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Musul Man

Game is not balanced (Pro enforcer)

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8 hours ago, Zascha said:

I never asked for it to be removed. I made a statement.

 

It's fine for folks to have a different opinion about it. I don't even care that they express it. But this bullshoot where folks make underhanded comments and act like bratty, spoiled children and spew hostility because someone has an opinion they don't like is beyond stupid. It is the very reason this community has a reputation for being toxic--it actually IS toxic.

 

I've already said it, but I guess you missed it. Grow up.

Yes, my reply was incredibly toxic and mean, it was an insult directed at youNot really... If you actually think that then I think you're a bit too fragile for your own good, the forums are not and should not be your own personal safe-space where you're free from any criticism or sarcasm, if you cannot take either, then I regret to inform you that you might want to take your opinion elsewhere, to a place where everyone can agree with each other about everything all the time, but feel free to come back to real life when you're ready.

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4 hours ago, SelttikS said:

Make the nl9 be a stun over time with a slow effect.... also instead of just taking a knee when stunned they need to twitch on the ground... Yeah not gonna happen but would be funny.

O M G it would be epic, hit someone with PIGG and watch them run like 2 steps stiffen up and fall over. 😂

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You obviously need to play the game more man... 

A "one shot stun" LTL weapon doesn't exist.  

If you want an "enforcer" vehicle, ARMAS can help you out. That's how I got my "criminal" van.

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On 6/10/2018 at 2:36 PM, Musul Man said:

There are things that must be fixed, that were never a good idea to begin with. Creating a big gap between Enforcers and Criminals, being beneficial only to enforcers. Like this game was planned to help enforcers from the start.

 

So far I have two aspects of the game that seem very unbalanced to me:

 

1- The non lethal weapons. Some are one shot stuns, others just stun faster than normal guns kill. Sometimes they even bug and end up killing you anyways. Overall no criminal is happy that these exist, mainly because we have nothing similar. IMHO it was a bad idea to add these, and now a fix will be difficult to find.

 

2- The cars. Some of the top tier police cars and vans have way more HP, weight and push than their criminal counterparts. That is about it. Of course the criminals can get these cars as well but not the same way. It's either with joker points or events like referral. And in most cases they can't be customized.

 

Does someone else agree on these points?

 

 

When a less than lethal weapon kills you it isn't a bug. If your health is low and you get shot by a taser dart you will likely die.

Before people go "WHY IS IT CALLED LESS THAN LETHAL IF IT CAN KILL YOU?", the LTL guns will not kill you UNLESS you've been shot a few times by a real gun, or have lost a bit of health some other way.

 

Also if you read the description for the NL9 it states that the weapon had been shelved in the past for accidental deaths or something relating to being able to kill people. 

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On 6/11/2018 at 10:59 PM, Neonis said:

~ Wall of Text~

 


Edit: I tried adjusting the color to help ease reading all this text. Let me know if this experiment helped or made things worse.

 

Thanks, that helped with the readability. Plus was good on a black/dark grey background

9 hours ago, Rapid99 said:

I'm amazed that of all the new threads popping up in the Social District forum, this was the one that facilitated over 5 pages of discussion

 

I would have sworn this topic would have died before it reached page two when I saw it pop up last week

 

 

But, to contribute to the thread and just repeat what has been said 50 times before...

LTL is awful compared to lethal, and you are only punishing yourself when you choose to use it.

Enforcer's are not favored, stop it

I have an Enforcer, that has $80k. My crim has $420k (haha, lol 420)

My enforcer has significantly more play time. My crim is newer than my enf by a year or two... or three, I don't remember.

 

Enforcer's aren't favored. The Jericho is a crap car, that oversteers like mad. The Pioneer is a good armored vehicle. The Seiyo is a good armored vehicle. Sure it's fwd, but it look so much better than the Hummer looking pile of dung enforcers have.

Vegas (rwd, not 4x4) is still my favorite looking car with any body kit.

(and that thing is cross faction 😮 )

 

LTL itself, eh, I've never bothered using it. I've tried, and failed. It's hard af to do anything to support your team with it. If you want to use it, go ahead, but it's not easy. So if you're going to complain about someone being better than you with LTL and actually making an arrest, think about how they might be more skilled than you...

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The only reason I chose to main an Enforcer was so I wouldn't have to deal with LTLers.  Being arrested just slows the game down, and with some stages time is already tight, it makes those missions very easy to lose.

 

Adding an LTL like option for Criminals would slow things down even more, if both become popular, and I don't see that being good for the game, so to me it would make sense to keep it less effective than lethal stuff, or bring back the anti LTL mod for crims.

 

As long as I can avoid it though, I really don't care what happens to LTL.

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13 minutes ago, ScottDaniels said:

The only reason I chose to main an Enforcer was so I wouldn't have to deal with LTLers.  Being arrested just slows the game down, and with some stages time is already tight, it makes those missions very easy to lose.

 

Adding an LTL like option for Criminals would slow things down even more, if both become popular, and I don't see that being good for the game, so to me it would make sense to keep it less effective than lethal stuff, or bring back the anti LTL mod for crims.

 

As long as I can avoid it though, I really don't care what happens to LTL.

Crims and enf already have the "anti LTL" mod built into their stats.  Can you imagine how nice ltl would be if they removed that? Heck it might even be competitive with other weapons instead of being a detriment to a team.

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2 minutes ago, SelttikS said:

Crims and enf already have the "anti LTL" mod built into their stats.  Can you imagine how nice ltl would be if they removed that? Heck it might even be competitive with other weapons instead of being a detriment to a team.

Just like how awesome it wasn't before the mod was built into their stats... which is why they made the mod to begin with... which is why we're having this discussion where you try to assert your anger is a valid argument against opinions you don't like.

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4 minutes ago, SelttikS said:

Can you imagine how nice ltl would be if they removed that?

I'd never play my criminals again.  LOL

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On 6/10/2018 at 11:25 PM, Zascha said:

Just remove it from the game. Seriously. Just do it.

 

1. It's hard as shit-balls to do anyway. It's not even fun.

2. Crims can't stand it because it takes forever (not actually) to respawn. There might even be an argument in there about them causing Mission imbalances. I don't know. Don't really care, either.

 

Point is: It's not a very fun component in general. At best, it's a Troll component. I mean, yeah, I get it--cops, arrests--yeah yeah. It looks better on paper than it actually works.

 

I wouldn't hate it if they just removed it. I don't think anyone would miss it. Just get rid of it and end all this crap altogether once and for all.

 

Okay, sure. Crims still get to ram-raid. But that's been nerfed to hell and back. No one does it except that one guy who thinks it's so much fun.

 

Enforcers still get the sick lights and sirens. It's a fair trade if you ask me.

If LTL gets removed, I won't even ever return to APB R ever again. (and that from someone who has over 1300 hours into apb)

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3 minutes ago, Zascha said:

Just like how awesome it wasn't before the mod was built into their stats... which is why they made the mod to begin with... which is why we're having this discussion where you try to assert your anger is a valid argument against opinions you don't like.

Why are you still insisting everyone that disagrees with you is angry. Notice that wasn't a question because i don't care why you have to purposely seek out people to try and antagonize. Energizer and the dozen other mods were made to give the game VARIETY! WOO VARIETY! Not that stagnant thing we have now. The effect was given so as to round out those HP/stam numbers instead of having people fall off a building and get stunned all the time.

 

So yet again you are wrong. Many times you have been shown to be wrong and Somewhat psychotically delusional. So giving you more attention was a bad thing i guess cause you know don't feed trolls. But I just wanted to help you understand the history of things that you are Wrong about.

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8 minutes ago, SelttikS said:

Why are you still insisting everyone that disagrees with you is angry. Notice that wasn't a question because i don't care why you have to purposely seek out people to try and antagonize. Energizer and the dozen other mods were made to give the game VARIETY! WOO VARIETY! Not that stagnant thing we have now. The effect was given so as to round out those HP/stam numbers instead of having people fall off a building and get stunned all the time.

 

So yet again you are wrong. Many times you have been shown to be wrong and Somewhat psychotically delusional. So giving you more attention was a bad thing i guess cause you know don't feed trolls. But I just wanted to help you understand the history of things that you are Wrong about.

Do not bother, he will try to make ad hominems arguments against you ALL the time.

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We need some DEVS here to clean this mess up

*meanwhile the devs: 'Grab some popcorn Scotty! You GOT to see this!!!"*

 

heh, but joking aside. I feel like LTL is a very important, yet sensitive, feature in APB Reloaded. Some people hate it and some love it, I'd score it 50/50: bad mechanic (for crims), but defenitely part of APB.

I do like the idea a lot that crims can get some kind of weapon mechanic too (idk, perhaps some kind of "execute" move like you can see in the beginning of the BeAllYouCantBe trailer and gain more cash like cops? It would fit for a group of criminals like the G-kings and Blood Roses. Heck, it could even have its own role and daily activities.

 

But let's be honest here, the game is mostly based on the criminals. The criminal faction is what makes the game. Who goes to the steamstore and look at GTA and be like "oh wow I can roleplay a cop there!"? NO ONE. Everyone wants to be a baddie and that is why the game is even played. It's like cops are just some kind of byproduct. Here are some reasons why I think that:

1) you can drop off loot as a criminal and your notoriety will be set to 0, symbolising: You dropped off and are now under the radar (which means, less money, but cops cannot witness you. You can still bribe contacts tough).

NOW, when an enforcer drops off loot taken from a criminal, his/her prestige will go to 2. AND LET ME TELL YA THIS, YOU WON'T BE AS LOW AS PRESTIGE 2 AT THAT TIME. This means you actually get penalised/demoted for doing cop stuff. It's cool it doesnt go to 0, but the creators of the system clearly did not care for the enforcers here. (and your non-opposed-mission random teammates you play with that get dragged into your witness WILL NOT thank you for dropping of some cash)

2) Now, this might just be me, although I doubt that I am the only one noticing this. Criminals get the defend-side MUCH MORE than enforcers. Speaking in gameplay here, defending is much more easier than attacking (heck, people even acknowledge that on RainbowSixSiege) resulting in criminals being somewhat (I should be careful of my words here)... "easier" to play.

3) While we are totally used to it, can I just point out to everyone again that an enforcer cannot do ANYTHING to ramraider criminals who raid at 0-1 notoriety (mugging CAN be stopped by killing the citizen... Very cop like). When a criminal is at 0 or 1 notoriety, the cash multiplier is 0.## times. This means that the criminal can stock up goods at low notoriety (to avoid the "you are carrying 2500$ worth so you are witnessable) and simply kill a row of citizens to rack up their notoriety up to like 1.2(?) and then deliver the goods... SURE, it is smart thinking and I feel like this should indeed be in the game, but once again an enforcer just stands by and watches...

 

Counter-argues:

1) Cops get LTL. Defenitely a good arguement to say crims are left in the dust here, but LTL REALLY is a lot more difficult than what it seems to be at first glance (I agree, the Stabba ccg CAN be powerful as it is somewhat the same as a star with HuntingSight 1-2. But arresting is a lot more trickier and when I ask the community if a Star HS 2 could beat an NTEC, I am only gonna hear ONE answer. (people do underrate the STAR though! ^^

2) Cops have better vehicles.   In my entire gameplay career of 1300 hours I cannot really see why people say this (I haven't looked/compared this cause I simply do not care about vehicle stats. But if a ton of people are pointing this out it is propably true) (though I doubt that a minor stat-boost to a vehicle is a real playmaker in the game)

 

I am certain I missed some spots here, but the differences between cops and crims are mostly minor. If it wasn't, I would see people complain about [insert faction here] in the district chat all the time.

What do you guys/girls think? Did I miss something here that you think should be pointed out? (Please answer maturely)

Edited by koenyboy500
typo
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7 minutes ago, koenyboy500 said:

Counter-argues:

1) Cops get LTL. Defenitely a good arguement to say crims are left in the dust here, but LTL REALLY is a lot more difficult than what it seems to be at first glance (I agree, the Stabba ccg CAN be powerful as it is somewhat the same as a star with HuntingSight 1-2. But arresting is a lot more trickier and when I ask the community if a Star HS 2 could beat an NTEC, I am only gonna hear ONE answer. (people do underrate the STAR though! ^^

 

Stabba CCG has a 1.05 tts while a stock Star has a ttk of 0.75.

Need to go bad to the old days. Get off my lawn!

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3 hours ago, Excalibur! said:

Do not bother, he will try to make ad hominems arguments against you ALL the time.

I haven't attacked him a single time. Nor have I attacked you for that matter.

 

If I'm not mistaken, I originally posted something quite benign to which you two lost your shit over. So don't try to turn this around like I've done something wrong to either one of you. That's just plain and simple denial.

 

As it stands, I'm glad you both have decided to stop responding to me and commenting on my opinions. And I'm done responding to you. I just felt it necessary to say this to set the record straight since you both seem to have forgotten who started it.

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On 6/14/2018 at 12:30 PM, Similarities said:

Yes, my reply was incredibly toxic and mean, it was an insult directed at youNot really... If you actually think that then I think you're a bit too fragile for your own good, the forums are not and should not be your own personal safe-space where you're free from any criticism or sarcasm, if you cannot take either, then I regret to inform you that you might want to take your opinion elsewhere, to a place where everyone can agree with each other about everything all the time, but feel free to come back to real life when you're ready.

I don't expect people to not criticize others' opinions. But I do expect people to criticize others' opinions with some amount of human decency--to treat them like they aren't automatically stupid--to actually try and have a natural, normal conversation. There's absolutely no reason to be sarcastic or bitter toward someone over anything. It just shows a general lack of respect for other people and yourself. It's juvenile, and I'm sick of playing that game with people. You will not get away with it when you speak to me.

 

If you're going to behave that way with me, then you should be prepared to accept worse from me. Because I will bring it. Guaranteed. I'm done letting this community get away with being toxic. If you don't address these issues, these people will run all over you and they will continue to do it. It's just like any other bully. If you don't stand up for yourself, they will continue to do it.

 

But I would rather people just have civil discourse as I've demonstrated in this thread with others who have responded to me.

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30 minutes ago, Zascha said:

I haven't attacked him a single time. Nor have I attacked you for that matter.

 

If I'm not mistaken, I originally posted something quite benign to which you two lost your shit over. So don't try to turn this around like I've done something wrong to either one of you. That's just plain and simple denial.

 

As it stands, I'm glad you both have decided to stop responding to me and commenting on my opinions. And I'm done responding to you. I just felt it necessary to say this to set the record straight since you both seem to have forgotten who started it.

Lol you are glad we stopped because you get completly destroyed to the point you need those ad hominems to "try" to win with your weighless arguments.

Edited by Excalibur!

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1 minute ago, Excalibur! said:

Lol you are glad we stopped because you get completly destroyed to the point you need those ad hominems to "try" to win with your weighless arguments.

 

24 minutes ago, SelttikS said:

 

Lol, I am so glad you guys stopped--

 

Wait... no... You didn't stop. You said you were done, but no... you really weren't.

 

You guys can't even do what you say you're going to do. You said it. And you can't even do it. You started this whole mess. You and the other guy--I can't even be bothered to scroll up to look at his name.

 

"We're done speaking to you..."

*moments later*

"And another thing..."

 

What the hell has got you guys so upset that you feel the need to continue responding? Is it because you feel the need to be right? You think you have to change my mind?

 

Nothing you've said has changed my opinion. Nothing. I started this thread thinking they should get rid of LtL, and I still feel the same way.

 

You guys are mad because I don't share your opinions. That's it. That's what this whole thing is about. You will not shut up, because someone thinks differently than you. That's it.

 

Ad hominem? Do you even know what that means? It means someone directs an argument against a person instead of their position. Go back and read the conversations. YOU are the ones who started the ad hominems because I didn't accept your positions. You did not show me that you were correct and that I was wrong. I'm sorry. You didn't.

 

YOU. You have started ALL of this shit. All of it. You have no one else to blame but yourselves.

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1 minute ago, Zascha said:

 

Lol, I am so glad you guys stopped--

 

Wait... no... You didn't stop. You said you were done, but no... you really weren't.

 

You guys can't even do what you say you're going to do. You said it. And you can't even do it. You started this whole mess. You and the other guy--I can't even be bothered to scroll up to look at his name.

 

"We're done speaking to you..."

*moments later*

"And another thing..."

 

What the hell has got you guys so upset that you feel the need to continue responding? Is it because you feel the need to be right? You think you have to change my mind?

 

Nothing you've said has changed my opinion. Nothing. I started this thread thinking they should get rid of LtL, and I still feel the same way.

 

You guys are mad because I don't share your opinions. That's it. That's what this whole thing is about. You will not shut up, because someone thinks differently than you. That's it.

 

Ad hominem? Do you even know what that means? It means someone directs an argument against a person instead of their position. Go back and read the conversations. YOU are the ones who started the ad hominems because I didn't accept your positions. You did not show me that you were correct and that I was wrong. I'm sorry. You didn't.

 

YOU. You have started ALL of this shit. All of it. You have no one else to blame but yourselves.

No one is mad, upset, angry, i at least do not care much about your opinion and i stated facts against you so far.

 

Yes you do these kind of ad hominem. You are trying to argument we are attacking you because

3 minutes ago, Zascha said:

You guys are mad because I don't share your opinions. That's it. That's what this whole thing is about. You will not shut up, because someone thinks differently than you. That's it.

No, i am disgusted because of your subjective opinions being displayed as facts.

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@Lixil Can this just be closed, it has become nothing but a place for Op to attack everyone.

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On 6/10/2018 at 8:14 PM, Zascha said:

You've already used this GIF today. It was stupid the first time.

 

You're as useful as a music album recorded in braille.

On 6/11/2018 at 6:42 AM, Zascha said:

That's exactly what the OP is. It's all he is.

 

I would like to respectfully inform everyone to leave the OP alone. He's a little too touched in the head.

On 6/10/2018 at 7:54 PM, Zascha said:

Who cares what you think?

 

I like my opinion best. So, I think LtL should be removed until something better can be made.

 

So... cool your jets.

KN0GCcG.png

 

How isnt that ad hominem? @Zascha You are allways trying to use the same strategy for your weightless arguments: like "remove ltl because i have no fun with it, just do it".

 

EDIT: i am a bit lazy to look for more examples. You just try to make the other people that do not share your opinion stupid.

EDIT2: and it seems that there is more people facing same consequences for not sharing your opinions... looks like everyone is wrong but you. You know how bad that sounds right?

Edited by Excalibur!

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43 minutes ago, Excalibur! said:

KN0GCcG.png

 

How isnt that ad hominem? @Zascha You are allways trying to use the same strategy for your weightless arguments: like "remove ltl because i have no fun with it, just do it".

 

EDIT: i am a bit lazy to look for more examples. You just try to make the other people that do not share your opinion stupid.

EDIT2: and it seems that there is more people facing same consequences for not sharing your opinions... looks like everyone is wrong but you. You know how bad that sounds right?

The first quote was to someone else who was doing exactly the same crap you are trying to do me now. I don't draw first blood. I respond to people who do accordingly. You example here is not helping your case.

 

The second quote was in an entirely different thread to the same guy who I was speaking to in the first item you quoted. The guy treated me poorly. I tend to remember when people do that to me, and I don't really have much positive things to say about them for a long while after. Sorry. Rub me the wrong way and persist at it, it tends to leave a lasting impression with me. It's fair to say I jumped the gun there, however. Maybe I should apologize for it. But... the guy was a jerk. So... I probably won't.

 

The third thing you quoted was in direct response to the person whom I said that to after they had already said the same thing to me. So again, this example fails. Go back and read the thread. They're the ones who said they didn't care about anyone's opinion. I said the same thing to him to reflect exactly his attitude toward everyone else.

 

I didn't even read what else you wrote. It's a waste of time. Your examples are stupid that don't show anything but that I treated someone like an unpleasant fellow after they had already treated me like an unpleasant fellow first. Good job being pointless.

Edited by Zascha

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16 minutes ago, Zascha said:

The first quote was to someone else who was doing exactly the same crap you are trying to do me now. I don't draw first blood. I respond to people who do accordingly. You example here is not helping your case.

 

The second quote was in an entirely different thread to the same guy who I was speaking to in the first item you quoted. The guy treated me poorly. I tend to remember when people do that to me, and I don't really have much positive things to say about them for a long while after. Sorry. Rub me the wrong way and persist at it, it tends to leave a lasting impression with me. It's fair to say I jumped the gun there, however. Maybe I should apologize for it. But... the guy was a jerk. So... I probably won't.

 

The third thing you quoted was in direct response to the person whom I said that to after they had already said the same thing to me. So again, this example fails. Go back and read the thread. They're the ones who said they didn't care about anyone's opinion. I said the same thing to him to reflect exactly his attitude toward everyone else.

 

I didn't even read what else you wrote. It's a waste of time. Your examples are stupid that don't show anything but that I treated someone like an unpleasant fellow after they had already treated me like an unpleasant fellow first. Good job being pointless.

Wow you went full psycho son.

"Everyone attacks me!!!" Okay keep going on, you are showing everyone who you are. Is not like i need to expose you any further.

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this went to shit fast

 

or maybe not, its page 6 after all

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6 hours ago, ScottDaniels said:

I'd never play my criminals again.  LOL

 

it really sucked when you jumped from a high location (not even enough to kill you) and were basically stunned in place for a few seconds until you gained stamina.  Then you only started to move like a snail and a few more seconds you could move normally.

 

Those times Crims were actually stunned more often with lethal weapons.

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