Balanced Shotguns: how are they?

[Nemoss 2]

Pre-patch shotguns were balanced perfectly, maybe JG needed some love. With all these balance patches game becoming more unbalanced and weapons more sutiational and less allround. Now im 100% sure they gonna nerf shotguns to 5m 2shot range no aim garbage for bronze. Old shotguns was hard to use(cqc raingun) but very rewarding.

[Rikard86 32]

I found out that shotguns (and shotgun users) react very bad to percs, since they completely negate their cover advantage.

But yeah, shotguns are supposed to be good at CQC, so it doesn't make sense to complain about that aspect.
What is worth complaining about is that partial hits are often hard enough to barely 2-shot you, meaning that you take one shot and think you just got grazed, then the second shell comes in and BAM you're dead. Opposite is also true, you think you scratched your opponent, somebody finishes them off, and you find out that you dealt them over 500 damage.
That's very misleading and gives the impression of a luck based weapon, which is infuriating. The pellet mechanic has to be tuned so that damage is more evenly spread, because dealing 80% of your max damage by hitting 50% of your pellets is wrong.

That, and out of range kills.

Edited August 22, 2018 by Rikard86

[dett2 64]

39 minutes ago, Nemoss said:

Pre-patch shotguns were balanced perfectly, maybe JG needed some love. With all these balance patches game becoming more unbalanced and weapons more sutiational and less allround. Now im 100% sure they gonna nerf shotguns to 5m 2shot range no aim garbage for bronze. Old shotguns was hard to use(cqc raingun) but very rewarding.

yes , they were good in CQC.
Now no skill newbie can get kills , they are GOD in CQC. Edited August 22, 2018 by dett2

[Noob_Guardian 418]

1 hour ago, dett2 said:

yes , they were good in CQC.
Now no skill newbie can get kills , they are GOD in CQC.

oh no new players have a chance against vets now? How horribly frustrating it must be to get killed by a lowly bronze.

[dett2 64]

5 hours ago, Noob_Guardian said:

7 hours ago, dett2 said:

yes , they were good in CQC.
Now no skill newbie can get kills , they are GOD in CQC.

oh no new players have a chance against vets now? How horribly frustrating it must be to get killed by a lowly bronze.

Newbie means its me , I'm using JG and be a GOD. 

[Poque 25]

8 hours ago, Davess said:

Everyone is knee jerking about the shredder , which is going to cause it to fade into obscurity once again. Shotguns are buffed but in real situations its not like your invincible

The real situation my dood is that they should not buff the damage and range of a already strong weapon because it has hit-reg issues,the shotguns were decently-fine before,and yes the shredder is way out of its league.

[PogoTheClown 51]

17 hours ago, Noob_Guardian said:

19 hours ago, dett2 said:

yes , they were good in CQC.
Now no skill newbie can get kills , they are GOD in CQC.

oh no new players have a chance against vets now? How horribly frustrating it must be to get killed by a lowly bronze.

this aint it bro

[skerblerd 24]

just avoid CQC you idiots lmao
dont even show up to attack the close quarters points haha

[foolish ninja 59]

Should revert it back to pre balance update.
Buff slighty the damage of csg and jg (like +50)
Buff Shredder overall
Buff DoW damage and range
Buff Strife rate of fire

Btw, are shotguns not having bad hitreg because of the amount of pellets its firing? Im just wondering if thats the issue.

[Clandestine 390]

13 hours ago, Jaiy said:

22 hours ago, Davess said:

Everyone is knee jerking about the shredder , which is going to cause it to fade into obscurity once again. Shotguns are buffed but in real situations its not like your invincible

The real situation my dood is that they should not buff the damage and range of a already strong weapon because it has hit-reg issues,the shotguns were decently-fine before,and yes the shredder is way out of its league.

Their next logical step would be lowering HP of people with shitty net or high ping

[Fortune Runner 796]

22 hours ago, Nemoss said:

Pre-patch shotguns were balanced perfectly, maybe JG needed some love. With all these balance patches game becoming more unbalanced and weapons more sutiational and less allround. Now im 100% sure they gonna nerf shotguns to 5m 2shot range no aim garbage for bronze. Old shotguns was hard to use(cqc raingun) but very rewarding.

Actually they were not I could kill them easily. They really were too forgiving. Somewhere between the settings for then and now would be good though. Maybe fine tune every last gun one by one to finish them  up properly?

[stateofthegame 23]

Shotguns have always been a weapon that have rewarded mastery and skill with relatively consistent two-shotting within their effective range.
With this patch it doesn't matter whether you are actually good at 'centre-ing' your shots as the overdamage is so obscene you can 2-shot most of the time even if your shot is totally off.
Alongside this you can now 2-shot up to ~10m-15m which is quite dumb, you can also pick up kills and decent assists anywhere up to ~30m which is incredibly stupid.

tl;dr - shotguns were fine before the patch, now their range and damage is bust

[CookiePuss 5382]

I used to dread the daily 4 shotgun kill activity and now Im just pwning with shotguns.
.... seems balanced to me

[SK4LP 62]

and the new JMB is a shotgun ...

[Spaghettio 7]

4 hours ago, UpholdThePeace said:

Shotguns have always been a weapon that have rewarded mastery and skill with relatively consistent two-shotting within their effective range.
With this patch it doesn't matter whether you are actually good at 'centre-ing' your shots as the overdamage is so obscene you can 2-shot most of the time even if your shot is totally off.
Alongside this you can now 2-shot up to ~10m-15m which is quite dumb, you can also pick up kills and decent assists anywhere up to ~30m which is incredibly stupid.

tl;dr - shotguns were fine before the patch, now their range and damage is bust

mastery and skill? its still basically the same just more reliable/lenient in its damage allowing it to be used more in 1v1 cqc no cover situations but hit-reg is still an issue 

before the patch the jg and csg was rather mediocre only falling into the category of corner/hallway camping besides that it was great for abusing bad players due to its peak mechanic whether you use a car or whatever else for cover

besides that 2 shots 15m is a bit of an exaggeration even if you had ir3 on a csg for example i'd love to see you test that for yourself
and 30 Meters for a JG&CSG? ROFL might aswell pull out your secondary jesus getting a +10 or 20 assist at 30 meters with a shotgun op op

Alright all memes aside trying to be actually constructive somewhat
how about a slight damage nerf for initial pellets for the csg/jg? this seems to be the main complaint in this thread and it is a valid one 
regardless there is already a change in OTW for pellet damage for the jg&csg along with fire rate for the csg   

On 8/22/2018 at 1:21 AM, TheFakestOfFakeGolds said:

I read about them just now and already saw the Shredder is broken... but what about other shotguns? I can't seem to find a detailed post...

I read now the pinned post on Social, but am unsure if it's the balance already in effect or an additional one that isn't live right now

Overall it looks like this thread derailed into a complain about shotguns thread without anybody actually answering the OP question 

Current state in my eyes
CSG: Probably better than the JG tigher spread/more range
JG: Strong 
both the CSG and JG seem to do a bit too much initial pellet damage causing deaths from lag or pellets clipping your hitbox behind cover along with
decreasing the required accuracy to get good damage in

Shredder: OverPowered
DOWThumper: i think its op or pretty strong atleast i've yet to obtain one
NFAS: Meh pretty much the same as before all the changes
Strife: got nerfed could probably use a range buff

Besides that the OTW 8/17 BALANCE CHANGES havn't gone live yet Edited August 24, 2018 by Spaghettio
Fix

[Goldtiger 133]

IMO, the main issue with shotguns is that they do too much damage with stupidly high rate of fire. If they tone down both, maybe the changes will balance out with said nerfs...

I really like the shotgun changes but they're just TOO reliable now. Before, I felt they weren't that reliable... And on top of that, I would always get hit registry issues with them making them even less reliable. But then again, I could just be bad.. lol.

What definitely needs a fix IMMEDIATELY is the SHREDDER and the DOW. Mainly the Shredder but the DOW is honestly broken too (imo).

[vsb 6174]

3 minutes ago, Goldtiger said:

What definitely needs a fix IMMEDIATELY is the SHREDDER and the DOW. Mainly the Shredder but the DOW is honestly broken too (imo).

i agree that the thumper is absolutely broken rn

from the hip its essentially an nfas with way tighter spread and range, and the unique mode (mechanical choke) lets it act like a shredder while in marksmanship mode

tbh its weird to me that the thumper isnt getting more complaints, but i guess the need to manually click every shot and the fact that not many people may have had what used to be a very subpar legendary make the shredder more popular

[notHunky 32]

The DOW is fine. It's just a worse NFAS which is semi automatic, can't be shot out of vehicle windows, and has to be reloaded manually with each shell. It's only saving grace is that aiming activates a mechanical choke and focuses all the pellets into a much tighter area to extend your range a little.

Edited August 24, 2018 by notHunky

[Spaghettio 7]

4 hours ago, notHunky said:

The DOW is fine. It's just a worse NFAS which is semi automatic, can't be shot out of vehicle windows, and has to be reloaded manually with each shell. It's only saving grace is that aiming activates a mechanical choke and focuses all the pellets into a much tighter area to extend your range a little.

• the car window downside is rather minor considering car surfer and even then kinda niche scenario
• reload is a downside i suppose 3.5 reload time compared to the NFAS 2.0 but you gotta take into account that the nfas doesn't have any range which is a big factor
• semi automatic is hardly a downside if anything its player preference
  
  Thanks for the input 

[CookiePuss 5382]

5 hours ago, notHunky said:

The DOW is fine. It's just a worse NFAS which is semi automatic, can't be shot out of vehicle windows, and has to be reloaded manually with each shell. It's only saving grace is that aiming activates a mechanical choke and focuses all the pellets into a much tighter area to extend your range a little.

Actually the single shell reload is a plus when you just need one more hit to kill a baddy.

1 hour ago, Spaghettio said:

• the car window downside is rather minor considering car surfer and even then kinda niche scenario
• reload is a downside i suppose 3.5 reload time compared to the NFAS 2.0 but you gotta take into account that the nfas doesn't have any range which is a big factor
• semi automatic is hardly a downside if anything its player preference
  
  Thanks for the input 

Behold the glory that is Mag Pull 3 DOW.

Literally reloads faster than it fires.
 

[Error_Detection 172]

On 8/22/2018 at 9:33 AM, Frosi said:

Shotguns are still insane and honestly just boring to play against overall.

yup

[JasonFireson 9]

The strife is the real op weapon, the hits registered are easy to land and usually takes two hits even if you only get them with half a shot spray each time.

[TheJellyGoo 343]

13 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

[...]

Literally reloads faster than it fires.
 

Pretty sure that's the case with most guns though?