Nerf N-HVR?

[Berkshire 38]

I say yes.

Edited May 28, 2018 by APBZombication

[MrChan 337]

The worst thing about this is that I can only vote yes once.

[HandThatFeeds 0]

the argument for the n-tec is that it's the most balanced weapon in the game and that other weapons should be brought up to it's standards, but the N-HVR is just a monster.. Increase time to switch by 30% and decrease damage to 700-750 and it'll be better

[-Rachel- 129]

It needs to do fractional damage at short range, and maybe (maybe) have it's damage reduced from 850 to like 775 or so.

[CommandantSteele 52]

I'm kinda on the fence about the whole thing. On one hand nearly every game now has a hard hitting sniper, so directly nerfing the damage is going to simply create another weapon on the pile of "useless crap" that we have for weapons.

 

At the same time, however, there are other ways to reduce it's effectiveness without harming the damage. I posted this a while ago as a mockup idea for how to change the HVR without exclusively removing its primary strength: 

 

 

Although, at the same time, if we nerf the damage of the HVR that would just make the scout more powerful, and AFAIK the scout is a paid only weapon... So you can imagine that the constant REEE of "APB IS PAY TO WIN!!!!!!!" would increase, replacing the constant REEEEE of "HVR OP NERF!"

 

Tough calls.

[Keshi 436]

HVR nerf will kill the purpose of it..remove 3PS from it and that would be the best nerf for it

[mongoose 30]

hvr needs a buff imo

[Songbearer 72]

I think you should remove all weapons and make the HVR a one-shot kill. Then add low gravity. Then make all the cars Vegas with Nitro 3 stuck permanently on.

[Guartorias 8]

"Nerf or buff"

"Yes or no"

.....

Yes.

Buff? Yes.

Nerf? Yes.

Maybe? Yes.

[MrChan 337]

45 minutes ago, Freewind said:

I'm kinda on the fence about the whole thing. On one hand nearly every game now has a hard hitting sniper, so directly nerfing the damage is going to simply create another weapon on the pile of "useless crap" that we have for weapons.

The issue with the N-HVR is that it's supposed to come with a mobility penalty as a tradeoff for being a hard-hitting sniper, but the ease and speed with which you can whip it out and set up a shot bypasses that mobility limitation. And it isn't like switching from a pistol into the HVR requires a lot of skill, because I pulled it out in FC last week having not used in months and was able to land shots in CQC. And I'm not especially good at this game.

 

I do agree that it could possibly be balanced without changing the damage. They should increase the equip time (or disable 3PS on it) and increase the length of time it takes to zoom in & get the crosshairs to settle after moving and see how it works for a little while. Only if it's still problematic, should they look at the damage.

[MrM0dZ 55]

people will rage about every sniper rifle in games,even COD people complain about because they get 1 shot killed from snipers.

snipers are supossed to have a HIGH damage,if they didn't have such damage people would simply use DMRs or assault rifles and the game wouldn't have people using different weapons.

Since they have a much lower fire rate the damage have a point to be there,osmaw used to fire instantly and people complained so they added a delay,now tell me 1 other game that has a rocket launcher that needs time before launching a rocket.

If you don't like HVR,just counter it,corner the guy using it or just don't expose yourself in the open.

git gud already

[RespectThis 121]

As i've said before with clanmates and friends. I feel like it would be better if they just removed the HVR and replaced it with the scout. Then have the DMR as the long range sniper. Thats just my personal opinion on it. Though i know thats pretty unlikely. I think they do need to lower the base damage of the hvr. It is to high for what it is. Removing Three Point Sling (3ps) won't solve it. Its not about the quick switching its about the massive amount of damage it can output in such little time. 850 damage is alot of damage and takes quite a long time to recover from regardless the health regen you have. You're allow to miss quite a couple follow up shots and can still execute a target that only you have tagged. I also feel that the damage needs to be lowered so that its not 2 shotting at long range. That way it will make the DMR stand out more for what its suppose to be.

[Lord Cashpoint 269]

28 minutes ago, MrM0dZ said:

people will rage about every sniper rifle in games,even COD people complain about because they get 1 shot killed from snipers.

snipers are supossed to have a HIGH damage,if they didn't have such damage people would simply use DMRs or assault rifles and the game wouldn't have people using different weapons.
 

You can use other games for inspiration when it comes to balancing APB, but you can't use them for justification. In other games, sniper rifles often come with a whole range of drawbacks and design decisions simply not present in APB.

 

The HVR as it stands at 850 damage per shot is absolutely absurd. I don't see why it can't be brought down to around the 750 range with a reverse damage drop-off mechanic similar to the DMR.

 

[MrM0dZ 55]

1 minute ago, Lord Cashpoint said:

You can use other games for inspiration when it comes to balancing APB, but you can't use them for justification. In other games, sniper rifles often come with a whole range of drawbacks and design decisions simply not present in APB.

 

The HVR as it stands at 850 damage per shot is absolutely absurd. I don't see why it can't be brought down to around the 750 range with a reverse damage drop-off mechanic similar to the DMR.

 

lowering the damage to 750 would be fair, but people are trying to turn it into a DMR

[CommandantSteele 52]

2 minutes ago, Lord Cashpoint said:

You can use other games for inspiration when it comes to balancing APB, but you can't use them for justification. In other games, sniper rifles often come with a whole range of drawbacks and design decisions simply not present in APB.

 

The HVR as it stands at 850 damage per shot is absolutely absurd. I don't see why it can't be brought down to around the 750 range with a reverse damage drop-off mechanic similar to the DMR.

 

I'll throw my hat at telling you why: The Scout.

 

You nerf the damge of the 762, and the scout indirectly gets stronger. It might not be as accurate on hipfire, but it's good enough and typically you're not trying to hipfire anyway. So if you nerf the damage down to 750 or 650, the scout still has 550 damage. The scout is also much more mobile, though it lacks any open slot options. With the same TTK and same STK as the now-nerfed 762, there's little reason not to use the scout due to the inherent advantage it provides in mobility, because mobility can be a real lifesaver if you get jumped. The 762 is now freshly on top of the pile of weapons called "useless" by the community.

 

So the damage is literally the only reason why the 762 is viable at all. If it wasn't as strong it's easily replaced by the scout for the variety of bonuses to movement the scout has, not to mention the potential return of jump-shooting. (Please no.) Getting into position to keep fire on the enemy team is really, really powerful, even if it's only indirectly. 

[Lord Cashpoint 269]

15 minutes ago, Freewind said:

You nerf the damge of the 762, and the scout indirectly gets stronger. It might not be as accurate on hipfire, but it's good enough and typically you're not trying to hipfire anyway. So if you nerf the damage down to 750 or 650, the scout still has 550 damage. The scout is also much more mobile, though it lacks any open slot options. With the same TTK and same STK as the now-nerfed 762, there's little reason not to use the scout due to the inherent advantage it provides in mobility, because mobility can be a real lifesaver if you get jumped.



 

I think just as a general rule you'd want something like this to happen, more variety is always good. 

 

The 200 damage difference between 550 and 750 isn't insignificant however. To survive a second scout shot, you only have to regenerate 100 health. To survive a second 750 damage shot, you have to regenerate 500 health. That would be where the HVR's key strength would lie, in suppressing players (but without being as oppressive as it is right now). It would also be important to mention the HVR's longer range, allowing it to two shot up to 100m, something the Scout is incapable of.

 

I agree that it is dangerous to over-nerf weapons, but I don't believe anything can realistically justify the position the HVR is currently in.

[moxxichixx 148]

WHAT A TRICKY QUESTION...

 

YES BUFF AND NERF HVR!? wtf m8... How can we answer this is not a "Yes or No" question.

[CommandantSteele 52]

19 minutes ago, Lord Cashpoint said:

 

I think just as a general rule you'd want something like this to happen, more variety is always good. 

 

The 200 damage difference between 550 and 750 isn't insignificant however. To survive a second scout shot, you only have to regenerate 100 health. To survive a second 750 damage shot, you have to regenerate 500 health. That would be where the HVR's key strength would lie, in suppressing players (but without being as oppressive as it is right now). It would also be important to mention the HVR's longer range, allowing it to two shot up to 100m, something the Scout is incapable of.

 

I agree that it is dangerous to over-nerf weapons, but I don't believe anything can realistically justify the position the HVR is currently in.

A good counterpoint. However, on the case of the scout not having enough range, I present this: http://apbdb.com/items/Weapon_SniperRifle_Pathfinder-LR_PR2_Armas/

Edited May 28, 2018 by Freewind

[Lato 188]

I'd play APB more if it wasn't for that broken sniper and the n-tec, is so boring to face people that use those constantly and try their hardest to win this game like it was esports

[-Rachel- 129]

19 minutes ago, Lato said:

I'd play APB more if it wasn't for that broken sniper and the n-tec, is so boring to face people that use those constantly and try their hardest to win this game like it was esports

Agreed, though maybe not to the same intensity. It is boring to fight them though.

[YumaKirosaki 32]

Lol, god I really hope they don't touch the HVR. Thankfully Matt stated he was happy with the balance as it is now so the point is already dead anyway.

Sniper rifles kill in one hit on headshot in most games anyway (and in some games, even body shots are enough), and if they don't a two shot is pretty typical. I've had far more trouble dealing with constant sidestrafing close range enemies and shoulder peeking shotguns than I've ever had against HVR users, and even then I think they're at a fine point too. If you're having issue with an HVR, just have someone switch to an HVR.

Now, maybe they could fix some of the silly gimmicks you can get away with -- like how people can uncrouch instantly, fire the HVR, and then crouch again. Or jumping HVR shots. But I wouldn't lose any sleep if they didn't touch that either. I think their efforts are better placed elsewhere.

[-Rachel- 129]

8 minutes ago, YumaKirosaki said:

Lol, god I really hope they don't touch the HVR. Thankfully Matt stated he was happy with the balance as it is now so the point is already dead anyway.

Sniper rifles kill in one hit on headshot in most games anyway (and in some games, even body shots are enough), and if they don't a two shot is pretty typical. I've had far more trouble dealing with constant sidestrafing close range enemies and shoulder peeking shotguns than I've ever had against HVR users, and even then I think they're at a fine point too. If you're having issue with an HVR, just have someone switch to an HVR.

Now, maybe they could fix some of the silly gimmicks you can get away with -- like how people can uncrouch instantly, fire the HVR, and then crouch again. Or jumping HVR shots. But I wouldn't lose any sleep if they didn't touch that either. I think their efforts are better placed elsewhere.

No one's saying it shouldn't remain a two shot, but it does too much overall damage, and certainly too much damage at short range.

[RespectThis 121]

21 minutes ago, YumaKirosaki said:

Lol, god I really hope they don't touch the HVR. Thankfully Matt stated he was happy with the balance as it is now so the point is already dead anyway.

Sniper rifles kill in one hit on headshot in most games anyway (and in some games, even body shots are enough), and if they don't a two shot is pretty typical. I've had far more trouble dealing with constant sidestrafing close range enemies and shoulder peeking shotguns than I've ever had against HVR users, and even then I think they're at a fine point too. If you're having issue with an HVR, just have someone switch to an HVR.

Now, maybe they could fix some of the silly gimmicks you can get away with -- like how people can uncrouch instantly, fire the HVR, and then crouch again. Or jumping HVR shots. But I wouldn't lose any sleep if they didn't touch that either. I think their efforts are better placed elsewhere.

The argument of snipers one shot killing in other games is irrelevant. In regards to your comment about switching to an hvr to counter an hvr is rather stupid. You shouldn't be forced into using an hvr because someone else is using one. Not many people that i've gone against or play with switch to a weapon to mirror another player. Hvr is the only one that really is like that. Even the old ntec (still hate that they changed it) doesn't compare to the hvr. No other sniper has that kind of damage or suppression. The DMR only comes close at 85m out but even then the hvr is just as effective. It needs to be brought inbetween the dmr and the scout. Its stronger than the scout but not stronger than the DMR at long range.

[IChristy 6]

I'm fine with the N-hvr itself, all I want them to do is fix the gawd damn quick switching.

[Sniperturtle 65]

Only thing i'd think of for the HVR is to gradually increase its damage with range, making it useless at ranges below 50m.

Edited May 29, 2018 by Sniperturtle