Merged thread - Removal of several reactions

[Sakebee 2270]

I had a bit of a discussion about this change earlier. For context, you guys can find my answers there if you are interested: 

 

[TheJellyGoo 343]

20 minutes ago, Sakebee said:

I had a bit of a discussion about this change earlier. For context, you guys can find my answers there if you are interested: 

 

Quote

[...] Having an explanation if someone disagrees rather than an anonymous downvote makes for a much healthier environment for everyone involved.

Not sure what's healthy about someone saying the earth is flat then ignoring all reason brought forth leading to a pointless back and forth.

Just dropping a "dislike" and moving on seems like a lot less friction. I am just not sure you will be happy with the "community interaction" to come.

[vsb 6171]

29 minutes ago, TheJellyGoo said:

Not sure what's healthy about someone saying the earth is flat then ignoring all reason brought forth leading to a pointless back and forth.

Just dropping a "dislike" and moving on seems like a lot less friction. I am just not sure you will be happy with the "community interaction" to come.

its not like just posting "youre wrong" or "no" is any different from leaving a dislike, and the same people who will refuse any contradicting posts are already making their own posts calling out excessive dislikes as "haters" or "crutch users"

 

i feel like both sides of this are vastly overestimating how much a little red button is going to change this forum when theres only 30 or so active users anyway

[claude 223]

3 hours ago, TheJellyGoo said:

I dislike the change because it enables certain people to reign free. 

people who disagree with your opinions can no longer do so with just a press of a button, which forces people to engage in discussions.

if the person says something dumb like "everyone i play against is cheating, waaah" then they'll get roasted. if someone has a hot take and you disagree with it, you have to engage with the person who disagrees with you, unless you don't care enough to reply to them, then you just move on.

3 hours ago, TheJellyGoo said:

We know words will be met with deaf ears, or per see blind eyes, and "dislikes" were an easy to understand medium for these individuals. 

if you disagree with someone and you aren't willing or able to whip up a reply that supports your thoughts against their opinion, you should really question how confident you really are about your position.

3 hours ago, TheJellyGoo said:

Can't wait to see what happens to the forums when these topics keep spreading and people grow tired of pointlessly replying to those stupid suggestions.

i dont think the removal of a dislike button will change the frequency at which someone accuses half of the playerbase of cheating, accuses LO of banning (name) for "no reason," accusing LO of not knowing wtf they're doing, accusing LO of running the game into the ground, or claims that APB is *OFFICIALLY* dead because <steamcharts link>.

3 hours ago, TheJellyGoo said:

What's left will be all the idiots enforcing each other in their bogus since no sane person will be left over.

it's simple... if you disagree with someone, tell them why, and if the reason you gave them isn't supported by anything beyond anecdotal evidence that seems sorta cringe, then you're probably wrong and they're probably right. the people that relied on a dislike button to express a disagreement with someone will leave, while the people who actually want to discuss apb stuff will stay.

 

3 hours ago, TheJellyGoo said:

Instead of regulating the bad apples and taking away the crayons from the abusers we are left with a doomed carebear system.

so you hate the idea of a dislike button being removed, but you'd prefer to have a dislike button and just banning people who abuse it? how can you tell whether someone is disliking in bad faith? you cant.

58 minutes ago, TheJellyGoo said:

Not sure what's healthy about someone saying the earth is flat then ignoring all reason brought forth leading to a pointless back and forth.

Just dropping a "dislike" and moving on seems like a lot less friction. I am just not sure you will be happy with the "community interaction" to come.

debating a flat earther is the biggest waste of time ever, so what do you do? you ignore it. unless you want to engage in such a stupid conversation, then do it, but if a flat earther comes more prepared to the discussion than you have, then they WILL prove you wrong. there are people who spend an insane amount of time in learning about flat earth theories/conspiracies, which is why they're confident enough to discuss it. if you say to them "lol but what about gravity" they're just gonna own you with some insanely cringe in-depth tinfoil hatter logic that you don't know anything about, so you can't actually prove them wrong without studying it yourself.

 

if you cant ignore people who are super wrong about something, and you have to express how much you disagree with them, you should be able to back up why you disagree with them. if you need to rely on a button for that, you shouldn't be engaging in discussions at all because your input isn't relevant.

Edited September 16, 2020 by claude

[Todesklinge 143]

3 hours ago, ViolaDeWynter said:

@Todesklinge

 

Another problem: You overestimate yourself.

What do you mean with that?

 

I am wrote sincd years about that Clotting Agent is overpowered compared to other modifications. Because 99% of all players using CA.

Do i am wrong with this, so you are talking about?!

 

 

I am talking about cheaters and the real problem with unbalanced weapons, game play and modifications. But i am only getting negative reactions as reward...

*sarcasm* sure i have no idea... because the steam reviews are excelent... and no one is talking about unbalanced weapons etc.

 

Most people can not see a differencd between a real cheater with aimbot or an pro gamer, both can defeat you.

[ColorBauss 74]

15 minutes ago, Todesklinge said:

I am talking about cheaters and the real problem with unbalanced weapons .....

 

.....    Most people can not see a differencd between a real cheater with aimbot or an pro gamer

So can you see the difference?

If not, you're kinda contradicting yourself here, buddy

[Jilleroo 349]

51 minutes ago, Todesklinge said:

I am wrote sincd years about that Clotting Agent is overpowered compared to other modifications. Because 99% of all players using CA.

This is a problem with your mentality.

 

There's 4 green modifications in the game: CA1-3, KI1-3, Flak, and Fragile.

 

Kevlar is bad because mobility in this game is incredibly important and the value of health is weaker than the value of movement speed.

Fragile is niche/bad because it leaves you overly vulnerable to certain match ups and the diminishing return on MS isn't typically worth the cost you're paying to be one speedy boi.

Flak Jacket is niche and costs you a grenade, which is a very high price to pay for arguably one of the most important elements in the game.

 

So that leaves you with CA; which is effective most of the time compared to the rest and the cost is reasonable enough to swallow without too much fuss.

 

Does that make it "overpowered"? I don't think so. I think that makes it the only viable option to run in your kit 95% of the time. That alone doesn't make it broken, just means there needs to be more options or improve the others we already have and make them more viable. This is presuming that LO even wants this to happen.

4 hours ago, Todesklinge said:

I only make very good suggestions!

Ignorance is the big problem in development and community.

51 minutes ago, Todesklinge said:

I am talking about cheaters and the real problem with unbalanced weapons, game play and modifications. But i am only getting negative reactions as reward...

You're self aware, at least on one part at least.

 

If your posts are getting tonnes of negative feedback, maybe stop and ask yourself why. Maybe, just maybe, consider that your view is wrong or not in the best interest of the game as a whole. I'm not saying you shouldn't have these opinions, because that's what having an opinion is all about, but perhaps not reacting with surprise that your opinion is nowhere close to everyone's opinion, so there's going to be a lot of people who disagree with you.

 

And when that's true, they're going to let you know that.

Embrace it.

Edited September 16, 2020 by EvaPooh

[ViolaDeWynter 105]

50 minutes ago, Todesklinge said:

What do you mean with that?

4 hours ago, Todesklinge said:

I only make very good suggestions!

[...]

More and more games dies because they dont hear to my suggestions, i did.

 

This is what I mean.

 

You act so omniscient and you don't even realize how it makes you look like a fool.

[Ketog 1031]

yeah, not sure what's the point of showing likes at all if we can only react with "we like it"

Gives me a "like it or stfu" vibe

Edited September 16, 2020 by Ketog

[ColorBauss 74]

5 hours ago, Todesklinge said:

I only make very good suggestions!

More and more games dies because they dont hear to my suggestions, i did.

You see Todesklinge, I think it's great some people still have the passion to make suggestions that could help this game. And many of them are pretty good as well. No one hates you for it.

But you have to remember, when you post in an open forum people can and will critique what they don't agree with, and you seem to have a real problem with this part.

What you think is unbalanced, or who you think cheats, or what you think the game should do some other way doesn't apply to all the people. And you most certainly aren't always right.

But...

At least you're trying something, and in my mind that counts for something. So uhh.. keep it up I guess. Keep suggesting things and one of these days you'll come up with a real good one and maybe it'll even be in the game.

Quote

Can you add Headshots etc to give the game more options to defeat the opponents?

But damn that day sure isn't today, Todie.

Edited September 16, 2020 by ColorBauss

[Talla 84]

APB has trained me to grow a thick skin

and I am grateful for it.
 

I don't care about the removal,

but I'm wary about progressively "gating" the game experience.

Teaching people to properly channel their emotions is the real solution, not protecting the "entitlement to feelings".

Disliking something & harassment are different things.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Talla

[Bambola 379]

I get it, it is because this community is all about love and gratitude.  

 

Actually, it is utter nonsense. It's even a bit repressive, one is allowed to agree on something yet disallowing is forbidden. A disagreement, even through a reaction only, defines our individuality as much as openly stating an agreement. What they should have done instead is bringing back non-anonymous reactions or removing reactions all together.  

Edited September 16, 2020 by Bambola

[Darkzero3802 611]

On 9/15/2020 at 7:47 PM, EvaPooh said:

I really appreciate the change to the post reaction options; gets rid of a negative aspect of using the forum that petty people would use a lot for wrong reasons. Was funny to see a bunch of random posts of mine getting dislikes by a super salty boi tho. Hopefully people will start writing out why they disagree now, but I somewhat doubt it.

 

Either way - good change! +1

Agreed. Too many salty forum warriors disliking anything and everything, which only showed the lvl of toxicity this community has.

[MeanBetsy 24]

Unpopular Opinion: I think it was necessary since the toxic APB community can't even be trusted with a dislike button lol. You can tell if the community truly dislikes something by observing the comments, dislikes just enable trolls to be trolls without even reading the post while staying anonymous.

 

I think everyone is overreacting to this change, especially since other social medias do the same thing and people/ideas can still get negative backlash. I get it, it's a feature that some of us used - I understand that we don't like having stuff taken away from us but at the end of the day comments are more powerful and telling anyway. This change encourages the people that dislike something to say specifically why they dislike it instead of just pressing a button. Some people might say "why not just remove reactions all together?". You don't really need to communicate what you like about a post or why you're saying thanks about something, but if you have criticism for something then it's better to voice it so people can assess themselves and others better. A dislike button really doesn't communicate anything at all besides "I disagree" which helps no one and won't convince an opposing view point.

 

Merged.

 

On 9/16/2020 at 9:03 PM, Talla said:

APB has trained me to grow a thick skin

and I am grateful for it.
 

I don't care about the removal,

but I'm wary about progressively "gating" the game experience.

Teaching people to properly channel their emotions is the real solution, not protecting the "entitlement to feelings".

Disliking something & harassment are different things.

You do bring up an interesting point, but here's the thing: while it may have helped you grow thick skin and properly channel their emotions, the rest of the community hasn't grown up at all. I'll be honest, the majority of APB players (retired and active) are like worse than sweaty CoD and CS players. Also, I don't think it's not up to the game to teach someone how to properly channel their emotions. That just comes with just wanting to be a decent human being. Another thing about people is that you can't trust/expect them to do the things that require them to learn from their mistakes - 9/10 times they won't. Why? If you never cared about being a decent human being to other players then you won't care to learn how to channel emotions either.

[Todesklinge 143]

13 hours ago, ViolaDeWynter said:

 

This is what I mean.

 

You act so omniscient and you don't even realize how it makes you look like a fool.

You dont answer me, but starting an re attack on me.

Nice.

 

 

Yeah thats right how bad some of the community are, if they defending Clotting Agent.

 

So that means that max up to 10 players they dont understand what i am wrote, they are representate to the full community of APB?

[Alani 475]

It's pretty telling how majority of the people claim 'lol if u cant reply with FACTS AND LOGIC on why someone opinion is bad then lol cry more hehe i stick to my echo chamber'

 

 

No one is required to share their thoughts on anything, and no one is required to offer their 'CONSTRUCTIVE FEEDBACK' especially when majority of the 'mass red downvote threads' were from people saying nonsense things like "GOLD PLAYER EVIL WAAAA" and "AIMBOT CHEATER EVERYWHERE"

 

The 'downvote' button is literally just for people to see a thread and go 'what the fuck kind of thread is this' and then move on.

 

Now it seems like they want to promote more people to post onto a thread just to tell someone 'your opinion is really stupid and you should probably look again' and it will just cause more insulting sprees or more people crying about how 'WUWUWU U ATTACK ME INSTEAD OF TELL ME FACT AND LOGIC'

 

this is a video game forum, not a ben shapiro/liberal owning forum. If someone's opinion is seen as stupid, people will tell them its stupid whether or not they care to elaborate as to why or not. The downvote was just a simple "yeah no thanks bye" reaction so they didn't have to post to share their opinion.

 

 

And its pretty obvious what is going to happen in the future. Considering the LO staff are literally going into a circle and repeating G1's stupidity.

 

So good luck lmao.

[wHisHi 206]

1 hour ago, Alani said:

It's pretty telling how majority of the people claim 'lol if u cant reply with FACTS AND LOGIC on why someone opinion is bad then lol cry more hehe i stick to my echo chamber'

 

 

No one is required to share their thoughts on anything, and no one is required to offer their 'CONSTRUCTIVE FEEDBACK' especially when majority of the 'mass red downvote threads' were from people saying nonsense things like "GOLD PLAYER EVIL WAAAA" and "AIMBOT CHEATER EVERYWHERE"

 

The 'downvote' button is literally just for people to see a thread and go 'what the fuck kind of thread is this' and then move on.

 

Now it seems like they want to promote more people to post onto a thread just to tell someone 'your opinion is really stupid and you should probably look again' and it will just cause more insulting sprees or more people crying about how 'WUWUWU U ATTACK ME INSTEAD OF TELL ME FACT AND LOGIC'

 

this is a video game forum, not a ben shapiro/liberal owning forum. If someone's opinion is seen as stupid, people will tell them its stupid whether or not they care to elaborate as to why or not. The downvote was just a simple "yeah no thanks bye" reaction so they didn't have to post to share their opinion.

 

 

And its pretty obvious what is going to happen in the future. Considering the LO staff are literally going into a circle and repeating G1's stupidity.

 

So good luck lmao.

No.

and you can reply same to others, just by saying no.

Edited September 17, 2020 by wHisHi

[Alani 475]

25 minutes ago, wHisHi said:

No.

and you can reply same to others, just by saying no.

Moderators have said replying to threads with one word or two is not allowed and they'll be removed.

So no, that wont work.

[AsgerLund 1271]

42 minutes ago, Alani said:

Moderators have said replying to threads with one word or two is not allowed and they'll be removed.

I can confirm this statement.

[wHisHi 206]

16 minutes ago, AsgerLund said:

I can confirm this statement.

Lets try

1 hour ago, Alani said:

Moderators have said replying to threads with one word or two is not allowed and they'll be removed.

So no, that wont work.

Ok

[RespectThis 121]

3 hours ago, Todesklinge said:

You dont answer me, but starting an re attack on me.

Nice.

 

 

Yeah thats right how bad some of the community are, if they defending Clotting Agent.

 

So that means that max up to 10 players they dont understand what i am wrote, they are representate to the full community of APB?

Just because a large majority uses both clotting 2 and 3 does NOT make it overpowered. Just because you can't handle going against it doesn't make it broken. Maybe try not using Kevlar 3 like you claim you do? They're always going to be full health before you can get to them *facepalm*. Also just so you aren't confused yes i am defending clotting agent. Also Im not a bad player at all.

 

On the topic of this thread its a shame that dislikes got removed. Its a way to show how you feel without replying. Sure it could be used to troll but i'd like to think it wasn't abused that badly. Also so i can downvote post like the one i quoted since nothing comes from said quote besides showing the lack of gameplay knowledge or reasonable points as to why something should be changed. 
 

Would much rather have a dislike button with the chance of trolling than said people making mind numbing posts that i and other members of the community can't downvote because we disagree.

Edited September 17, 2020 by RespectThis

[ViolaDeWynter 105]

4 hours ago, Todesklinge said:

You dont answer me, but starting an re attack on me

 

Obviously you did not understand me.

Instead you feel attacked and confirm what I wrote yesterday.

 

So I refrain from further discussion and wish you a nice day.

 

[NotZombieBiscuit 3146]

Even less of a reason to ever react.

 

Merged.

 

On 9/16/2020 at 5:07 PM, PepeHands said:

This isn't Reddit. The only thing that downvoting accomplishes is making people feel bad for stating their unpopular opinions which often reflect the hard to handle reality

Or letting people know that they think wrong and shame them.

[Queen of Love 452]

On 9/16/2020 at 1:47 AM, EvaPooh said:

I really appreciate the change to the post reaction options; gets rid of a negative aspect of using the forum that petty people would use a lot for wrong reasons. Was funny to see a bunch of random posts of mine getting dislikes by a super salty boi tho. Hopefully people will start writing out why they disagree now, but I somewhat doubt it.

 

Either way - good change! +1

welcome to club

 

i would love read a nickname near the up/down vote.

[TheJellyGoo 343]

21 hours ago, claude said:

people who disagree with your opinions can no longer do so with just a press of a button, which forces people to engage in discussions.

if the person says something dumb like "everyone i play against is cheating, waaah" then they'll get roasted. if someone has a hot take and you disagree with it, you have to engage with the person who disagrees with you, unless you don't care enough to reply to them, then you just move on.

Yes, that's what I denounced the change for since you could move on by leaving a "dislike" without having to engage into a pointless discussion.

There is to differentiate between a discussion of value where it is a matter of opinion (both parties have a valid perspective) and then the "discussion" where one party is simply wrong. 

The latter is the one which got usually shot down by dislikes and perceived as harassment by the creator when they could simply not handle their own ego.

That is not an abuse of the system but just people growing tired talking to a wall.

Quote

if you disagree with someone and you aren't willing or able to whip up a reply that supports your thoughts against their opinion, you should really question how confident you really are about your position.

Completely missed the point. I said it doesn't matter how fundamentally correct your reply is and how supportive your arguments are when they are simply being ignored.

I know what you're getting at and and I generally agree with you under the pretext that both parties can hold a discussion while being open to reason.

e.g. how do you handle someone that always thinks they are right?

Quote

i dont think the removal of a dislike button will change the frequency at which someone accuses half of the playerbase of cheating, accuses LO of banning (name) for "no reason," accusing LO of not knowing wtf they're doing, accusing LO of running the game into the ground, or claims that APB is *OFFICIALLY* dead because <steamcharts link>.

 

it's simple... if you disagree with someone, tell them why, and if the reason you gave them isn't supported by anything beyond anecdotal evidence that seems sorta cringe, then you're probably wrong and they're probably right. the people that relied on a dislike button to express a disagreement with someone will leave, while the people who actually want to discuss apb stuff will stay.

Could be that you're right, maybe there won't be a change but I think that individuals that see themselves approved by only receiving "likes" when all the "dislikes" cease tend to escalate things because there was just no one there to put an end to it. I'm closing in on a decade of surfing these forums and there comes a point where I prefer to click that dislike button instead of typing the same thing for the hundredths time, especially when it is towards the same person. Someone who doesn't accept the result from their last discussion which was to their displeasure and then start anew are not interested in a discussion. Do that often enough and the only people left are the ones that agree. Not because they are right but because they won through attrition.

Quote

so you hate the idea of a dislike button being removed, but you'd prefer to have a dislike button and just banning people who abuse it? how can you tell whether someone is disliking in bad faith? you cant.

Where did i say ban? Simply revoke the rights. It's pretty easy to tell when someone intentionally goes on a "dislike-spree" in someones past comments.

 

Quote

debating a flat earther is the biggest waste of time ever, so what do you do? you ignore it. unless you want to engage in such a stupid conversation, then do it, but if a flat earther comes more prepared to the discussion than you have, then they WILL prove you wrong. there are people who spend an insane amount of time in learning about flat earth theories/conspiracies, which is why they're confident enough to discuss it. if you say to them "lol but what about gravity" they're just gonna own you with some insanely cringe in-depth tinfoil hatter logic that you don't know anything about, so you can't actually prove them wrong without studying it yourself.

 

if you cant ignore people who are super wrong about something, and you have to express how much you disagree with them, you should be able to back up why you disagree with them. if you need to rely on a button for that, you shouldn't be engaging in discussions at all because your input isn't relevant.

Pretty much full circle, what if you do all that?

You come well prepared, your arguments are sound, your sources are valid and scientifically proven, you disassemble their point and show them their flaws.

But instead of progress they repeat the same thing and you're left running circles. That's not a discussion. So, yes, pretty please, a dislike button so one can see at one glimpse that the
overall opinion is that the idea is rubbish.

It could also be that someone else already shot down the argument with points I agree with. So adding a dislike to the main post to support/oppose ads the same relevant input as repeating the same argument in an extra post below. Remove the dislikes and you have no idea about the actual census until fully dissecting the thread.

Edited September 17, 2020 by TheJellyGoo