectively not allowing the user to fight when healing but also not forcing them to stay still during it (yay, no sitting-2-heal objective-like animation required). 2 - Must know when is the best time to stop healing and start re-equipping a weapon, because weapon re-equip times can easily mean death. Ultimately, medspray will become something meaningful to use when fighting enemies that are about... 4.5+ seconds apart? But it won't work as good in a 1v1 scenario. [And yes, the x2 heal rate should go down. Perhaps to x1.25, else people will just keep self-healing till they find a good opportunity to attack, which would be super lame] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Otherwise, completely revert the x2 heal-rate buff or better even just remove the consumable from the game.

After for sure and you are perfectly in the right, it indeed was a Band-Aid fix at the time (like most fixes in APB). By default, games that segregate threats or attempt to classify players will have smaller total population in general, especially when such classifications are made too obvious & the community makes it the prime center of focus. Indeed, that's the recipe they went for because they didn't properly assess the downsides and underestimated the potential damage to the population. That decline would've been less sharp if instead 50v50 Districts remained rather than the current 40v40 + threat-segregation. Friends and Clans wouldn't have been forced to be separated as much and more importantly, matchmaking would've had more people in the pool to work with per district, so more chances to see different faces after pressing 'K' and the need for phasing at the present moment wouldn't be as high as it is right now. This should indeed be looked into for a better than just a Band-Aid fix if population starts booming again (ideally sooner). While Phasing should help with the matchmaking aspect and appeal to two-parties, the first being those who think 40v40 is the perfect size and the second being those with old computers. A strong player won't easily be a companion to a Newcomer-friend who is yet to learn the ropes & ends up with a low-threat when playing solo & trying to progress (of course, Clans will naturally be affected as well). While Players must be somewhat competitive in APB to win matches, this degree of separation was never needed as threat in APB is meaningless & currently doesn't impact any kind of seasonal ranking rewards like in other PvP games. If there is something APB is yet to get over and beyond to improve in the market of games, it is leaving Band-Aid fixes (especially Weapon Balancing). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ The only issue is that Jericho's current population may dip further (and so will EU's) if threat-segregation is removed again because that alone is not enough. A proper-reversal should be scheduled WITH the Global Merge with the new Engine. It can neither be before nor after, has to be released with it to be most effective & is the current major point of concern. Because according to the latest roadmap post by MattScott (that clearly states APB will be pushed for a round of marketing BEFORE enhancing New Player Experience, weapon Balancing, etc..), we already know things are set in stone for this to not happen in the best way it can happen at, if it happens at all.

That would be interesting Problem is that anyone can join an instance that ignores threat. So it makes lives easier for Dethreaters. Dethreaters will go there with 0% risk of getting themselves reported as dethreaters in the main-districts.

Yes, these things contributed in lowering the population, over a long period of time. But the patch that specifically removed threat-segregation on a temporary basis dropped player counts significantly in a short amount of time. I personally enjoyed that period where I got to have a go at dethreaters, knowing they had no place to run away to... no Bronze-district to feast on Newbies in without getting what they deserve. As much as I'll enjoy that again, removing threat-segregation is still bad for the game.