[PC] 05/17 Maintenance Announcement (Build #1385)

[LilyRain 674]

53 minutes ago, Frosi said:

Honestly a good question, I know for a fact that these are all the changes done to the gun, my only guess would be that the marksman modifier has a weird interaction on burst weapons but no, to my knowledge nothing is being ommitted/forgotten here.

Thanks, that would be interesting if it was the case. Thanks for confirmation OP's list of changes.

 

53 minutes ago, Frosi said:

I disagree here, the hipfire penalty from HS3 is much more noticeable than the max bloom of IR3 ever was, not to mention that the benefit gained from HS3 is extremely minimal and sorta puts the Fang in a niche where those who always fire it in marksman may prefer the Fang over the regular RFP while those that still occasionally hipfire it may prefer the regular RFP. But I seriously want to emphasize how minimal of a improvement HS3 is to the marksman accuracy, you'd have to actually pay really close attention to spot which one uses HS3 and which doesn't if that sort of info was not given to the player as part of a test and I do think that is a good thing for a premodded Pistol as in this case it creates a niche and choice between the regular RFP and the Fang where as even IR1 on the Fang would be a direct upgrade to the base RFP and while much less extreme would run the same issue the RFP had when it was nerfed into an unusable state.

And I agree with your disagreement. You are showing that Fang with HS3 has drawbacks compared to IR3-Fang (which is true, HS3 is the lesser of both evils). Fang will surely not be the same at hip-firing, even worse because a mini-OBIR isn't really meant to be hipfired.

I was arguing in favor for pure-RFP. RFP is ultimately losing Marksman Modifier because of HS3-Fang's existence. Players WHO OWN FANG (those who don't might as well not even bother) will have to make a choice on a non-meta-secondary between having slightly better hipfire or better accuracy down range, because it is a secondary and thus doesn't exactly allow attaching/removing modifications. It is just evident that while IR3-Fang shouldn't have existed, HS3-Fang shouldn't either despite being less bad overall.

 

53 minutes ago, Frosi said:

Whether it requires testing or not releasing something potentially overpowered is never a good move, especially for a game with a P2W stigma, its best to undershoot the goal and do a follow up buff rather than overshoot and end up having to nerf it, not to mention that the dev doing these changes only has 5 hours a week so there's little room to iterate meaning that if the goal was to make the RFP really strong and fit right into the meta then no RFP changes would've made it into this patch. This way they can make the gun better instantly without running the risk of it becoming overpowered and then observe its performance in the Live game and consider a small, risk free buff that may be squeezed into next weeks 5 hours dedicated to game balance. I also want to seriously emphasize the risk of only paying attention to a weapons stats to determine how effective it'll be, by that logic the OBIR with its very long ttk would be one of the worst guns in the game but we all know that that isn't the case because of how effective one can play around the burst interval when there's cover involved.

I Agree with the general sentiment but there is still high conservatism that trumps the expected benefits. If the Devs truly only have 5 hours a week, why make multiple iterations (the first being a revert with IR3→HS3 then nerfing the marksman modifier) when you can get a really good rough estimate the first time? Why would it be a problem if for example RFP was 5-7% as good as Colby .45 (whether better or worse, it is still about the same)? Like if RFP becomes substantially faster than Colby .45 or some guy thinks it is somehow worth trying to make RFP as fast as OCA/PMG then sure, that's insane (won't be as insane as that OCA ttk buff months ago, if that was fine to attempt, why this much hesitation on buffing needy weapons?). But neither of these are happening. In fact, the coming RFP is for a fact going to be weaker than the state it is being reverted to. It would be better to spend the 5 Dev-hour-time buffing some other needy weapons/vehicles or outright spending them on future game-features. Please be a BIT more brave when making changes. So far APB isn't really changing.

 

Actually stats define everything. If OBIR didn't have its massive range (which is a stat) it would instantly become a mid-tier if not low-tier weapon. Being able to capitalize on cover is a property most if not all weapons can make use of because APB is a 3rd-person game, it doesn't count as a point for OBIR. In fact, that is why weapons like JG/CSG if close enough (or can get in a car/epinephrine to get close) are quite formidable. They can capitalize on cover but they don't really need cover. JG is CJ2-OCA speed while CSG is pure OCA speed, while not even having to track the target for the entire duration.

Edited May 16, 2023 by LilyRain

[TheMessiah 430]

the next 3 big things im waiting(and most of us)

-new matchmaking/cross district

-new content( 2 contacts)

-new voIP/vivox(yea is one of the big things cause is co op game after all)

After the top 2 things-performance and anti cheat-these are the next top 3.Like when..we will get at least the first one around the 13th anniversary of apb?(end of june)

[Knite 158]

1 hour ago, LilyRain said:

And I agree with your disagreement. You are showing that Fang with HS3 has drawbacks compared to IR3-Fang (which is true, HS3 is the lesser of both evils). Fang will surely not be the same at hip-firing, even worse because a mini-OBIR isn't really meant to be hipfired.

I was arguing in favor for pure-RFP. RFP is ultimately losing Marksman Modifier because of HS3-Fang's existence. Players WHO OWN FANG (those who don't might as well not even bother) will have to make a choice on a non-meta-secondary between having slightly better hipfire or better accuracy down range, because it is a secondary and thus doesn't exactly allow attaching/removing modifications. It is just evident that while IR3-Fang shouldn't have existed, HS3-Fang shouldn't either despite being less bad overall.

There's really no getting around the fact that IR3 made balancing the base RFP essentially impossible; anything that felt good with base RFP would be unequivocally better with the IR3 Fang.

Some of us feel that modded secondaries were a bad idea to begin with, but the cat's out of the bag and there's no getting it back in.

To that end, we looked for a mod that: reflects the spirit of the gun; has some precedence; and still offers a slightly unique experience compared to the base gun. 

We felt HS3 does so without being a flat upgrade.

I would recommend trying out HS3 Fang for a few days before drawing any concrete conclusions.

[PingOVER9000 189]

41 minutes ago, TheMessiah said:

the next 3 big things im waiting(and most of us)

-new matchmaking/cross district

-new content( 2 contacts)

-new voIP/vivox(yea is one of the big things cause is co op game after all)

After the top 2 things-performance and anti cheat-these are the next top 3.Like when..we will get at least the first one around the 13th anniversary of apb?(end of june)

Yes please, I wanna them too  ""ASAP"" please dammit for christmas I want GANG/ CLAN wars... I remind the cow is still damn skinny!!

THAT COW HAS A DISPERATE NEED OF LOVE! (AND CONTENET).. feed the DAMN COW!

[vsb 6171]

42 minutes ago, Knite said:

Some of us feel that modded secondaries were a bad idea to begin with

delete all armas-available modded secondaries, fuck the whiners 

[Reprimand 98]

10 hours ago, PingOVER9000 said:

Yes please, I wanna them too  ""ASAP"" please dammit for christmas I want GANG/ CLAN wars... I remind the cow is still damn skinny!!

THAT COW HAS A DISPERATE NEED OF LOVE! (AND CONTENET).. feed the DAMN COW!

I'm so sorry but why does every post of yours have such inconsistent font size? Do you really need to crank it to the max and minimum? Please friend. Please.

[Temporal 21]

So my Fang is now crappy Golden ACT44 or what?

[MACKxBOLAN 431]

FIX THE JOKER VOICE ALREADY, Why must he be so loud, n why train station announcement so loud.

  Ah tell ya what, never mind. Ill just play on mute n run some music off my phone.

Go steal cuz thats all thats left to do in the game, then buy market guns n resell em for zillions so noone can afford them

[PingOVER9000 189]

5 hours ago, Reprimand said:

I'm so sorry but why does every post of yours have such inconsistent font size? Do you really need to crank it to the max and minimum? Please friend. Please.

Because.. YeS and also because behind the evidencing with inconsistent size, or in a speech it can be substitute with a louder or something make remarkable the tone of the voice,  breaks the attention of sloppy or doubtful readers, it's proved and I proved it from my experience, the most of the people, generally, tend to avoid as possible stressing/drying themself with lectures of others, suddenly incostitent size break the focus or the attention on something else, if manipulated in the right way, it may result in ending with successful business or leading the conservation, anyway I bet you werent asking or you werent interested for this answer but despite that you arrived reading until this point, proving you are a sloppy reader too and what it was incostitent, it was your sarcasm and your simp hypocrisy with your phrase above.

 

Dont be mad about it, I was sort of sarcastic too, we are fair now 

 

2 hours ago, Reprimand said:

15 hours ago, glaciers said:

delete all armas-available modded secondaries, fuck the whiners 

Your takes are usually well met but this is really a bad one. 

 

They just need to revert it to IR1. Or make it open slot? It won't kill the weapon. 

Someone before have already explained you the reason why a secondary with a open slot it's not viable option, because it will need a complete rewok of UI or not sustainable how it's currently scripted.

ofc you are proving  AgAin a second time what I told above 

Edited May 17, 2023 by PingOVER9000

[vsb 6171]

4 hours ago, Reprimand said:

Your takes are usually well met but this is really a bad one. 

preset guns should never be sold for real money, primary or secondary 

 

presets are kind of a trap for new players (lets pretend they exist for a second) or inexperienced players looking to spend money - the lower price and access to level 3 mods are pretty good lures but presets usually do not have optimal mods, and modification and/or weapon balance is subject to change and render presets worthless

 

presets also lead to stupid situations like the rfp, where people whining about "paying real money" for a preset stopped orbit from doing the easy balance move of removing ir3 and instead they ended up nuking the rfp as a whole, over a single preset variant

 

this has been happening for years, all the way back to g1, and it’s probably not going to stop anytime soon seeing as how weapon balance changes are getting more frequent lately

 

[Reprimand 98]

2 hours ago, glaciers said:

preset guns should never be sold for real money, primary or secondary 

 

presets are kind of a trap for new players (lets pretend they exist for a second) or inexperienced players looking to spend money - the lower price and access to level 3 mods are pretty good lures but presets usually do not have optimal mods, and modification and/or weapon balance is subject to change and render presets worthless

 

presets also lead to stupid situations like the rfp, where people whining about "paying real money" for a preset stopped orbit from doing the easy balance move of removing ir3 and instead they ended up nuking the rfp as a whole, over a single preset variant

 

this has been happening for years, all the way back to g1, and it’s probably not going to stop anytime soon seeing as how weapon balance changes are getting more frequent lately

 

This makes much more sense. I rescind my comment. 

[yourrandomnobody74 106]

Almost as if mods which adjust range and accuracy in marksmanship shouldn't exist? All of this is band-aiding the root issue this game has with balancing. 

[Uhtdred 238]

On 5/16/2023 at 2:23 PM, Hexerin said:

The ridiculous sprint penalty (which you conveniently didn't showcase) that was slapped on the gun to neuter its hipfire wasn't removed though.

 

Ya'll need to stop making changes to the RFP by only looking at the Fang. Like holy shit.

 

EDIT: Also, adjust the change to IR1 instead of HS3, or refund the G1C to everyone who owns Fang because fundamental changes aren't something you can just push like this. I purchased the Fang for it having IR, not for it having HS.

I bought the rfp fang and it was nerfed the day after..

I bought the manic and it was nerfed the day after..

never used those two guns again.

[Hexerin 1140]

2 hours ago, Uhtdred said:

I bought the rfp fang and it was nerfed the day after..I bought the manic and it was nerfed the day after..never used those two guns again.

Buffs/nerfs are whatever. If they're taken too far, they can always be pulled back a bit or reverted. That change being made to Fang fundamentally changes the gun. It's not just a stat adjustment for balance reasons, it's a change to the baseline behavior. That's not okay to do without compensation for existing owners.

[Theronguard 20]

Gonna be that one person and say the MOUNTIE YUKON EXISTS PUTTING an END to this pointless convo on RFP FANG....lollll... how bout a marksman buff on the regular variants of Mountie(northwest and nunavut) 0.75marksman mod instead of 0.9. (the yukon is separate by itself don't touch it XD)

[BlatMan 711]

2 hours ago, Theronguard said:

Gonna be that one person and say the MOUNTIE YUKON EXISTS PUTTING an END to this pointless convo on RFP FANG....lollll... how bout a marksman buff on the regular variants of Mountie(northwest and nunavut) 0.75marksman mod instead of 0.9. (the yukon is separate by itself don't touch it XD)

The Yukon's takes too long to draw. You're not hitting that 4th bullet per burst at 40M. It's pointless in its current state.

 

But about the RFP. The changes make no sense. The current issue with the RFP-9 is that it cannot hit a full burst beyond 20M, or even at 10M while firing at max rate of fire. The RFP-9 on the test server is not overpowered. It has a longer ttk than the Colby .45 and FBW, and has less range than the Colby RSA and ACT 44. It doesn't make sense to keep the terrible bloom per shot and slow recovery time on the RFP-9 when buffing the accuracy of the others.

 

The Colby .45 range nerf makes even less sense now that the ACT 44 and RSA have been buffed. '

 

Other thoughts.

 

The OCSP should be increased to 35M or 40M.

The fr0g should be increased to 15M or 20M.

The pistol suppressor should NOT have -1 ammo capacity.

The OCA Nano should have faster draw time.

The Mobility Sling mod should have the longer draw time debuff removed, or replace mobility sling with tagger on all pistols.

Edited May 18, 2023 by BlatMan

[SkittyM 287]

2 hours ago, BlatMan said:

The fr0g should be increased to 15M or 20M.

The current state of the fr0g puts it at 15m, that's sorta what the damage buff and range buff were about.  The biggest issue with the fr0g is that its literally a better FBW but minus the range/mag size.  We tested a flat 20m upgrade and it was basically an FBW replacement.  The current version is better but obviously not what people (or some of us in SPCT) want but, we can't also make the gun an FBW upgrade.

 

I'd actually like a more properly versatile FR0G that's somewhere with the FBW and 45 AP but that requires doing more with the gun than a simple range buff.  Changing the FBW is sort of an option but its a perfectly fine gun, so why change it really.

[Reprimand 98]

1 hour ago, SkittyM said:

The current state of the fr0g puts it at 15m, that's sorta what the damage buff and range buff were about.  The biggest issue with the fr0g is that its literally a better FBW but minus the range/mag size.  We tested a flat 20m upgrade and it was basically an FBW replacement.  The current version is better but obviously not what people (or some of us in SPCT) want but, we can't also make the gun an FBW upgrade.

 

I'd actually like a more properly versatile FR0G that's somewhere with the FBW and 45 AP but that requires doing more with the gun than a simple range buff.  Changing the FBW is sort of an option but its a perfectly fine gun, so why change it really.

The Colby is still too powerful for what it is. Range isn't an issue so much as the rate of fire and quick reload. 

[Aka2k 5]

1 hour ago, SkittyM said:

The current state of the fr0g puts it at 15m, that's sorta what the damage buff and range buff were about.  The biggest issue with the fr0g is that its literally a better FBW but minus the range/mag size.  We tested a flat 20m upgrade and it was basically an FBW replacement.  The current version is better but obviously not what people (or some of us in SPCT) want but, we can't also make the gun an FBW upgrade.

 

I'd actually like a more properly versatile FR0G that's somewhere with the FBW and 45 AP but that requires doing more with the gun than a simple range buff.  Changing the FBW is sort of an option but its a perfectly fine gun, so why change it really.

Why not make it a FBW upgrade? What's the sin on it? I mean, it costs time to grind the JTs to buy it. It would only be fair to make it worth the time spent.

[Reprimand 98]

48 minutes ago, Aka2k said:

Why not make it a FBW upgrade? What's the sin on it? I mean, it costs time to grind the JTs to buy it. It would only be fair to make it worth the time spent.

Frog should be what the colby is and colby should be what the RSA is. 

[Weaboos 89]

Damn, Harbinger is good now. No point to use an Act44...

 

I think Act44 should get it's 10 m range back that was removed some time ago...

[koenyboy500 38]

8 hours ago, BlatMan said:

The OCA Nano should have faster draw time.

 

Ey-yo what the hell? A buff to the primary 'secondary'?

That people can only get by winning the lottery? The very weapon that makes me look at an OSMAW player when I ambush them and realise they have A GUN instead of a (Obeya) Fall Back Weapon?? (pun intended).

I literally go "Oh. He got THAT secondary. Ok then. Guess he has 90% chance to win then." cause imo it's bs that a player who uses a secondary trumps a rifleman/pointman.

[PingOVER9000 189]

12 hours ago, SkittyM said:

10 hours ago, Aka2k said:

Why not make it a FBW upgrade? What's the sin on it? I mean, it costs time to grind the JTs to buy it. It would only be fair to make it worth the time spent.

 

"""in teory""", We have already it.

https://apbdb.com/items/Weapon_Pistol_FBW_PR1

 

Grind gunslinger to rank 3 on taste it by yourself... Anyway jokes aside, the fbw is fine, but maybe maybe the only thing I will very but very slighty change it's make its fire rate per bullet very slighty faster , when I  play in my house in the country, I feel like the relatively slow fire rate (and subtiantaly less ping from cities) make feel harder for my bullets hit my targets while they are moving too... that's a claim I remind about the slow fire rate of FBW also several players have had during the ages...

The FBW bloom increase is pretty manageable if you know how to manage it.

 

@SkittyM Like the Fr0g change, now it seems for real closer to a baby boi born from a groom between FBW and Colby .45, and not a son jumped from a telenovelas between an infedel FBW and from unnamed Jonny, that one deformed from  slum (dont know if in english it has sense or exist similar jokes...)

 

Curious what you are planning or not to do with other secondaries like OCSP,  UL-3 families (bloody mary, hitch  etc), Montie ( "family series" is a mess) or any other secondaries, let us know something pretty please.

 

6 hours ago, koenyboy500 said:

Ey-yo what the hell? A buff to the primary 'secondary'?

That people can only get by winning the lottery? The very weapon that makes me look at an OSMAW player when I ambush them and realise they have A GUN instead of a (Obeya) Fall Back Weapon?? (pun intended).

I literally go "Oh. He got THAT secondary. Ok then. Guess he has 90% chance to win then." cause imo it's bs that a player who uses a secondary trumps a rifleman/pointman.

 

Agree, but Honestly it's the trash especially for the mod, I don't care making the mission nowadays and anyway FBW is better and free.

 

10 hours ago, Reprimand said:

Frog should be what the colby is and colby should be what the RSA is. 

And then what it will happen with the RSA? Send it in the crash can?

get gud 

Edited May 18, 2023 by PingOVER9000

[Reprimand 98]

3 hours ago, PingOVER9000 said:

 what it will happen with the RSA? Send it in the crash can?

get gud 

Please stop quoting me. 

[Uhtdred 238]

revert back all the secondary buffs/nerfs to like they were before in like 2019-2020.

 

we now can buy those secondaries on joker shop, what's the point of not reverting all changes?

 

in the past, some guns were extremely OP, but now you can buy almost everything on joker shop.