Loitering in a " Action District " yes/no?

[jarko 43]

Hi, @MattScott @Lixil

 

I've noticed something that has been happening quite frequently and i'm concerned about it. I wanted the public opinion about that matter. 

FYI : Keep Name & Shaming out of this discussion.

 

Is it legitimate as a twitch streamer to take upon a casual playstyle in Action District and loiter for hours without engaging into a mission and ruining the capacity of that instance to produce a decent amount of missions against opponents?

 

In my opinion : I think we need people to understand that if you do so you're automatically going to be moved to Social District after a certain amount of time of not queiung for missions.

 

What would be the greatest amount to make them realize that? Using my method stated above  

 

IMO. : 10 minutes of loitering without engaging into a mission against opponents is a good enough time, because our matchmaking isn't made for this low population.

 

*Note* Whenever the instance is filled another instance need to emerge so those that are willing to just casually play can do so in another instance without having a penalty.

 

The game is barely populated at the moment the last thing we need is players taking slots without engaging into the experience that APB Reloaded is meant to be.

 

Regards,

 

*Edit*

 

On 5/14/2019 at 12:25 PM, jarko said:

 

"would be applied to all instances regardless of their playercount " 

  

Obviously it would be unless they would clearly decide to generate one instance of each as a Non-pvp session.  By the same opponent time this would solve your inquiries about the community-organised events & ect. 

 

" stop policing the entertainment of other people."

 

I'm just trying to establish " THE " perfect solution for the playerbase that were having in the moment. You might not see it at the moment but if this is something that grows over the months you won't be able to enjoy the other half of what the district is meant to be made for.. #PVP.

 

Think about the bigger picture...

 

Hope this clarify my point of view a little more.

*Edit / 19-05-15* Reference Page 4

16 hours ago, jarko said:

From the first post i made it sure did sound selfish to ruins everyone fun for my own opinion upon a certain situation.

 

We all have different opinions and not everyone will be happy over it. You can't satisfy everyone.

 

I'm just trying to find an alternative to a problem that could possibly have a sudden impact due to the fact that our playerbase isn't what it was back when the game was released. 

 

As some of you said " i don't know why its a problem now when it wasn't a few years ago "  We just aren't in the same timeframe and need to realize that. Since we aren't probably having the same luxury with our population. You might not see it now but it might be inevitable & then what will it be.. what will we do..?

 

Finding a solution now instead of when it will be too late is better isn't?

 

Have a nice day 

*Edit / 19-05-16* Reference Page 5

 

5 hours ago, Saxtus said:

Back to the topic: This thread's subject is a moot point from the beginning.

 

At first I thought it would be ok to joke about it and lighten up the mood, but unfortunately, people took this forum thread too seriously, and even moderators had to step in.

We are a small community that is getting smaller every day. Stop bickering to each other, become friends and coexist.

 

The poll's question is about kicking those that are loitering action districts:

1. What exactly defines loitering?
   Racing?
   Smashing stores and stealing from pedestrians?
   Hunting bounties?
   Working towards daily Joker ticket objectives that require you to deliver cars or run over a high amount of pedestrians?
   RPing?
2. How will the game be able to detect them automatically?
3. What guarantees, even if such a mechanism is built in the game, that the space that will be made to the district by kicking them, will be filled by people that will be entered in the next mission with them?

Either the original poster didn't think it through, either his intentions are different, and his goal is not such a mechanism to be implemented, but to masquerade his displease about the actions of specific individuals that he doesn't approve.

 

 

I'm glad finnaly someone as brought this up because from that i can realise a little too late that i haven't elaborated my opinion on the matter and just made it look really drastic. If i would of elaborated by the same opponent time my opinion..this topic would of probably then be moved to " Suggestions & Ideas " which would of broken the spirit of having a discussion. I'm glad and not at the same time of what i've seen in this topic but as i mention you can't please everyone and you never will be capable of... 

 

I've been reading every posts that were valuables.. i was just hoping someone would of just ask these specific questions earlier.

 

1. A : What i define as loitering is someone that is not having any apparent purpose.

 

By the contrary racing as Kempington does once in a while is an event with a purpose. I've seen multiple events with cars and i'm not against them. Its actually an event that promote a certain type of activity that entertain an audience.

 

Smashing stores and stealing from pedestrians is a purpose since its a mechanism that was introduced by the developers.

 

Hunting bounties sure is too but yet it isn't as frequent as it can be so.. is it valuable to standby and do nothing while you could probably catch a bounty while being on a mission since of the frequency of it?

 

Your next point, one of them is an achievement so yes obviously its not considering loitering since you are reaching for a specific goal. If the other one would exist then yes obviously since your GOAL is to GAIN a specific kind of currency in game to ACQUIRE something you're wishing to possess.

 

2.A : I certainly don't want any automated mechanism to be involved with this because i doubt that such a thing could judge in a fair way what isn't considered loitering and what is. I think that reporting is quite enough and that it will be investigated by a person with common sense.

 

3.A : There is no guarantees obviously and only time and statistic could tell but i doubt that we have that luxury. 

 

I'm really thankful for your post honestly, 

 

Hopefully this clarify even further my opinion once again,

 

Regards,

 

 

Edited May 16, 2019 by jarko

[Saxtus 497]

This will not be a problem after they implement what Unreal Engine 3.5 will be offering, i.e. the ability to have a global pool of all players per district for missions, etc.

 

Edited May 14, 2019 by Saxtus

[AsgerLund 1271]

No. Some people enjoy player hosted events. Some people enjoy derping around in districts. Some people enjoyED Vegas jumping to hard to reach places, before OOB was implemented.

APB is an open-world'ish game - and one of the most alluring aspects of an open world game is the open world. And this is for many people best enjoyed by not necessarily playing missions 100% of the time while in mission districts.

 

As long as we don't have any districts designed for non-mission activities, auto-kicking to Social for not missioning chase more people away than it will attract.

Edited May 14, 2019 by AsgerLund

[Alani 475]

this would be less of a problem if we didnt decrease district sizes.

 

 

[jarko 43]

2 minutes ago, AsgerLund said:

No. Some people enjoy player hosted events. Some people enjoy derping around in districts. Some people enjoyED Vegas jumping to hard to reach places, before OOB was implemented.

APB is an open-world'ish game - and one of the most alluring aspects of an open world game is the open world. And this is for many people best enjoyed by not being in missions.

 

As long as we don't have any districts designed for non-mission activities, auto-kicking to Social for not missioning chase more people away than it will attract.

Dividing a low populated game will be chasing more people away either way so what will it be..?

[bruised 114]

5 minutes ago, AsgerLund said:

Some people enjoyED Vegas jumping

 

 

 

#shamelessplug

[AsgerLund 1271]

2 minutes ago, jarko said:

Dividing a low populated game will be chasing more people away either way so what will it be..?

Let people have fun the way they want to have fun within the rules set by LO. If you remove the fun for some people, then those people will play less or even leave.

[MACKxBOLAN 427]

 Loitering as you say, is the attraction to the game. If i wanted to play hyper sand box id go get a sandbox shooter. 

Wtf is the point of emotes n cool threads if your just gonna have keep fighting. Missions take up to 20 min, n barely pay enough xp to be worth playing to start with, n i wont go into my opinion about hax. But you would rather i play tryhard all day. Then we can remove double b from the map. N if Social is the only place to go to "Hang Out' Id rather Hang Out on Skid Row, better company

[Saxtus 497]

But we like loitering. It is a lot of fun:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CookiePuss 5378]

While I may not like it, so long as you go after the occasional bounty, or ram raider, or do some ram raiding yourself, it's not breaking any rules.

 

Though I will say if these people had any respect for the game or for their fellow players, they would do these things in any one of the several available empty districts.

Jericho is so low on players, to just take up space in the one populated silver district with plans to do nothing but play with yourself is obviously a banana move... legal or not.

[Weeb TheEpicGuyV2 269]

Let's be honest, we all know you're secretly complaining about a specific individual along with their viewerbase :^)

 

Who said individual is can be up to your imagination

Edited May 14, 2019 by Weeb TheEpicGuyV2

[VanilleKeks 735]

@Saxtus

 

Perhaps if you got 10 players ready for some goofing, go to a gold district? It's not like players outside of your player events are necessary for them to work. I don't see how district population matters for something like that. Looking at the first clip alone, you got some people messing with the physics using a dumpster. Why are you taking up 10 slots or so for something that can be achieved just fine in an empty district?

 

Also "bounty hunting" might be a legit thing to do (albeit useless in terms of value, really), but if you are just standing around doing nothing except sometimes shoot a car to not get AFK kicked, might as well do it somewhere else.

Edited May 14, 2019 by VanilleKeks

[Saxtus 497]

@VanilleKeks 90% of the time we are in a gold district. Original poster didn't say anything about discrimination around district's threat level if I recall correctly. 

[VanilleKeks 735]

1 minute ago, Saxtus said:

@VanilleKeks 90% of the time we are in a gold district. Original poster didn't say anything about discrimination around district's threat level if I recall correctly. 

What discrimination? These days gold district just means empty district and silver means full, really. If you are in a gold district that's fine, but doing it in an active silver district like that one person is, and I quote cookie here:

 

- A banana move

[Yeedman 134]

13 minutes ago, Saxtus said:

@VanilleKeks 90% of the time we are in a gold district. Original poster didn't say anything about discrimination around district's threat level if I recall correctly. 

it's not even only 90%, it's more like 100% tbh
except the rare case when we are driving in asylum xd (where we just try to launch a new, empty instance of asylum and go there)

Edited May 14, 2019 by Yeedman

[Saxtus 497]

Poll asking about "action district", not "silver district". 

[tarma 14]

when so called streamer has his silver army in a district it takes up a lot of slots. he could be wasting 10 slots so the pop would be 30-40 and im not sure about all of you but i hate waiting for opp and missions never took around 20mins unless its creme. its mission district for a reason

[jarko 43]

6 minutes ago, Saxtus said:

Poll asking about "action district", not "silver district". 

Poll is generalized.. i don't know how i could elaborate it to be more simple then that.  ?

[GMTPuck 16]

No, Missions are not the only mode of gameplay in districts, there wouldn’t be ramps if you weren’t supposed to jump them, wouldn’t be fast cars if you weren’t supposed to race around, Dump trucks wouldn’t be able to blow anything in its path up if it wasn’t designed that way. To claim the game is simply a hardcore shooter is selfish. And in most cases these “streamers” (we literally all know who you are trying to call out) are waiting for bounties to pop up while they so call “loiter” you can’t discriminate a player because they are not conforming to your rules on how the game should be played. 

[Narcisse 11]

Pretty sure people should appreciate the fact those people are even there to begin with. 

[tarma 14]

13 minutes ago, Narcisse said:

Pretty sure people should appreciate the fact those people are even there to begin with. 

oh yea appreciate those who make the pop 30-40 and watch people complain about not getting opp. makes sense. and then when they do get opp its after an hour or so waiting. 

 

Merged.

 

19 minutes ago, Officer11 said:

No, Missions are not the only mode of gameplay in districts, there wouldn’t be ramps if you weren’t supposed to jump them, wouldn’t be fast cars if you weren’t supposed to race around, Dump trucks wouldn’t be able to blow anything in its path up if it wasn’t designed that way. To claim the game is simply a hardcore shooter is selfish. And in most cases these “streamers” (we literally all know who you are trying to call out) are waiting for bounties to pop up while they so call “loiter” you can’t discriminate a player because they are not conforming to your rules on how the game should be played. 

its called mission district for a reason. ramps are used to get to a higher elevation to gain control of the high ground around an objective. fast cars are meant to travel to the objective sooner. dumptrucks are yknow the old grieftrucks i remember from 2011. 

[mtz 496]

First and foremost, I'd like to say that it's honestly pathetic how the choices available in the poll are blatantly shaming those who disagree and painting their disagreement as coming from only one position. OP, you could have at least tried to act like you don't have personal bias here. If we're at that level of maturity, you might as well set the options to "Yes" and "No because I'm a stupid doodoo-head".

 

2 hours ago, jarko said:

*Note* Whenever the instance is filled another instance need to emerge so those that are willing to just casually play can do so in another instance without having a penalty.

"Playing casually in another instance" - you're not proposing that to be an option though. You did not propose a bottom limit after which the "10 minutes to get opposed" would kick in. It's clear that the proposed "solution" of kicking players out to other districts would be applied to all instances regardless of their playercount - effectively killing any possibility of freely exploring the districts on one's own.
 

Additionally, kicking out "loitering" players would serve as an active impediment to any community-organised events.

This would kill driving time trials. This would kill any car-related events. This would kill any fighting events (for example, WitchQueen's Snubnose fighting sessions). These are already not officially supported by the game's mechanics - and adding a time limit to playing in an instance when unopposed would only make this even harder to execute than it already is.

 

The truth of the situation is that there is no single correct way to play a game. (And before anyone tries to be silly here - no, cheating is not a valid way of playing.) This is why players and communities create self-imposed challenges, tournaments, and other alternate ways of deriving fun from a virtual world. This basic idea is why speedrunning exists as a whole - gameplay focused on an alternate goal, in a different manner of gameplay.

This thread is advocating for the implementation of a system which kicks out players who do not match OP's definition of "playing the game".

 

To this attitude I would like to give advice: stop policing the entertainment of other people. Kicking them out for not adhering to your idea of playing is essentially as if you were playing with other kids in a sandbox, only to rip their toys out of their hands and scream "THIS IS NOT HOW YOU MAKE A SAND CASTLE! GO AWAY! I DON'T WANT YOU HERE!".

 

(Plus, the issue of them "filling up slots in an instance" 1) implies that their presence is worthless to you [what a wholesome approach, isn't it?], 2) will stop being a problem when district phasing gets introduced in the future.)

[vsb 6171]

both sides have a valid point imo

 

the game is primarily based around missions and taking up slots knowing that it will negatively affect mission players is a banana move

but

one of the core facets of open world games is the ability to interact with the world however you like - even if it’s not the “intended” way, and imo removing that ability will negatively affect the apb experience 

 

this entire “issue” is just a symptom caused by various other factors, while it might take longer (or never happen, worst case scenario) i think i’d prefer to wait for the root causes to be fixed before trying to bandaid the symptoms

[tarma 14]

2 minutes ago, MartinPL said:

First and foremost, I'd like to say that it's honestly pathetic how the choices available in the poll are blatantly shaming those who disagree and painting their disagreement as coming from only one position. OP, you could have at least tried to act like you don't have personal bias here. If we're at that level of maturity, you might as well set the options to "Yes" and "No because I'm a stupid doodoo-head".

 

"Playing casually in another instance" - you're not proposing that to be an option though. You did not propose a bottom limit after which the "10 minutes to get opposed" would kick in. It's clear that the proposed "solution" of kicking players out to other districts would be applied to all instances regardless of their playercount - effectively killing any possibility of freely exploring the districts on one's own.
 

Additionally, kicking out "loitering" players would serve as an active impediment to any community-organised events.

This would kill driving time trials. This would kill any car-related events. This would kill any fighting events (for example, WitchQueen's Snubnose fighting sessions). These are already not officially supported by the game's mechanics - and adding a time limit to playing in an instance when unopposed would only make this even harder to execute than it already is.

 

The truth of the situation is that there is no single correct way to play a game. (And before anyone tries to be silly here - no, cheating is not a valid way of playing.) This is why players and communities create self-imposed challenges, tournaments, and other alternate ways of deriving fun from a virtual world. This basic idea is why speedrunning exists as a whole - gameplay focused on an alternate goal, in a different manner of gameplay.

This thread is advocating for the implementation of a system which kicks out players who do not match OP's definition of "playing the game".

 

To this attitude I would like to give advice: stop policing the entertainment of other people. Kicking them out for not adhering to your idea of playing is essentially as if you were playing with other kids in a sandbox, only to rip their toys out of their hands and scream "THIS IS NOT HOW YOU MAKE A SAND CASTLE! GO AWAY! I DON'T WANT YOU HERE!".

 

(Plus, the issue of them "filling up slots in an instance" 1) implies that their presence is worthless to you [what a wholesome approach, isn't it?], 2) will stop being a problem when district phasing gets introduced in the future.)

Im sorry but if you cant read, before you join it says "mission district" not "lets make it harder for those trying to get opp, get opp" :^).

They can do the same thing in an empty district, not one that is populated for those who enjoy doing missions. 

[jkoh 12]

It can be annoying when players do this, but it is pretty tough to enforce rules like this, even with the 10 minute between mission kicks, players who willing choose to waste slots and not play will just ignore the mission and continue with what they are doing. It really just comes down the the willing choice they make to join the only populated district and mess about rather than do missions. Sad as it is, not much can be done as I see it.