Are grenades to powerfull in this game ?

[Player1 12]

Well in my opinion the grenades in this game are to strong like they should have less blast radius  and being more skill based.

 

Why we even have 2 of them like is it not better that everyone has only 1 grenade and getting a new one after a 30 seconds delay ? with that method we dont have grenade spammers anymore.

 

Also lets make it like we have only 1 type grenade not like " percs, lowyields, concs".

 

Actually they deal a lot of damage when you ate one of those its like you getting hit from an NHV-R.

 

What you guys think about the grenades ? do you think they need a change or do you want to have them like they are now ?

[neophobia 216]

percs shouldnt have (as high) stamina damage to allow the very skilled pig + perc combos

 

low yields are practically a straight upgrade to frags rn. reducing the blast radius might be a good idea there.

if it wasnt for flak jacket having that giant downside that only low yields "balance" out while ca1-3 basically has none... they could also just reduce count to 2. kinda dumb reasoning but... stuff is a bit more interconnected xd

 

concs as a car counter and frag as the standard ones is kinda cool though. i'm not exactly sure what concs downside was - but i think they are pretty balanced. but - if i could propose a change there, lower the health damage, increase hard damage - make them really antivehicular. would deal with the annoying tank meta - whatever you say, hopping in a pioneer and driving off does not require skill xd nor does having a pretty indestructible radar tower/bait standing around. since this would fuck other cars more, rather nerf the tanks though. (and buff the low end!)

i feel like oneshotting small/sports car with a conc is pretty balanced/reasonable though.

Edited August 25, 2019 by neophobia

[Fortune Runner 796]

if grenades are not timed they are too easy to dodge.

if the player is not skilled to know their opponents aka watching ops closely then they will not notice the grande coming by sight or by lack of gun fire.

 

with those two factors in mind , it is possible for me to dodge golds throwing at me if i am aware of my surroundings enough.

They are fine as is with the current selection of stuff  we have for ourselves and vehicles.

not referring to EMP grenades for an incoming update

[Aeronaut 647]

grenades allow players on the attack to gain access to entries. grenades can kill or severely damage a player to push them back to a less advantageous corner / hallway / etc.

 

the only change i'd agree with is to just change low yields to 2 grenades instead of allowing 3.

[vsb 6171]

23 minutes ago, Aeronaut said:

the only change i'd agree with is to just change low yields to 2 grenades instead of allowing 3.

nerf damage and radius instead

 

realistically low yields are the only grenades that are "too strong", all other types have appropriate balancing

[Goldtiger 133]

To answer the topic question, yes, grenades are too powerful in this game. It's always been annoying to me how focused this game has been on landing grenade hits rather than the gunplay itself (especially in top-tier play).

3 hours ago, neophobia said:

low yields are practically a straight upgrade to frags rn. reducing the blast radius might be a good idea there.

if it wasnt for flak jacket having that giant downside that only low yields "balance" out while ca1-3 basically has none... they could also just reduce count to 2. kinda dumb reasoning but... stuff is a bit more interconnected xd

 

concs as a car counter and frag as the standard ones is kinda cool though. i'm not exactly sure what concs downside was - but i think they are pretty balanced. but - if i could propose a change there, lower the health damage, increase hard damage - make them really antivehicular. would deal with the annoying tank meta - whatever you say, hopping in a pioneer and driving off does not require skill xd nor does having a pretty indestructible radar tower/bait standing around. since this would fuck other cars more, rather nerf the tanks though. (and buff the low end!)

i feel like oneshotting small/sports car with a conc is pretty balanced/reasonable though.

I agree with pretty much all the things here (except for the pig+perc thing but that's not relevant in my post).

 

There's really a couple of things I'd suggest LO do to balance grenades. I'd prefer they don't do all of these but at least some combination of these.

1. Decrease the damage radius of grenades (excluding concs).
   • Grenades have too large of a radius imo. There are many times where I've personally felt like I've gotten a fair distance away from a grenade but still gotten greatly damaged by it. This is especially the case with Low Yields and Percussion grenades. Reducing its radius by at least half will encourage precision.
2. Decrease Low Yield Frag Grenade count by 1 OR nerf Low Yield Travel Speed.
   • Either one of these changes (not both together though) should be a good nerf to yolos, while giving some advantage over regular Frag Grenades.
3. Decrease grenade supply globally (excluding 8-ball, brick, and snowball) by 1
   • Should make grenades more of a tool to get people off of a corner RATHER THAN used as a tool to engage/finish fights -- excluding percs, which are made to do that.
   • Low Yields would at base be 2 grenades, while everything else would be 1.
4.  Remove the -1 grenade count drawback of using Flak Jacket & add a new drawback.
   • Give Flak Jacket a new drawback. This could be:
     • Decreased grenade damage (output).
     • Decreased grenade radius (output).
     • Remove ability to hear grenade ticks (either your grenade, enemy grenades, or both).
5. Decrease damage of grenades.
   • Decrease Frag Grenade damage to 600. (Slightly above Low Yield Damage).
   • Decrease Low Yield Damage to something between 400 and 475 (Slightly above above live Percussion Grenades).
   • Decrease Percussion Grenade damage to 300 (This should make it purely used for finishing players. Spamming it should be less effective).
   • Decrease Concussion Grenade damage to 850, keep hard damage the same. (Should make it purely an anti-vehicle grenade, and serve as an hvr shot in battle).
   • If any or all grenade damages are nerfed, Flak should be nerfed to remove 20% of grenade damage (just because it would be too strong).

Of course, this is just how I would go about balancing grenades. I would definitely not do all of this, but personally would find it better to do #s 1, 2 (yolo count), and 4. If grenades are still too strong after testing, then maybe 5 would be necessary (or parts of 5).

 

I made this post kinda intricate and big so please forgive me if you didn't want a response of this sort.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Goldtiger

[Alani 475]

if u want to nerf something that is meant to explode into pieces of shrapnel, you would have to mess with how much damage it deals to nearby people.

 

nerfing its radius is a stupid idea.

 

better to just lower the amount of health is lost at X distance

[vsb 6171]

5 minutes ago, Alani said:

if u want to nerf something that is meant to explode into pieces of shrapnel, you would have to mess with how much damage it deals to nearby people.

 

nerfing its radius is a stupid idea.

 

better to just lower the amount of health is lost at X distance

you say that like current grenades don’t have various radii 

[crusade 89]

As other people have mentioned, I think grenades are fine except for low-yields.

 

The ONLY downside to low-yields is the 175 less soft damage and 132.3 less hard damage compared to regular frags. Which is made up for by having 50% more grenades. On top of that, they are locked from newer players. I remember discussing this same stuff about low-yields YEARS ago. Everyone with more than -37 brain cells were aware low-yields were stupid, but obviously they were never changed.

Edited August 25, 2019 by crusade

[TheMessiah 430]

Grenades power is not the problem.Problem is that players spam nades like crazy tryn to get easy kills.After that coming on forums and start bitching how this and that weapon is too OP and need to get nerfd..

[LilyV3 323]

well not really by themselves, except maybe yolos, but I think the major issue was adding the consumable ammo box and makign reammo available at more than just ammo boxes. This made ammo and grenades too omnipresent everywhere.

Earlier you had to use the car ammo supply whcihw as a tactical elemebt opponents could destroy, or the personal ammo mod, which had a cooldown and made the user immobile during usage.

But the fire and forget ammo box everywhere with every carspawner granting grandes was too overkill in my opinion.

 

 

10 hours ago, neophobia said:

percs shouldnt have (as high) stamina damage to allow the very skilled pig + perc combos

 

low yields are practically a straight upgrade to frags rn. reducing the blast radius might be a good idea there.

if it wasnt for flak jacket having that giant downside that only low yields "balance" out while ca1-3 basically has none... they could also just reduce count to 2. kinda dumb reasoning but... stuff is a bit more interconnected xd

 

concs as a car counter and frag as the standard ones is kinda cool though. i'm not exactly sure what concs downside was - but i think they are pretty balanced. but - if i could propose a change there, lower the health damage, increase hard damage - make them really antivehicular. would deal with the annoying tank meta - whatever you say, hopping in a pioneer and driving off does not require skill xd nor does having a pretty indestructible radar tower/bait standing around. since this would fuck other cars more, rather nerf the tanks though. (and buff the low end!)

i feel like oneshotting small/sports car with a conc is pretty balanced/reasonable though.

 

yeah that evil 10m combo, soooo bad, seriously it's a lousy tiny niche where it works, and you hardly till never see someone using it, if it wre that op everyone would be using it.

 

@Goldtiger spamming percs means 800damage within 1,4seconds + flight time at a verylimited range, so nearly every primary has better dps,

Edited August 25, 2019 by LilyV3

[Ohshii 215]

lol people cry about everything in this game.

 

it's a god damn grenade people not a water balloon. If you get hit by it regardless of what type it is, it will EXPLODE ON YOUR BODY hahahahahah

 

 

god damn snowflakes want nades to explode on them and turn into confetti and rainbows or what hahaha gimme a break ffs  you guys find anything and everything to fuzzy bunny and whine about in this game lololol

Edited August 25, 2019 by Ohshii

[VanilleKeks 737]

I think you gotta keep in mind that this is a third person shooter, which makes holding angles a lot easier. Grenades need to be powerful or the odds of you successfully pushing a lot of spots in the game become very minor (assuming equally skilled opponents). That said, the grenade spam from ammo boxes and maybe the yolos need further thought, luckily this seems to be on LO's mind already.

 

As a good example think of the spot at eva orlandez. It's essentially all corridor entrances, try pushing that without nades against a good enemy. I can agree that it can be annoying to dodge five nades before getting pushed but nerfing them too much would make certain places painfully hard to attack.

Edited August 25, 2019 by VanilleKeks

[Ohshii 215]

^ this.

 

But I get downvoted for speaking the truth hahah people are just soooo sensitive in this game

[MrChan 337]

"Grenades are OP". lol ok kiddo, whatever you say.

 

Can't remember the last time I died to a grenade outside of one or two instances of an opponent hurling a perc on the ground to get a kill that they were too dumb to get with their OCA.

 

Even yolos haven't bothered me all that much lately.

1 minute ago, Ohshii said:

^ this.

 

But I get downvoted for speaking the truth hahah people are just soooo sensitive in this game

Have an upvote to balance it out.

Edited August 25, 2019 by MrChan

[FullHouse 5]

In your opinion, everything is fine with Showstopper and he is in balance, and grenades that allow you to make attacks on campers all of a sudden OP? 
@VanilleKeks - described the whole situation with grenades wel. The number of grenades is your leveling character. As in any other game, a high-level player can offend a beginner player. And this approach applies to all weapons. The difference between a noob with OSCAR and the prof is very colossal.

[Nitronik 348]

4 hours ago, crusade said:

As other people have mentioned, I think grenades are fine except for low-yields.

 

The ONLY downside to low-yields is the 175 less soft damage and 132.3 less hard damage compared to regular frags. Which is made up for by having 50% more grenades.

And higher travel speed
And a flatter travel arc
And faster cooking speed

 

Edited August 25, 2019 by Nitronik
yolos cook faster

[GhosT 1301]

The only issue I ever had with grenades was the percs stamina damage, and of course the low yields. Those shouldn't kill in two hits if they cook that fast. Especially not with the grenade spam consumables, even though that was limited recently.

[crusade 89]

33 minutes ago, Ohshii said:

You dont even know me

Let's keep it that way.

33 minutes ago, Ohshii said:

good job making a shitload of random armchair psychologist statements at me whoever tf you are lol

I wouldn't consider those statements random. It also doesn't take a psychologist to see your posts look like they were typed by a nutjob.

33 minutes ago, Ohshii said:

wait a minute arent you an raov member? Like 1 of the 6-7 raov members who didnt get FF banned on day 1? Yeah I remember you lol. Im glad I left that clan.

Not sure what your deal is, but I'm impressed you even know that much about me.

6 minutes ago, Nitronik said:

And higher travel speed
And a flatter travel arc
And faster cooking speed

Yeah, I was saying the extra nade was a direct counter to the fact that low-yields do less raw damage. But, I suppose I should've mentioned the other upsides of low-yields.

Edited August 25, 2019 by crusade

[Cr0 328]

If it wasn't for yolos I'd vote no. More precisely, the fact that you get 3 of them. Otherwise it'd be fine. But if you changed that to 2, you'd only get 1 with flak jacket. That would perhaps be a bit strange. Perhaps make them the only nades you get to keep 2 of when using flak jacket, because they're light wheight and that. That way you wouldn't have to change the info about them being smaller/lighter etc, or whatever it says exactly. So it would still make sense, plus there would remain sort of the current upside of flak+yolos.

 

Oh and another thing I'd love: If they made it so that percs couldn't explode if the one who threw it was dead when it impacted.

 

Edited August 25, 2019 by SilverCrow

[KnifuWaifu 499]

How about leave them as is, but add a mechanic where if shot while cooking/holding a grenade you instantly explode?

 

Or add in a delay/reload/equip animation to stop them being insta-spammed. (Looking at you percs.)

[Haganu 104]

I feel like the radius of each can be just slightly less. Say, 1m less radius on percs, frags and low yields. I think it would make things just a little more interesting, without nerfing them into the ground.

Concs are fine.

Percs need a stamina damage nerf.

 

I also would like to see smoke grenades, flashbangs, incendiary grenades and even tear gas grenades. It feels weird to not be able to throw molotovs as a criminal. Maybe one day...

Edited August 25, 2019 by Haganu

[Dasimoge 69]

Pff... nades...

Get used to bricks!

[Genobee 143]

Grenade spam is annoying. That's about it really. 

[PitterPatter 139]

Yes, but theres a point to it. The fact that this game is third person makes it almost impossible for someone attacking to win a gun fight unless the defender potato's. Grenades flush people out and away from strong corners. If grenades were weaker it would be more beneficial to tank the grenade and just gun the attacker down.

 

How it is now is when they throw a grenade you throw one as well but at the area they need to come through. All grenades are is area denial and it's great that it works that way. They are powerful, but need to remain so or attacking will be so much harder.