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MattScott

Fully reverting IR changes.. and why we tried them in the first place

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On 10/19/2018 at 8:34 PM, MattScott said:

Hi all,

 

Just like the title says, I've made the decision to revert the IR3 downside changes with the Halloween patch.

 

For the record, I still feel like the IR3 changes were better -- in most cases.

 

I still feel like the original IR3 implementation ends up with little to no downside. The mod uses set values and not percentages, so players can use that mod to force weapons out of their intended category by extending their range. Changing the mod to be percentage based allowed us to scale the upside/downsides properly.

 

However, "most cases" isn't good enough. Since the changes went live, the design team and I have been trying to solve IR3 on pre-modded Legendaries that players paid for. We toyed with a bunch of scenarios, but all of them create more complexity / variations of the same mod and muddy up understanding how the game works.


Hindsight is 20/20. We should have immediately reverted this months ago when players raised the various issues, and then gone back to the drawing board. Instead, each week it appeared like we had a new solution, so I let the changes stand while we explored each new implementation.

 

My apologies to all the players who were affected.

We'll do better in the future.

 

Thanks,
Matt

As you told, The change of IR was good and LOGIC for balance the game, but organized bad because you have made it without care for the weapon preslotted with IR, without caring for people has made purchase in the past, also present, until now u haven't changed the TTK , weapon description ETC fooling your costumers(that were your biggest MISTAKE)

 

Just make the IR actual change valid for  WHERE IT'S BROKEN, THE ASSAULT RIFLES AND SUB MACHINE GUNS(the weapons of these category with it already preslotted u may have just remove it...)

 

On 10/19/2018 at 9:37 PM, Kewlin said:

BTW, did you consider just halving the downside until you can work out a better one?

The idea seem interesting, but if you make a little calculation, u will come at the conclusion for example a NTEC with IR3, reach the TTK of a obeya/obir that sharing the same range.

 

The idea was good, but IR is broken only for weapons that have as their strongest POINT, his versatility

 

 

On 10/19/2018 at 9:42 PM, Lumshedens said:

my TAS20 Stock would appreciate this

same for obir vladstock, legit!

 

 

Edited by PingOVER9000

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11 minutes ago, Lily Rain said:

How about a hybrid solution?

 

The Raptor Condor's red-silencer-mod comes into effect when 8 bullets are fired with no breaks in between. Doing so breaks the silencer and exposes the shooter on radar.

 

Silencer.jpg

 

The same mechanism can be implemented onto improved rifling in the form of overheat. Improved rifling will initially have no downside, but firing continuously enough to fill the bar can introduce the reduction in rate of fire (or accuracy or any other suitable downside). # of shots-to-overheat should be weapon-specific.

Though a lot of players will argue that this would serve no purpose and just be a weird mechanic, to me it actually sounds like a decent solution so far.  Not sure if I agree with the number of shots being weapon-specific, that could really make it confusing. Unless you'd do it based on the number of bullets in the clip, but that would result in confusing numbers with mag pull.

 

If the information that's visible in-game about the weapons and their stats would be a lot better you could do it based on the amount of shots to kill (taking 75% of that for example).

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Just arrived in Paris for Games Week, so I’m a bit tired, but I wanted to post a quick update.

 

On the Halloween patch we will be FULLY reverting IR3. Both the upside and downside will be going back to the way they were before weapon balance.

 

There was a lot of discussion internally, and I don't think we want to introduce anything ‘new’ until it has had a chance to go through OTW player testing.

 

It was correctly pointed out several times that reverting the downside and leaving the new upside will make IR3 more powerful than it was before.

 

Sorry for the confusion,

Matt

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12 minutes ago, MattScott said:

On the Halloween patch we will be FULLY reverting IR3. Both the upside and downside will be going back to the way they were before weapon balance.

How will this affect the LCR? Given that base changes were made to the weapon to compensate for the IR change.

Edited by Knite

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Every time I start to get comfortable with a change... another change comes along.

Anyways, event should be fun regardless.

 

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1 minute ago, Knite said:

How will this affect the LCR? Given that base changes were made to the weapon to compensate for the IR change.

You mean u don't wanna check if LCR get Competitive or "OP" than?

I'd wish to test it with 18% higher RoF 

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Semi-Unrelated but there's a strange comfort in knowing that the new company running APB can afford to send its CEO to Paris and other places, instead of just a rinkydink rental space above a laundromat or something.

 

I cant explain it tho...

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25 minutes ago, MattScott said:

Just arrived in Paris for Games Week, so I’m a bit tired, but I wanted to post a quick update.

 

On the Halloween patch we will be FULLY reverting IR3. Both the upside and downside will be going back to the way they were before weapon balance.

 

There was a lot of discussion internally, and I don't think we want to introduce anything ‘new’ until it has had a chance to go through OTW player testing.

 

It was correctly pointed out several times that reverting the downside and leaving the new upside will make IR3 more powerful than it was before.

 

Sorry for the confusion,

Matt

it feels good knowing to be heard. thanks!

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25 minutes ago, MattScott said:

It was correctly pointed out several times that reverting the downside and leaving the new upside will make IR3 more powerful than it was before.

baby steps guys, baby steps

 

14 minutes ago, Knite said:

How will this affect the LCR? Given that base changes were made to the weapon to compensate for the IR change.

maybe the lcr will finally be competitive

 

at least until they change rifling again 

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It was a test, it failed, got reverses. Thats fine, its better to experiment a bit and revert it than experiment change for the sake of change and end up with something worse.

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12 minutes ago, HighSociety said:

You mean u don't wanna check if LCR get Competitive or "OP" than?

I'd wish to test it with 18% higher RoF 

 

1 minute ago, BXNNXD said:

baby steps guys, baby steps

 

maybe the lcr will finally be competitive

 

at least until they change rifling again 

I like the changes made to the LCR, but was just looking for some clarification; the changes were made specifically because of IR affecting the PR1/2 LCR variants.

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7 minutes ago, Knite said:

 

I like the changes made to the LCR, but was just looking for some clarification; the changes were made specifically because of IR affecting the PR1/2 LCR variants.

Indeed it was but maybe it's a good thing.

Tbh the LCR was/is  just "good" in the 1-2% niche...

Also it's the really first thing i purchased at Armas some g1c ago 🤗

Edited by HighSociety
changed amount of g1c to some

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3 minutes ago, Knite said:

 

I like the changes made to the LCR, but was just looking for some clarification; the changes were made specifically because of IR affecting the PR1/2 LCR variants.

They had their fire rate buffed to counter the changes IR would make on them, maybe even a bit past the equilibrium of -18%

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1 minute ago, Weeb TheEpicGuyV2 said:

They had their fire rate buffed to counter the changes IR would make on them, maybe even a bit past the equilibrium of -18%

looks like a 1.05s ttk without the ir3 downside, seems pretty balanced tbh considering obeya is .84s and issrb is .9s

 

trading the ease of use (full auto, no effective bloom) for a slightly higher ttk 

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5 minutes ago, BXNNXD said:

looks like a 1.05s ttk without the ir3 downside, seems pretty balanced tbh considering obeya is .84s and issrb is .9s

 

trading the ease of use (full auto, no effective bloom) for a slightly higher ttk 

I looked it up on both apb databases, the old LCR ttk was 1.2s while the current one was 1.27s. Without the fire rate nerf, it will become 1.08s, so you were pretty much spot on

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56 minutes ago, MattScott said:

Just arrived in Paris for Games Week, so I’m a bit tired, but I wanted to post a quick update.

 

On the Halloween patch we will be FULLY reverting IR3. Both the upside and downside will be going back to the way they were before weapon balance.

 

There was a lot of discussion internally, and I don't think we want to introduce anything ‘new’ until it has had a chance to go through OTW player testing.

 

It was correctly pointed out several times that reverting the downside and leaving the new upside will make IR3 more powerful than it was before.

 

Sorry for the confusion,

Matt

That's good

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@MattScottCan LO make a promise that no mods will be ever changed because they are fine? :]

Edited by Ignas / qsn
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20 minutes ago, Ignas / qsn said:

@MattScottCan LO make a promise that no mods will be ever changed because they are fine? :]

that sounds like a stupid thing to promise

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45 minutes ago, BXNNXD said:

looks like a 1.05s ttk without the ir3 downside, seems pretty balanced tbh considering obeya is .84s and issrb is .9s

 

trading the ease of use (full auto, no effective bloom) for a slightly higher ttk 

 

37 minutes ago, Weeb TheEpicGuyV2 said:

I looked it up on both apb databases, the old LCR ttk was 1.2s while the current one was 1.27s. Without the fire rate nerf, it will become 1.08s, so you were pretty much spot on

I always felt the LCR was representative of the drastic difference in RTW TTK and RP TTK, since the LCR is what the RTW STAR was; I always preferred the slower fire rate, but it wasn't strictly competitive. The fire rate of the PR1/2 without the RoF downside is more in line with contemporary weapons, but my main concern here is the Old Glory, since it's quite effective now instead of just being a meme machine.

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Ir1=+%3 range +%5 recoil

Ir2=+%5 range +%7 recoil

Ir3=+%7 range +%10 recoil

My opinion

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