Noob_Guardian

I mean, you're talking about the "original" ntec with HB2 usage. So it's pretty possible they did. The SCOUT lasted 3 - 4 years? QSING HVR 5-6? I understand that not everything will play like it, however, i also understand that buffing every weapon to that strength will cause issues. We can agree to disagree on that, however every weapon that had been close to NTEC's "original" strength has been nerfed. I'm not keen on making every weapon that "powerful", as I still hold by the fact that I feel APB's gameplay and locations were meant for higher ttk combat, not lower. I've been gold since after I got it when they upped gold to the top 20%. The last time I "tried" to dethreat was during gold lock, and after losing roughly 15 matches in a row i decided it wasn't worth the effort and stopped because I was still gold (ironically i sucked so bad I couldn't dethreat). Plus my PC was a I3 laptop running sub 20FPS, and essentially just stopped running APB after all the patches kept making performance worse. Why should all AR's "focus" around the NTEC? AR's are varied drastically with their intended niches, from ATAC, COBRA, and condor, to STAR, FAR, and NTEC. AR's vary as drastically as every other weapon role. What would be important if you were to focus on NTEC is to identify the key competitors of the NTEC within the NTEC's midrange niche from all roles, and balance accordingly. Not just "AR's". STAR couldn't compete easily against most other weapons in the cqc to midrange niche, not just the NTEC. Though NTEC was the only other "AR", as such it was easier to try to reference NTEC as a basis to buff it, because it was so much bette, than the STAR was in almost every way.

That patch looks amazing for newer players and those who havn't got these weapons bought. ALL macro usage is not permitted via TOS. Just a FYI.

You said "what didn't it get nerfed for" Mag size was a reply to that. It was also one of the ideas floated to nerf all AR's to 24 bullets in a mag. I know the differences in gameplay with obeya and obir thank you. G1 would intentionally not fix broken, glitched, and overpowered weapons for several weeks, months, years, to milk money off players, it was a strategy by them. I know that you know they did so. If you were to buff "every" weapon to NTEC standard, you'd have had to rework every AR, rifle, and pointman weapon to some degree. Not that they havn't already buffed half the weapons in game to begin with. Ironically, it still wasn't "enough" because nothing still could easily compete with the NTEC. FAR was a hybrid star/ntec. It leans much closer to the STAR than the NTEC, unless you're claiming the STAR shares a lot of traits of the ntec. FAR has the same base accuracy as the STAR, .05 less marksman modifier, higher shot modifier cap, same crouch and walk modifiers, same run and jump modifiers, same recovery delay. Almost all the Accuracy modifiers are the same for the STAR and the FAR. Both the STAR and the FAR are "almost" identical. Aside from TTK and mag size (and im unsure about damage ramp) A few matches against me proves nothing when it comes to "skill" with a weapon when consistently getting 2-4v1'd all match. Not only that, but i've had plenty of matches with ntec with 20+ kills against premade gold groups while solo queing, as i have with most other weapons in game. Getting kills with NTEC was considerably easier imo than using other weapons to do so. And you just admitted your bias, "it was our favorite gun and it felt good". Yes, people never want their favorite weapons nerfed, it's understandable. Especially when they believe the ENTIRE game should be BUILT around that specific weapon. A perception issue. A game shouldn't be "directly balanced around 1 gun". APB is balanced for example, within ranged niches from cqc-long. Most weapons are only optimal in a one them of them, but capable of doing well in other ones. That still could not be said of the NTEC which was good in every niche that it was usable in. You say "balance based on the highest skilled players". Well if all the highest skilled players only go to a certain weapon for the reason that it nets the easiest kills and has the most use across all niches, then that's reason enough to look at the weapon and see if there's enough reason or cause to re-balance it. If there's a weapon that is far too powerful within one niche, it deserves a nerf, like the C2. So why would you not nerf a weapon that is a little too powerful, across multiple niches? This is regardless of the fact that there are only 2 F2p AR's. You don't ignore game balance because there's only "2" f2p AR's, and one is drastically better than the other even after the weaker one got buffed (and the stronger one reworked and nerfed slightly), with only 3 weapons that can compete with the NTEC, and none really used over the NTEC for obvious reasons. Dunno, I almost never saw any comments about CQC capabilities needing nerfed on NTEC, until LO floated the idea. I think I saw 1 forum post about it and was surprised to see LO take the CQC approach. Yes, it's a ranged weapon, and supposed to be good at range, especially with "high skill players". Which is why they nerfed the CQC capabilities to ensure that it stays good at range while not being so good in CQC. Far sounds and looks fine to me, i've done plenty well with it when I had been leveling my rifleman role and switching between the STAR/NTEC/FAR a lot. If you think that the game is going to be an eternal cycle of gun nerfing you're wrong. LO already stated that isn't their intent, and it clearly wasn't G1's either. Its strawmanning and fearmongering. Did you know that most guns in the game got buffed? Not nerfed? They did nerf a number of the "stronger iconic" ones in the past. From CSG, RFP, FBW, NTEC, OBEYA, HVR. But they then buffed the "underpowered/underused" ones, STAR, SNUB, PDW, NFA, OCA, PMG, DMR, MISERY, CURSE, ALIG, ETC. The point of the previous balance changes, has clearly been to lessen the power level difference between certain weapons within the same niches so that there are more "options" to choose from. You think that APB, which is built on customization and player "choice" from modding a weapon to what suits your playstyle, to the 20+ weapons, should only have 3-5 weapons used by the majority of the playerbase? The point of the changes has been clearly to ensure that a wider variety of weapons are viable choices in more situations, and that player experience doesn't suck because of things like sprintshooting,qsing, jumpshooting, broken camp locations, and item running all of which they either removed or nerfed to some degree.

Let's not pretend that the old devs were better.

Hmm having too large a mag size? Base Accuracy? Bloom recovery? TTK? It got reworked intially by g1, and it still ended up performing almost exactly the same as before the rework in effectiveness, aside from the hp damage nerf to effect HB. The primary original "competitors" for the NTEC originally were STAR, OBIR, OBEYA (If you can call the obir a competitor). STAR never cut it let alone competed in any capacity until it got buffed, at which point it became "slightly viable" and still took 6 YEARS to buff and an NTEC nerf and REWORK for it to happen, OBIR is almost never used unless its waterfront and really doesn't compete until 50-60+m, and OBEYA got reworked, then nerfed, then unnerfed and was the only viable option against NTEC. There was never a "great" direct competitor to the NTEC aside from obeya, and it, then nerfed, nerfed again?, then unnerfed ages later. As I said before, any weapon that could easily compete against the original NTEC got nerfed, except for the NTEC. It took forever for G1 to realize that HB was an issue on the NTEC, but i doubt it had to do with them realizing it as an issue, and more of them deciding that they preferred the NTEC to be better than anything else. NTEC probably has the most sales as a weapon in game, i doubt they willingly touched it for any rework or nerf. Star couldn't perform very well until it got buffed. A large amount of forum players agreed that it needed a buff. It wasn't until FAR (which was seen as a star/ntec hybrid) came into existence, that G1 FINALLY buffed the STAR. Even AFTER buff STAR never cut it because NTEC was still simply better and FAR was just a better option at that point. Of the new weapons FAR and ATAC were the only "AR"s that can fairly easily compete against NTEC to some degree, (even after ATAC's 1htk change and possible buffs?) whether it be more at mid-range (FAR) or CQC (ATAC). Yet you see how much hate the ATAC gets. Everyone said the FAR was balanced when it came out, less versatile then NTEC, but still fairly good, and yet here we are, people complaining about FAR? Of all things? (LEL) The "NTEC" is awful and undesirable, yet is still the most used AR? How does that work? If it's so awful of an AR, wouldn't everyone be running STAR, FAR, OBEYA, or any other cqc-midrange weapon that can now "do better"? I still see a lot of ntecs, yes, i see PMGS, and other weapons as well. But i'm positive that was the point considering every match I played had 3-4 NTECs in them and rarely any other weapons unless it was silvers or lower ranks, or a premade clan where they used 2 ntecs and a sniper/shotgun. STAR doesn't "feel" great because it doesn't have the bloom recovery nor ttk of the ntec. Nor accuracy of the FAR. Far originally was somewhat of the middleground between both STAR and NTEC until the STAR got the FAR's bloom recovery. STAR also seems to ghost shot a bit for some reason. (I'll never understand firing 20 shots into a guy standing still afk and not killing him while tap/burst firing the star) The NTEC feels "good" because it's great near pinpoint accuracy for tapfiring, mixed with faster midrange ttk from bloom recovery, and faster TTK at .7 rather than .75. It performed well from 0-65m, where the STAR, and FAR fell off at 35-50m, while the NTEC was pretty much, just as good, at jump firing, and cqc, with better midrange performance. As such, I assume LO nerfed its CQC effectiveness for that reason, as well as to give shotguns a little more room. We can say "now you just made NTEC worse and people use other guns" but shouldn't you be switching weapons based on location to begin with? If you used NTEC 95% of the time except in pure sniping situations, well uuh... yeah? Shouldn't there be more weapons being used than NTEC the majority of the time? I'm fine with opening up Condor and FAR, possibly even ATAC for new player progression, or if not full open slots from role progression, then have usable pre-modded variants from contacts with jokerstore and armas being 3 slots. I don't see why they should be locked behind yearly events like they had been (aside from ATAC which had been armas only). As I said, i'm fine with giving new players more weapon variety and i'd like them to also be viable options. I'd love for more weapons to be gained from in-game progression, I'd love for more sniper variants, lmg, and pointman variants to be placed ingame for game progression. I don't have the power to do so but I can agree that there needs to be more weapon variety for progression. Merged. I mean, at that point should no gun jump shoot except for shotguns? I'm not necessarily against that idea, however if you think such things should only apply to AR's we may as well do it to everything else, from rifles, snipers (yes, bye current scout jumpshots), and SMGS (Bye s1na). You mean people didn't pick AR's like ATAC because cqc capabilities? People pick a weapons for different reasons. The majority of people, will use 1 weapon over others, because of availability, ease of use, ttk, range, versatility, and power level. Which is why when any overpowered weapons popped up, a lot of people hopped off the holy trinity to them. If you have any weapon that is essentially "too versatile" and hard to counter with other weapons, it'll be used way more than any other weapon in that niche(s). We've seen it time and time again.

Please read below He's calling the FAR a "prenerf ntec". Like the F***? It's nothing like the NTEC and never was, its got a smaller mag, lower bloom recovery, more base accuracy, more CQC capabilities. The FAR is functionally different from the NTEC. Maybe the NTEC got nerfed to further the "difference" between NTEC and FAR/STAR in cqc? Just because "NTEC" got nerfed for something doesn't mean every other weapon is going nor should get nerfed the same way, because every weapon serves a different intended niche and range. I do agree, FAR should have leases like the STAR and NTEC built into contacts for unlock so every player can get it aside from holidays, joker store, and armas. If the FAR and STAR was so much "better" than the NTEC, it'd be like the C-9 all over again. It isn't. There's a drastic difference between the NTEC and FAR. The FAR is MUCH more like the STAR than an NTEC. I don't understand why the cqc abilities were touched on the NTEC while the midrange were left untouched. However it seems clear that the intent was to make the NTEC worse in CQC to open up the niche more for STAR/FAR while leaving NTEC better at midrange. Giving players a choice between "good at 0-40m" vs "5/10-60"m

Odd, I take it you're using marksman mode while jumping then. It took me a little to figure that out, but I do think your screen has to do with it. Mines at 1360/### or so which makes the images look different. You mean the Scoped NTEC? I think if you're talking about the Scoped NTEC, is mostly because you HAVE to stay still, or lose a lot of accuracy with the scoped version. It loses a lot of accuracy that the normal NTEC doesn't while moving, which makes it a bit less powerful. You rarely see scoped, i still have mine and have barely touched it. I won't pretend that leaving the scoped version as it is may or may not be a good/bad design decision, however it is weaker than the normal ntec in a number of situations because of the accuracy loss, and had been generally seen as sub-par, even if it has more base accuracy. People may not know that the scoped is a "unnerfed" version, others do, but movement accuracy does matter a bit to people. Most VET and older players use ntec while moving and strafing/corner peaking moving in mm a lot. As such you would be hard pressed to find them enjoy using the scoped version because "mobility matters". I think the scoped versions had been touched a few times with minor changes but i don't know what exactly had been done to them. Accuracy modifiers perhaps? I won't say that don't I feel there were better ways to nerf the ntec. I don't particularly have an issue with the jump accuracy nerf, most weapons that are designed towards "mid range" have bad jump accuracy. The full bloom may be a tad much, but IR3 also makes that worse because well, i'd simply call that the tradeoff of a great midrange weapon getting more range i suppose (I wish they'd find a different tradeoff for CJ since it does about the same thing). Quite frankly it seems they wanted it to either full auto in cqc 5m-, or burst a little bit/force you to pistol 10m-. Making the STAR/FAR clearly better cqc-mid options, while leaving NTEC as better mid. APB was never made around the NTEC. People felt that the entire game "should" have been balanced around the NTEC. That's a massive difference. APB was also originally made with MUCH higher TTKs than currently. Uh no, i spent like 20 minutes in game rotating from far, star, and ntec firing, jumping, jump firing, in and out of MM. Yes, he posted pictures, his screen is also massively different from mine as well. He was also using IR3. I wasn't. I used just HS and no mods to figure out why his accuracies were way different. He didn't specify what mods he was using on them only pictures as well. I'm not "grasping" at straws, I was simply trying to connect the dots as to why his "pictures" looked different from what I had tested. For example, max bloom NTEC for me seemed larger than his image.

Most of my clan were silvers, it had 80 members with 20 active almost daily/weekend and the others played a few times a week/once a week. It litterally died to like 5 people on at any random time... tops. I played with all of them, and when gold lock occured I legit couldn't play with most, and because of how many cheaters, tryhards, exploiters, etc etc were in gold. No one but maybe 4 people wanted to play with me. You can say that "if they wanted to play they'd play with you. I mean, why would they if they legit only face the scummiest players in the district? People actually want to have fun with friends. Not get face stomped and go 0/13 while their buddy goes 12/10. Majority of the clan did end up all leaving within the 3 month span of gold lock as well. Not surprised though. Threat seg was a terrible idea, because there are FAR better ideas to protect new players. We can disagree on that, though i'm almost positive gold lock was the reason that half the g1 team disappeared after gold lock. Joker server in 3 months went from 800-1000 population - 300-500. Can you imagine having to tell your boss/bosses boss "hey guys, we just lost half our playerbase in 3 months because of this idea". Within like a month or two after its reversion a bunch of GMs disappeared, and we got a new community manager. I certainly have reason to suspect it was because of Gold Lock's failure.

unless the enemy is so close to the corner peaking to where you legit cannot aim on him with a sniper at the corner, and have to aim "Beside" the body and off the "red reticle" to hit (which actually happens) cornerpeaking isn't much an issue. Considering you put yourself into a position with no cover... against someone with 95% cover. Increased accuracy shouldn't save you from bad gameplay tactics like that. We have cars, mobile cover, explosives, "randomized" spawns, multiple entrances into almost every location, grenades, and lots of peak points depending on where for snipers, and walls for calculated opgl nades. Heck, even brick n car det can work wonders lol

Those reticles look way off, i just went in game and looked at out of mm and in mm accuracy firing and not firing for max bloom to compare and none of the gun's (STAR, NTEC, FAR) reticles look close to those images being shown. Are those prenerf? NTEC images? Mods on the weapons? (Maybe they look off cause my screen size ingame in comparison to the picture, that's my only guess) I did however notice that if your camera is zoomed out more, your reticle shows less accuracy while jumping out of MM than if zoomed in. Dunno, probably 5 years. Not that you can prove me wrong anyways.

4718* actually, I stopped trying to play "competitively" for the most part ages ago when my clan fell apart the second time while I had to take a break due to training. I've been solo queuing since with better computer upgrades, that doesn't mean i don't bother winning for the team, I just don't focus on winning as much as I focus on individual actions and trying to have fun. Like ramping right, flanking, or sneaking an objective, maybe setting up my enemies team via distraction for my teamates if I'm not using them as litteral bait. Besides you can't "play competitively" in pugs, it doesn't work lol. It's better to just do whatever and play and try to have fun and try something new than it is to get aggravated by trying too hard and failing because of lack of team coordination. As i've said a lot of times, most players in Jericho don't give me any issues when I play against them, only a small handful of players actually can. When I do bother against them, it's generally only to pull a 1.0+ k/d rather than a win. You can't "play competitively" with solo que and no team coordination. Losing happens, you can't "win" them all, you'll lose because of civilians, civi cars, other players, and a billion other reasons. Yes, I do sometimes do runescape, or scroll through facebook and eat while playing, I've had times where I've chatted in /g or /t for several matches in a row and texted people mid match while playing, while still pulling 16/8 k/d and mvp while doing so using "underpowered weapons" against premades. Hell, i went like 9/2 earlier with NTEC and HB3 w/ snubnose and 8 balls (lel) against 2near max rank golds and a higher rank silver (170+) just to be a meme. Just because I prefer to play casually doesn't mean I'm a bad player. It just means I don't put all my focus on winning or using "meta" and running around in a vegas/pio with carspawn and armor lol. Nor does it mean I don't know how to use most weapons.

Nerfing the ntec twice in 7 years didn't drastically lower the skill cieling (how is supposedly making a weapon "harder" as so many people claim "lowering the skill ceiling?), removing jump shooting didn't do it because that was a glitch and broken beyond belief. Have cover? Cool now i jump aaand you die (how's that competitive?). Nerfing the so called "high skill ceiling qsing" (yes people did call it high skill to qs back then), and buffing a few weaker weapons and nerfing overtuned ones surely won't zerg the games skill ceiling. Don't pretend that APB had/has a high skill ceiling. Firing an NTEC at .19 intervals isn't a difficult feat. Jump scout and QSing weren't hard, CSG prenerf wasn't hard. Firing an obeya or obir isn't hard. Most weapons aren't "hard" or even "high skill" unless they actually suck, like the ODIN's, the OSCP, the Harbinger, ltl, ISSR-a, and current Tommy gun. The holy trinity aren't hard, oscar and carbine aren't hard. I can't say that I know any weapon that isn't an actual trash tier weapon that can be "high skill" But i guess that's because actually using them takes more effort and more skill than "meta". Lol, i spent like 2-3k on the game, own most weapons char bound and can use pretty much all of them effectively (except like, ISSR-A because i havn't really bothered with it), because I get bored using a single weapon 24/7 and have to switch it up every few matches. Have 3 primary weapon roles max (including pistols/grenades ofc) and the rest at 15. Do I qualify? Those "crutches" wouldn't even be an issue if people played around them properly. Playing competitive shouldn't mean playing stupid (like sitting in the open on a road). Besides, if people are so competitive what's the issue with "crutch" weapons or tactics like car pushing? If competitive players are so good why are they an issue? They shouldn't be. I don't have issues with atacs, jgs, medusas, nfas's or hvrs. But then again, I pay attention to every enemy location that I can and the timing it takes from point A to B for them, and me, as well as weapon ranges of each person. I "may" only die to carbomb once or twice a match. Once because I push into the vehicle like a dummy, the next time because I wasn't watching my radar while on the road. You'd be hard pressed to have me die consistently to a car bomb, or any explosive that isn't a volcano (while im getting point)

You "used" to see almost no pmgs at all. Then it got buffed and you used to see so many it was overbearing. Yes you saw OCAs, yes "sometimes" you saw just as many in a district, however most of the time PMG was used more. PMG didn't gain "holytrinity" status by being equal to OCA lol.

I have never claimed to be completely sportsmanlike. Though I do never say gg unless the losing team does, when it came to weapon usage or tactics, if the enemy or his teammate did it (at any point), it was fair game. Use ntec with HB or QS at any point? Congrats, I won't feel bad about giving you your own medicine. Keep calling me a hypocrite if it makes you feel better, but you know damn well that HB and qsing was used extensively even by high ranking clans and players back then. I don't feel bad about calling for their nerf/removal while using it. You clearly missed me using NTEC without out it then. You know, before I maxed my rifleman level and switched over to pointman, maxed that and now am leveling the other 3 remaining. But that's nothing new since you've never actually grouped with me and only played in the same team, like.. once or twice a year lol. I don't need to grasp at straws, there's been little change in the forums since then, aside from fewer overall posts. I don't need to play victim when you started namecalling first and calling others "bad players". /shrug, don't need to play victim at that point.

No, I've had an issue with NTEC, not because another weapon got nerfed. I felt it needed nerfed for a while, they touched HB and I thought that would have fixed the issue with it, but it didn't. What weapon did they nerf to make NTEC an issue? It certainly wasn't the obeya,obir, or star, the only 3 weapons that in some form "somewhat" competed against the NTEC. Obeya got nerfed, but that wasn't why I had issues with NTEC either, even after it got buffed sooo. State of the forums? Have you been on forums consistently since 2012? lol The state of the forums is actually normal atm, if not slow. Believe it or not lol. True, dethreaters are an issue for new players, i've been saying that for years, and all my suggestions for it fell on deaf ears /shrug Dunno, probably for the same reason so called competitive players care, if the game isn't balanced it isn't fun. If weapons like the C-9 ran rampant there's a problem and not fun, and isn't "competitive", just like if there's too many weapons like Odin series. Casual players want most weapons to be viable, even if they aren't meta. If something is too powerful in the meta, and buffing a non-meta weapon to that power level would litterally destroy balance, the only other option is to tone the meta weapon down slightly while buffing the non-meta. The primary point of casuals wanting balance is to make the game more "fun" and have a larger choice of weapons rather than what was called "the holy trinity" for an obvious reason. If they were really that good they'd be able to accurately discuss weapon niches, ranges, and where one is strong, if one is too strong and where (if at all), and where the weapon is weak in comparison to other weapons within the same role and niche. I didnt state the ATAC got buffed, I said it got nerfed within a month. I said to someone else that I didn't know that they buffed they atac. But please twist words lol. Oh yes, I abused it, just like the majority of the playerbase. Ooooh im such a bad guy...

I didn't want it to be identical to the star, and quite frankly the general idea was to maintain that both AR's STAR and NTEC, being F2P, one being better in CQC - mid, the other "mid". The STAR used to have a much slower bloom recovery (was is 2.5?or 3.0?) when I originally suggested the bloom reduction to 4.0. The reason for the 4.0 would be tune it down a little in midrange for obeya/obir/snipers at 50-60m or so to do a little better. Though I will concede that 4.25 or so may be a better stat for the suggestion, rather than 4.0. I'm fine with PMG having higher damage, i don't believe that it's very overbuffed. As I said, i wouldn't mind tweaking the crouch accuracy, or range on it slightly, however any other changes I wouldn't know about because I don't want to break it and make it useless, as it was buffed along a fine line. Most suggestions i've made directly to weapons, were generally "minor", 0.05ttk increases, or minor accuracy buffs, or ttk reductions. Though recently I had suggested "iterative" buff changes where one was minor, and if it wasn't good enough, try "this" stat change instead, mostly so that hey this didn't fix it but it made the weapon "stronger" they could then tweak it a little more hopefully without it breaking it. I can't really say i see "far more" pmgs, i do not often see OCA's, and i see a lot more PMGs than OCAs generally. In the past they had been roughly equal, leaning towards PMG for edgelords and OCAs for most other people, but there had been a much larger pop, and OCA was still considered "good". I'm still confused as to why, the OCA still maintaining its accuracy buff, but not TTK reduction, is considered "trash" by some??? Like, OCA is still good guys, lol.

even then its a 4s ttk lol

How dare filthy casuals have an opinion or say on anything. What if I told you, proper weapon balance makes the game more enjoyable for casual players? Not that it matters to you. How dare player experience be enjoyable for most players. I enjoy elitist attitudes, because in most games i've played they get consistently proven wrong, and still think that they matter more than normal players.

If you fire the NTEC at ~.19 or 1.14ttk interval you will fire the ntec with perfect accuracy at range (that'll never happen without a macro). My issue with it for the longest time was bloom recovery and TTK. I wanted it to be at 4.0 rather than the current 5.0 for recovery, and a ttk of .75 same as star. I thought that would balance it. CQC came up because that's what "others" and suggested, and what LO had went with, though a direct TTK change similar to star would have done the trick. I myself didn't really care for LOs CQC nerfs, but figured that if they'll never touch the bloom recovery, and settled for welp, i guess the cqc changes are "enough". The weapon is supposed to be effective midrange. Midrange weapons like the obir, obeya, and ntec have similar ttks at range when you account for human error. However, in comparison to other AR's, there's a reason why NTEC outshines them drastically because of bloom recovery. Star and far have 3.5, obeya has 2.27, NTEC has 5.0. I personally had little complaint about the CQC aspect of the NTEC, though I did find jumpshooting somewhat dumb with it and it could do well against other cqc weapons, i didn't find it too overpowering in cqc otherwise. I would have been happy with a jump shooting nerf along with reduced bloom recovery. But again, that didn't happen, so I settled with what they did, though I did say I didn't feel it was the right way to go about it initially. I just shut up about it and figured i might as well be happy they bothered to do anything. PMG was forgotten in the sense that almost no one used it because they all switched to NTEC. They also stopped mentioning it in nerf threads despite what used to be almost monthly threads on it. PMG was overbuffed in 2013. I know that, I used to use it prebuff. I even suggested on forums that it get buffed because the OCA was in a much better state (believe it or not i did want the original PMG buffed and never called to nerf the oca until they unnecessarily buffed it, in which i said revert it back to prebuff). After the buff it became too strong so i primarily used OCA instead and stuck with it and shotguns. It's not hard to struggle against a PMG, PMG has higher damage in comparison to the OCA. Most of the time I get tagged 2-3 hits with a pmg, think i can peak 5cm from the corner to finish a kill and die before i can blink because god knows why lol. OCA doesn't do that, the damage scales less harsh from OCA so even thinking of peaking is safer. "Plenty of people still use OCA" but go anywhere and you'll see far more PMGs, again, it got overbuffed. I don't want it hard nerfed, even if it's used a little more than OCA afterwords i'd be fine, however I feel they overbuffed it initially, and have stuck by that since 2013. Tap its range, crouch accuracy, or something slightly. pmg perc used to be the big thing several years ago as well, so nothing really changed on that end. Same ol' same ol'

You're right, people totally don't freak out after getting hit by a 65-85% shotgun blast, or 550 from scout. *eyeroll*

HVR ghostshots ring a bell ^,.,^

I still see a lot of ntecs, though there are fewer than there used to be, and other weapons have popped up. For a while there you'd end up going against full teams of 3-4 ntecs. You know, because it's balanced and all They'll jump on anyone and anything they know supported reworking/nerfing the NTEC. Even when the change was necessary, because they can't imagine that a weapon that overperformed most other weapons in the same niche was actually imbalanced. You seem to have the wrong idea consistently. I didn't like jump shooting, however I never called for jump shooting to be nerfed, in fact, while they were suggesting the said change in forums, I literally said I didn't think it was a good idea. (However, I won't complain about no longer getting corner jumped by a full auto spray either) So sorry not sorry. The "bloom feature" was from G1 years ago, and it didn't really even touch the problem that the ntec had anyways. As I stated a billion times and you haven't gotten through your head, I wanted the bloom recovery nerfed to 4.0. But at the point of the nerf I was happy about any change happening. Though G1's bloom change did make it a little more inconsistent, the weapon is consistent if you fire within the right tempo/rof. Keep calling it RNG if it makes you feel better. If you weren't firing it wrong it wouldn't be blooming so bad. And if g1's rework (it was litterally called a rework) hurt the weapon so much, it sure as hell wouldn't of been the number 1 AR afterwords for years. You mean the community that died because the cheaters, glitches, trash players, griefers, trolls, broken weapons, and tryhards scared away? Let me guess, I'm the "real" problem is because NTEC got nerfed. Keep calling me delusional, it's clear that you really are clueless. Nerfing the NTEC was intentional to make it so that OTHER MIDRANGE WEAPONS would be used MORE OFTEN. The literal point was to nerf it so other midrange weapons could shine a little bit more. The OBEYA, OBIR, and such really don't need a buff (though obir could use its range back) NTEC is still being used. I've still ran into teams with 2-3 of them in a group of 4, and I've played almost daily. Keep complaining and thinking that the NTEC was gutted. It wasn't. Is it good at cqc anymore? No, but that's the tradeoff of being good at midrange. It's not the "Jack of all trades" star. I've seen a number of more obeyas than obirs. Even seen a few FARs as well. I still see plenty of NTECs, as for Shotguns and PMGs? Imagine that, two weapons that used to be heavily used until shotgun nerf, and PMG got forgotten because NTEC became overused. (I can't imagine why anyone would use NTEC over PMG if the NTEC was balanced hmmm....) Yes, some people moved to the "pmg", you know, the CQC weapon that a ton of people have been calling a nerf for since it got overbuffed in 2013. But hey, best complain about the ntec nerf because NTEC kept it in check right? You think that it was balanced? You play the same game I did right? No of course you did, you just didn't care. You wanted your meta gun that was good at everything with no downsides. If you bothered to open your eyes you'd have realized the problems the NTEC's state was causing. But instead you'd rather complain about players having more midrange "options" than just ntec.

Gun seems fine. They nerfed the cqc capabilities on it but left midrange intact, it's still heavily used but you see more obeyas, obirs, and fars/stars now than you used to. Which was the intent of the change anyways, so i have no real issue with it.

Don't get me wrong, they literally are, but it's always fun to use them. The accuracy overtime one is the best one imo, and it's always fun to fire at people crossing the street and watching it get more accurate until they die lol. Even prefiring a corner then popping works with it which is hilarious. But yeah 14stk and .8ttk isn't very great for their accuracy. I mean, that's your opinion, which is fine, though I disagree. We really don't need smg's made more accurate to "combat corner camping". For their accuracy sub 15m they are fine as is. Making them that accurate would be worse off in many situations with cover, from corners, to crouched cover, because you just "fire at the tiny hitbox" and hitting extremely accurately at full auto. Taking out corner campers and playing cover right i get can be difficult (though i generally don't have issues with it), however cqc weapons shouldn't be reworked just to combat corners. There's a reason why you have grenades, and multiple ways into an objective, along with explosive weapons. If you're having issues try new tactics.

A while back G1 or LO had made it so that /who was essentially useless due to a minority of players using it to hunt down? certain players to grief them. I used to use it to find player names i knew but didn't have on friends list to group, and see who i could expect as opposition. I'd like at least some functionality of /who back as in its current state it feels useless. My suggestion is that once you tick the "searchable in district" UI button, that you then remain searchable via /who even when you relog/disconnect. That way you do not have to constantly recheck it. This would allow players to check it if they want to be searchable at all times until they manually uncheck the box.