Are LMGs still relevant?

[PotatoeGirl 220]

I will start by saying that I love the Alig. However, I can't seems to find any good use for it. Everyone is running around with vegases and vans.

So far I haven't seen any LMGs being used outside of 1 alig and 1 shaw.

 

Everyone is using ntecs and shotguns. Not even the snipers are getting much love.

 

When we are on the topic, which ones are the best alig and shaw mods to have? I have lost some track.

 

[illgot 379]

LMGs are fun but when it comes down to trying to win I always end up going back to the Ntec/Obeya.

[CookiePuss 5378]

HB2 NSSW is pretty sick

[TCRisky 9]

Most of the LMG’s I see are SHAWs. I was put up against a team of 4 max rank golds using all modded SHAWs. 

[SunnyMonroe 180]

SWARM, NSSW, AMG all three are pretty awsome guns

I play alot LMG personaly

 

NSSW is an heavy N-TEC slower but longer range

AMG is a big SMG that also is doin good at mid + mid/long ranges 

SWARM is inspired by ALIG it has less hard dmg but to me its the better choise when u wanna kill ppl

[CookiePuss 5378]

10 minutes ago, SunnyMonroe said:

NSSW is an heavy N-TEC slower

I still don't understand why people say this. 

 

NSSW is a full auto monster. HB2 improves it's already minimal bloom without adding stk, alllowing you to min ttk up to around 50m just by holding mouse 1. It's also less mobile, and the only mod I use on both is HS3. 

 

 

 

 

[PotatoeGirl 220]

1 hour ago, SunnyMonroe said:

SWARM is inspired by ALIG it has less hard dmg but to me its the better choise when u wanna kill ppl

Seems like my cup of tea.

 

I like the nssw too. 

[GhosT 1301]

Quite irrelevant in the N-TEC meta, they have no place other than the ALIG destroying/stopping vegases? vegasi? that people run away in.

[SunnyMonroe 180]

2 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

I still don't understand why people say this. 

 

I say it cuz to me it is like that

And i will try HB2 but i usually use IR3 its still good at full auto

[vsb 6171]

i'd say LMGs have never really been relevant, the increased difficulty of use just to get the same (or less) performance as other weapons is a pretty big roadblock for the category

 

the "best" LMGs atm are the ones that don't function like LMGs (at least in apb) are intended to - the nssw is basically an assault rifle, the swarm has increased accuracy while moving, the euryale is more accurate, and all three weapons have faster movement speed when equipped allowing them to be used more aggressively and react to unexpected situations better

 

 

Edited January 15, 2020 by Solamente
typo

[trashpanda 36]

38 minutes ago, Solamente said:

i'd say LMGs have never really been relevant, the increased difficulty of use just to get the same (or less) performance as other weapons is a pretty big roadblock for the category

 

the "best" LMGs atm are the ones that don't function like LMGs (at least in apb) are intended to - the nssw is basically an assault rifle, the swarm has increased accuracy while moving, the euryale is more accurate, and all three weapons have faster movement speed when equipped allowing them to be used more aggressively and react to unexpected situations better

 

 

This. LMGs are certainly not relevant to the game as it is. They take way too long to blow up a car compared to an explosive weapon (grenades, OSMAW, OPGL, the legendary rocket launcher). The only upside they have is you can keep sustained fire on a vehicle that's moving, but you can easily have that by standing on a car following the target with an OSMAW. LMGs are terrible at close range, and most of them suck at long range too, at least compared to assault rifles/rifles. They are not viable in any way, because there are tons of guns that could fill in the gap. I thing LMGs need a buff in their ttk or at the very least a buff to their hard damage so they can at least be an alternative to the OSMAW. What they lack in mobility certainly is not made up for in any other way. Perhaps a bipod mod could be added so that they can be used crouching with no recoil or simply anything that would make them more usable and a solid alternative.

[vsb 6171]

4 minutes ago, trashpanda said:

This. LMGs are certainly not relevant to the game as it is. They take way too long to blow up a car compared to an explosive weapon (grenades, OSMAW, OPGL, the legendary rocket launcher). The only upside they have is you can keep sustained fire on a vehicle that's moving, but you can easily have that by standing on a car following the target with an OSMAW. LMGs are terrible at close range, and most of them suck at long range too, at least compared to assault rifles/rifles. They are not viable in any way, because there are tons of guns that could fill in the gap. I thing LMGs need a buff in their ttk or at the very least a buff to their hard damage so they can at least be an alternative to the OSMAW. What they lack in mobility certainly is not made up for in any other way. Perhaps a bipod mod could be added so that they can be used crouching with no recoil or simply anything that would make them more usable and a solid alternative.

its a delicate issue because lmgs can cover so many ranges effectively, too much of a buff could really throw balance off 

 

i saw an interesting suggestion a while back (from @Lord Cashpoint iirc) that lmgs should have the same accuracy whether crouching or standing, and crouching should decrease recoil instead of increasing initial accuracy, i think that would be a good place to start with lmgs

[Lord Cashpoint 269]

2 hours ago, Solamente said:

i saw an interesting suggestion a while back (from @Lord Cashpoint iirc) that lmgs should have the same accuracy whether crouching or standing, and crouching should decrease recoil instead of increasing initial accuracy, i think that would be a good place to start with lmgs

 

That was me!

 

For me what puts me off all the LMGs except for perhaps N-SSW is that their standing accuracy is usually pretty poor. This actually means there's huge parts of the map where you can't even use the weapons because you need to stand up to fire (The highway in Financial, or the mall in Waterfront are great examples of this), and addition it means you can't stand up from behind cover to fire at someone, you often have to expose your entire character in order to use the gun. If instead the penalty for standing up was heightened recoil, it would mean that LMGs could at least be used in an aggressive role by firing in short bursts, with longer periods of fire requiring the user to crouch.

 

LMGs already suffer from having to be stationary to operate, which in APB is a massive disadvantage. Yet in APB, they're also given poor standing accuracy, strong recoil, long reloads and subpar hipfire to deal with. No other weapon class is disadvantaged in some many aspects, and it's no wonder that they remain perennially unpopular weapons.

 

The standing accuracy change would be a great help to LMGs, but I suspect what would improve them most would be to give them some room to breath. Since 2014 with the release of the Troublemaker, we've seen a slew of weapons with increasing low TTKs. This has meant that the one big selling point of LMGs which is that they kill fast is not as relevant as it could be. But TTK balancing is a topic that goes beyond the scope of just LMGs.

[vsb 6171]

17 minutes ago, Lord Cashpoint said:

The standing accuracy change would be a great help to LMGs, but I suspect what would improve them most would be to give them some room to breath. Since 2014 with the release of the Troublemaker, we've seen a slew of weapons with increasing low TTKs. This has meant that the one big selling point of LMGs which is that they kill fast is not as relevant as it could be. But TTK balancing is a topic that goes beyond the scope of just LMGs.

can't say i want to decrease traditional lmg ttks any lower tho, especially with the range they have

 

if the recoil/initial accuracy changes aren't enough i think i would lighten all lmgs to give them slightly more mobility instead

[Fortune Runner 796]

14 hours ago, HawtGirl said:

I will start by saying that I love the Alig. However, I can't seems to find any good use for it. Everyone is running around with vegases and vans.

So far I haven't seen any LMGs being used outside of 1 alig and 1 shaw.

 

Everyone is using ntecs and shotguns. Not even the snipers are getting much love.

 

When we are on the topic, which ones are the best alig and shaw mods to have? I have lost some track.

 

alig = car killer

[illgot 379]

8 hours ago, trashpanda said:

This. LMGs are certainly not relevant to the game as it is. They take way too long to blow up a car compared to an explosive weapon (grenades, OSMAW, OPGL, the legendary rocket launcher). The only upside they have is you can keep sustained fire on a vehicle that's moving, but you can easily have that by standing on a car following the target with an OSMAW. LMGs are terrible at close range, and most of them suck at long range too, at least compared to assault rifles/rifles. They are not viable in any way, because there are tons of guns that could fill in the gap. I thing LMGs need a buff in their ttk or at the very least a buff to their hard damage so they can at least be an alternative to the OSMAW. What they lack in mobility certainly is not made up for in any other way. Perhaps a bipod mod could be added so that they can be used crouching with no recoil or simply anything that would make them more usable and a solid alternative.

Dog-ear is probably better over all when it comes to damaging vehicles than the Alig.  Just because the Dog-ear has mobility and can be used hanging outside a car window.

[Fuechslein 11]

In my opinion a big problem of especially the alig and AV weapons in general is high burn fuel. Good players will always get out in time and then use the car wreck as cover and fuck you up. Just make it so that using high burn fuel makes your car wreck disappears instantly. Would give high burn fuel a little downside and make heavy AV weapons more rewarding to play.

[Hexerin 1140]

Just now, Fuechslein said:

In my opinion a big problem of especially the alig and AV weapons in general is high burn fuel. Good players will always get out in time and then use the car wreck as cover and fuck you up. Just make it so that using high burn fuel makes your car wreck disappears instantly. Would give high burn fuel a little downside and make heavy AV weapons more rewarding to play.

Honestly, they should just remove High Burn Fuel (and a few of the other r195 mods G1/RG added) from the game. Completely altered the entire balance scale of the game, and I'd argue not for the better. It'll never happen though, because the "terrified of change clique" would lose their collective minds and rage across the forum to force Little Orbit to revert it.

[Specia 11]

18 hours ago, HawtGirl said:

I will start by saying that I love the Alig. However, I can't seems to find any good use for it. Everyone is running around with vegases and vans.

So far I haven't seen any LMGs being used outside of 1 alig and 1 shaw.

 

Everyone is using ntecs and shotguns. Not even the snipers are getting much love.

 

When we are on the topic, which ones are the best alig and shaw mods to have? I have lost some track.

 

the alig are fun to use when you have car surfer  im in love with the medusa.

[Ohshii 215]

I dunno what you guys are talking about due the fact that I didn't read any of the posts other than the OP lol, but for what it's worth the Case KO is still the best car killing LMG by a metric landslide, no question. The ISSR Dog Ear is a close second followed by the DMR AV. While the OP mentioned LMGs, Case for cars, Shaws for players. Crouch cornercamping with a Shaw + CJ3 you literally cannot lose if you have good aim. However, for what it's worth, if player killing is involved along with car killing, the ISSR Dog Ear dominates by a metric landslide.

 

Car killing only, I'd pick the Case KO no question no matter what. Aligs stopped being good years ago, well before the Case KO and the ISSR were introduced. Aligs got over-shadowed by the CSG long before it got nerfed, then the PMG beat it out for car/player killing, followed by the introduction of the DMR-AV. Then years later the ISSR was brought in. Aligs were NEVER worth using past OBT/Steam release and are still a basically a useless gun to this day. ISSR/DMR-AV/Stock DMR/JG Shotgun and Case KO make the Alig look like total trash as they provide less recoil, better ttks and more overall value to a team at any given stage, even on full time car missions. Hell a stock OPGL beats an alig vs vehicles if you can hit the car with a single nade. Even a Shaw is better LMG than Alig because it eats players alive whereas an Alig has 1 job and it's been years since it was the best at said job.

 

Even G1 put a free gun on armas that beats the alig by a metric landslide if ya spent the cash that functions like a better shaw, it's the eurayle or wtf it's called lol. Medusa for JB variants. Corner camp + crouch, you will out ttk everything if you have remotely decent aim; which includes vs NFAS and True Ogres which make your bullets disappear when using 99% of all the guns in the game, except for the shaw/medusa/eurayle point blank range.

 

Best corner camping shaw/medusa/eurayle player I ever seen; PinkyPie. Destroyed everybody in the district corner camping with a Shaw for months. Frustrating AF to play against but couldnt hate but respect the gameplay lol. gg.

 

Edit: Drunk Korean grammar, hahaha

Edited January 16, 2020 by Ohshii

[Hexerin 1140]

3 hours ago, Ohshii said:

Case KO make the Alig look like total trash as they provide less recoil, better ttks and more overall value to a team at any given stage, even on full time car missions.

[Intake 27]

Only the ALIG was ever good - SHAW was just a lol rage-cheat weapon back in the day.

 

Actually, that's not true, SHAW is still incredible with HS3, and IR3.

 

 

[Uhtdred 235]

euryale still really really relevant.

[CookiePuss 5378]

6 hours ago, Fuechslein said:

In my opinion a big problem of especially the alig and AV weapons in general is high burn fuel. Good players will always get out in time and then use the car wreck as cover and fuck you up. Just make it so that using high burn fuel makes your car wreck disappears instantly. Would give high burn fuel a little downside and make heavy AV weapons more rewarding to play.

Are you for some reason out in the open and trying to trade fire with an assault rifle or something?

Not to mention you can shoot under any car.

[Uhtdred 235]

4 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

Are you for some reason out in the open and trying to trade fire with an assault rifle or something?

Not to mention you can shoot under any car.

sometimes you can't shoot under cars who were blew up tho. There's no red crosshair depending on how cars are laying on the floor.