Anti-Cheat Discussion

[Darkzero3802 611]

22 hours ago, 404 said:

we have BE right now, what are you talking about?

 

 

we've had 3 different client side file monitoring anticheats and 1 server side statistical analysis anticheat, what other kind of anticheat is even available at this point?

Weve had BE once before in the past is what im talking about. How bout a client side, server side anticheat file monitoring and more active GMs in game?

[CookiePuss 5378]

8 minutes ago, Darkzero3802 said:

and more active GMs in game?

How could you possibly know the amount of GM activity?

[iRawwwN 283]

idk sorry to say but i feel like the switch to BE failed, and u guys just look at the numbers of players banned and say "yea thats good enough"...

 

Last 30 Days 390.8 average, that's a sad statistic...

 

idc about the "but what about the players who dont use steam" argument, it's just sad

 

thanks LO for the past few years of keeping the game afloat u guys done ur best

[Uhtdred 238]

On 8/22/2020 at 4:29 PM, CookiePuss said:

EAC banned for cheats so I dunno what you are on about.

You think EAC detects cheats and just kicks you til you disable them?

That some pretty wild logic.

 

The facts still remains, BE is catching and banning more cheaters than EAC leading to fewer cheaters, not more.

I said it on the other post.

 

I have yet to see A SINGLE CHEATER in NA with battle eye.

 

Max amount of cheaters faced during battle eye: 0

Max amount of cheaters faced during EAC: A LOT.

[Motorola 107]

2 hours ago, Uhtdred said:

I said it on the other post.

 

I have yet to see A SINGLE CHEATER in NA with battle eye.

 

Max amount of cheaters faced during battle eye: 0

Max amount of cheaters faced during EAC: A LOT.

Theres still a couple of players bypassing BE on NA and I also see low ranks going full blatant in FC but after a while I don't see them anymore.

 

With EAC I saw alot of players triggerbotting and with BE I see alot less.

 

Are there still players cheating? I believe so, but I feel like the pop dropped cause of there being less available cheats with BE... sad to say. Once BE took over I seen way less players and its a pretty drastic drop on NA atleast.

[FakeBungo 248]

On 8/21/2020 at 11:40 PM, Frosi said:

While I want to say that those numbers are indeed impressive I also want to mention that APB has rarely ever had an issue with blatant cheating (Shaw copters) outside of a hand full of time periods such as when a certain cheat went public and for everyone to download. 

 

APB's real issue with cheating lies in the closeting area with people running their cheats on very low settings that still let them compete / consistently beat the top 1% of players through means of narrow FoV aimbots, smooth aim and silent aim. It is this type of cheating that has become more common with the switch to BE again, same goes for basic Triggerbots and Macroing, both have seen a noticable increase and even at the most blatant level of triggerbotting / macroing these players are getting away with what appears no problems at all. I've personally seen multiple dodgy and one extremely blatant example of triggerbotting players that are playing daily and have not been banned under BattlEye even tho they've been going since it was implemented and I am sure there are many many more.

 

If you want to stick with BE moving forward it is this type of cheating that has to be combated as the idea of being a good player and wanting to play on a high level starts to mean less and less, eventually getting back to a point where you simply do not know who is cheating and who isn't anymore, this was the case after FF was made automated. 

"APB has rarely ever had an issue with blatant cheating"

LMAOOOOOO

 

is SPCT job to just lie on LO's behalf?

On 8/22/2020 at 2:11 PM, Shui said:

Question: Do you think you are part of the top 1%?

i am #1

 

Merged.

 

On 8/22/2020 at 10:47 AM, Kysali said:

I mean, its been stated before. Its hard to actually tell if someone is hacking or just has been playing the game for a decade. The player skill makes a huge difference.
And yea, you will be called a cheater all the time, that is just part of FPS culture, The current setup of the playerbase doesnt really help that either. As you have mainly veterans with tens of thousands of hours in the game and newbies.
I am more of the latter. But I get called cheater just as often as I feel that someone is cheating.
Fact of the matter is, usually, the issue is dethreating, and the server population causing you to be in extremely unbalanced fights.
That isnt helped, by the fact, that a lot of veterans also create smurfs, which then leads to you getting killed ten times in a mission by a bronze R10 player, just cause they are better.
Perhaps in some cases, there are also Macros at play, which... well neither EAC nor BE can reliably detect (as almost no anti-cheat can)

But of course it quickly seems like hacks.

To be honest though... higher ban numbers mean nothing. How many of those are false positives? How many bans are actually handed out in total?
Switching to a new Anti cheat will always result in more bans, because of course, you for one catch people, that didnt get the memo, and cheat without protection from the new anti-cheat, people who create throwaway accounts, to create new cheats, but also, because bugs in the new anti-cheat will result in more false positives, which means people get banned, that did do nothing wrong.
So kinda important to know, if the amount of people who are texting support to get their falsely banned accounts back also increased in that time.
Not to mention of course, if you had a sudden influx of "new players" that then ended up getting banned, or if those bans were handed out to accounts with a lot of playtime.

Ultimately, the tool used doesnt matter as much as how it is used. Any anti-cheat will have ways to be circumvented. As any anti-cheat, just as any anti-virus can only look for specific methods and programs, and monitor specific files and behaviors. If it did more, it would either infringe in privacy, or become so resource heavy, it wouldnt be viable to be run alongside a game anymore.
And just as any anti-virus, any anti-cheat will usually have more false positives than correct hits.

I cant say, if people actually get banned for hacking. Heck I cant even say if there are any actual hackers in the game.
What I can say though, is that I have game crashes that result in redownloading of files, most likely due to the anti-cheat at least once a week, and that a friend of mine, got kicked for cheating, when they absolutely werent.
That stuff is kinda annoying, noone likes getting a CTD in the middle of a mission or a kick in the middle of a mission, due to the anti-cheat not working correctly.

I am with Todesklinge, having a paywall, even if just a minor one, would be a vastly better protection against cheaters, than any anti-cheat.

actually it takes about 5 seconds to work out if somebody is cheating

1. are they low IQ

2. do they have low IQ but also aim really well

3. they are cheating

[Motorola 107]

41 minutes ago, FakeBungo said:

"APB has rarely ever had an issue with blatant cheating"

LMAOOOOOO

 

is SPCT job to just lie on LO's behalf?

i am #1

I sometimes think that EU players dont consider it cheating unless they are speedhacking and 360 spinning/snapping with a shaw on a very low rank account.... otherwise its just not cheating.

[CookiePuss 5378]

9 minutes ago, Motorola said:

I sometimes think that EU players dont consider it cheating unless they are speedhacking and 360 spinning/snapping with a shaw on a very low rank account.... otherwise its just not cheating.

No, that's his point... blatant cheaters get caught and banned. Closets get away with it.

[SmilyFace 300]

Would be happy to pay even 29,99 € for the game again, like back in the old good days.

F2P is pure garbage, and has been destroyed in these last years.

[Mitne 724]

What any anti-cheat be it EAC or BE need to focus about is closetting and that was my main point ever since I started playing this game.

Even right now without pointing names I can say we have players who in-game are top tiers in every matches you encounter them in but somehow this doesn't translate to veteran knowledge about this game.

 

Blatants were never a problem. Everyone can see them, GM won't have real breaks to get rid of em as they are visibly cheating. And people easily distance themselves from them, even if they are active during their sessions.

 

Closets on other hand. Pretend they are someone they really aren't via cheating meaning really skilled players are pushed back by them. Disguise themselves as rightful "veterans" of game as to undermine game progress (I mean if there would be some independent anti-cheat which would prove 99,9% cases of closets they would stand idly? Nah. Same goes for some of changes proposed here which got strangely bombarded by some people not normally active on this forum - just saying). They fakely elevate already steep skill curve of this game. The worst though is - they pretend to be me or you - so they will not look like cheaters but they are. And they constantly gaining advantage via them.

 

So closets won't use your blatant aim, just smooth one, which would be something which would pretend very skilled hand in games. They won't usually use WH as human nature would make them follow targets they shouldn't see. They would probably use ESP, after all in most cases, it's very hard if not impossible to prove that you didn't just happen to look in some direction - and it's still pair of additional eyes. etc. etc.

 

So focus more on closets, blatants we will report.

[wHisHi 206]

On 8/26/2020 at 8:15 AM, Mitne said:

What any anti-cheat be it EAC or BE need to focus about is closetting and that was my main point ever since I started playing this game.

Even right now without pointing names I can say we have players who in-game are top tiers in every matches you encounter them in but somehow this doesn't translate to veteran knowledge about this game.

 

Blatants were never a problem. Everyone can see them, GM won't have real breaks to get rid of em as they are visibly cheating. And people easily distance themselves from them, even if they are active during their sessions.

 

Closets on other hand. Pretend they are someone they really aren't via cheating meaning really skilled players are pushed back by them. Disguise themselves as rightful "veterans" of game as to undermine game progress (I mean if there would be some independent anti-cheat which would prove 99,9% cases of closets they would stand idly? Nah. Same goes for some of changes proposed here which got strangely bombarded by some people not normally active on this forum - just saying). They fakely elevate already steep skill curve of this game. The worst though is - they pretend to be me or you - so they will not look like cheaters but they are. And they constantly gaining advantage via them.

 

So closets won't use your blatant aim, just smooth one, which would be something which would pretend very skilled hand in games. They won't usually use WH as human nature would make them follow targets they shouldn't see. They would probably use ESP, after all in most cases, it's very hard if not impossible to prove that you didn't just happen to look in some direction - and it's still pair of additional eyes. etc. etc.

 

So focus more on closets, blatants we will report.

I hate them, really do, and they will never admit doing that

 

Merged.

 

On 8/25/2020 at 4:42 AM, AlishaHutt said:

Would be happy to pay even 29,99 € for the game again, like back in the old good days.

F2P is pure garbage, and has been destroyed in these last years.

Me too, even 39,99€ is ok if game is being maintained as any other decent game.

Edited August 26, 2020 by wHisHi

[Infinito 100]

Not sure how everyone seems to know that BE is so much worse than EAC. Other than just assuming it due to the population drop.

[Running Eagle 16]

On 8/21/2020 at 4:40 PM, Frosi said:

... as the idea of being a good player and wanting to play on a high level starts to mean less and less...

Everything you said was spot-on, but this, this quote here, made me want to cry happy tears of joy.  I love you for this.

[FakeBungo 248]

On 8/25/2020 at 2:07 PM, CookiePuss said:

No, that's his point... blatant cheaters get caught and banned. Closets get away with it.

A closet isn't somebody we don't know is cheating... a closet is someone who pretends they aren't. But we know basically every closet in APB, Matt has literally stated they don't want to ban people because apparently thats toxic somehow...

[Kevkof 806]

2 minutes ago, FakeBungo said:

Matt has literally stated they don't want to ban people because apparently thats toxic somehow...

Can you quote that for us? ... 

I'm smelling bs

Edited August 28, 2020 by Kevkof

[Motorola 107]

On 8/24/2020 at 10:07 PM, CookiePuss said:

No, that's his point... blatant cheaters get caught and banned. Closets get away with it.

idk i see some pretty blatant aimbotters and wallers on NA... not many anymore but you'd have to be high af on drugs to not suspect some of these players.... and i suspect that since most players are from colby maybe thats the case with weed being legal now and all everywhere in the west.

[FakeBungo 248]

5 minutes ago, Kevkof said:

Can you quote that for us? ... 

I'm smelling bs

thats more or less what he said in the first kemp Q&A

[Kevkof 806]

1 hour ago, FakeBungo said:

thats more or less what he said in the first kemp Q&A

More or less doesn't mean that's what it says...

 

The transcript: https://forums.gamersfirst.com/topic/208-transcript-for-the-apb-qa-session-one/

 

Optimally they don't need to ban anyone, but that doesn't mean they don't ban.

Saying that you'd rather not ban players just means that you want to remove some of the reasons of why people start to cheat in the first place

Edited August 28, 2020 by Kevkof

[Atomkraftwerk 29]

On 8/23/2020 at 8:12 PM, iRawwwN said:

idk sorry to say but i feel like the switch to BE failed, and u guys just look at the numbers of players banned and say "yea thats good enough"...

 

Last 30 Days 390.8 average, that's a sad statistic...

 

idc about the "but what about the players who dont use steam" argument, it's just sad

 

thanks LO for the past few years of keeping the game afloat u guys done ur best

Yeah nice move from LO !

I love Battle Eye and used it on my ARMA 3 Server ,and it can be tuned right, so that it will ban cheater even immediatly,I remember one time, back then ,when I invited  one guy from my APB clan to join

on my ARMA 3 server, and everytime he joined and fired his AK 47 he got kicked, at first I didnt know why, til I checked the BE logs and learned that, he was using a macro, or maybe a triggerbot ,

it wasnt fair play so he always got kicked. I could even change it to a ban.

However I believe in a fine tuned Battle Eye Anticheat ,and tbh if the majority of this games population ,only play this game with cheats ,then to hell with them,no need em at all .

Edited August 28, 2020 by Atomkraftwerk

[vsb 6171]

6 hours ago, FakeBungo said:

thats more or less what he said in the first kemp Q&A

thats some heavy interpretation

[Darkzero3802 611]

On 8/24/2020 at 10:07 PM, CookiePuss said:

No, that's his point... blatant cheaters get caught and banned. Closets get away with it.

Exactly the point of most here. Closets continue to get away with it and nothing is being stepped up to stop them and or ban them. There are a good number of closets out there and ppl are sick and tired of them and the fact they get away with it while the same anti cheat formula is used that doesnt catch these people. The community wants more done and LO isnt listening to that plain and simple.

[CookiePuss 5378]

1 minute ago, Darkzero3802 said:

Exactly the point of most here. Closets continue to get away with it and nothing is being stepped up to stop them and or ban them. There are a good number of closets out there and ppl are sick and tired of them and the fact they get away with it while the same anti cheat formula is used that doesnt catch these people. The community wants more done and LO isnt listening to that plain and simple.

Luckily I play Jericho.

I cant even name a sus player.

[Motorola 107]

4 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

Luckily I play Jericho.

I cant even name a sus player.

in the silver district right? i agree with darkwolf... same dudes who been cheating since forever are still there bypassing everything thats being used to try and stop them. its even more annoying with how low the pop is now

[CookiePuss 5378]

7 minutes ago, Motorola said:

in the silver district right?

Yeah.

No fight club tho.

[Motorola 107]

3 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

Yeah.

No fight club tho.

oh you must be enforcer only then? or playing apb drunk af/high etc?

Edited August 29, 2020 by Motorola