shft 74 Posted May 16, 2019 Releasing the new game mode as well as the engine at the current state of the game is going to be a huge mistake, I understand that you want to release both as close together as possible. However, I don’t think you should be delaying fixing the current game because of that. A lot of the players who quit the game quit because of the state the game was in and not because the lack of content. Besides from what we’ve seen from Riot it seems like it’s a far way from being finished and should probably be put to the side for now imo. Currently there are tons of broken things in the game, many of whom you’ve broken after patches/events. If the engine were to be released in the current state that the game is currently I’m afraid most of the players who come back to check out the engine and the gamemode would just leave again after realising that the basics of the game actually somehow got worse than before and the same problems still persist. Things that needs to be fixed Car Radar It’s just unreliable to the point where it’s not even worth running it anymore, spawn next to one and you’re permanently stuck until you die, spawn far away from one and you’re invisible while on top of the car. Spotter Did get a lot better after you applied the fix for it, but broke the patch after with the Halloween event. Currently the spotter is even worse than it was before you applied the fix for it. Points not appearing has been around for the last couple months and desperately needs a fix. The only way to stop this from happening is logging out from your account between every character swap and once it occurs the only fix is to restart the game. Ghostshots, names not showing up on corners and desyncing has also gotten a lot worse. However, some of these bugs might be very difficult to figure out a solution for so it’s understandable that some of them have been around for a while. On the other hand hitreg like this: https://gyazo.com/4f81a65620cef4e505c8827b7197f8dc https://gyazo.com/910ee9c51468350e5359a9373122d340 https://gyazo.com/0fd14b4c83b2d6c9d8ffeef9f6eb339c https://gyazo.com/0314cad6cd32b7543cdcd4d2981decb7 https://gyazo.com/514b03372087046c59e36bbe5cc754fb https://gyazo.com/aee381e25ebc17ef3955d8fd4d7dbe4c https://gyazo.com/ea2695911d9dc3c67d54faa58459fc5c https://gyazo.com/58505735f6eb5a52045c96fed3b92970 https://gyazo.com/dcee2ca571769fe578451ea79de65a11 https://gyazo.com/0b9ac43a61381b3a76adbc5040fb603b https://gyazo.com/1920ead4bd709f2dc5b2c27886257ce6 https://gyazo.com/583c97c254704e52c9ca9e48e97ddbe8 https://gyazo.com/ffbf76052863ef1acbb0de5d68e5d68e https://gyazo.com/7c53c2bf6d9d44fdd792c468ecb39917 Is just ridiculous, specially considering these clips are just a small portion of the hitreg from the last week. Balance Changes Something else which I just don’t understand is some of the balance changes which has not yet been made, such as: Low-Yields We still have 3 low yields, should be reduced down to 2 to start with. Remote detonator Still has no cooldown should be around 2 - 4 minutes cooldown. Yellow mods Yellow mods are still in the game, should be removed completely or nerfed significantly. Example: Shield HP reduced by 60% (Currently takes slightly less than 1 and a half mag for most guns to destroy a shield) You should no longer be able to resupply nades or explosive ammo from the yellow ammo boxes. (Would also give people a reason to play Field Supplier again) Shotguns Shotgun changes have yet to be reverted even though there has been numerous threads made about it, the change failed to make the hitreg of the shotgun more reliable which was the point of the change. Shotguns like the NFAS, Thumper and JG are now incredibly overpowered while the CSG is completely useless. The fact that it’s near impossible to miss with the shotguns also make SMGs completely useless within 20m if you play vs someone close to your own skill level. Cooldowns Why has premium / non premium cooldowns for both character mods as well as vehicle mods yet to be normalised to the current premium ones? HVR HVR still deals 850 damage. 850 damage is way too much for any gun in this game to deal, the damage should be reduced and the zoom in nerf should be reverted, this just made the gun feel clunky and unfun to play. The quickswitching was never really the problem with the gun but more so the fact that it deals 850 damage and takes you out of the fight for 10-15 seconds for minimal effort. What you should've done was reduce the damage of the HVR to 720 and make it drop down to 50 at 90-100m so you don't get 1 tapped at render distance. Side notes: Why does the Talon still have 10m less range than the regular RFP? 22 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
glaciers 5804 Posted May 16, 2019 46 minutes ago, shhift said: Low-Yields We still have 3 low yields, should be reduced down to 2 to start with. i think i'd prefer low yields to lose damage and radius, just taking away a grenade still leaves them superior to frags imo something like 490 damage and 4m/5m radius, instead of 575 damage and 7m radius 48 minutes ago, shhift said: Remote detonator Still has no cooldown should be around 2 - 4 minutes cooldown. for consistency's sake, the same cd as the meteor mod - 90s 49 minutes ago, shhift said: Yellow mods Yellow mods are still in the game, should be removed completely or nerfed significantly. all consumables should have 60s cd ammo box should only resupply 25% of max ammo (this would theoretically prevent grenade resupply) shield health reduced slightly (i think 60% is too much), and shield model/hitbox size should be adjusted to the same height as environmental crouch cover epinephrine seems fine tbh boombox could actually use a buff i think, perhaps have it disable carspawners within x radius (since it fools player's radars why not player mods as well) 54 minutes ago, shhift said: Cooldowns Why has premium / non premium cooldowns for both character mods as well as vehicle mods yet to be normalised to the current premium ones? source - riot rundown blog post i agree with everything else for the most part 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
swindIe 95 Posted May 16, 2019 I think shields (and the other consumables) should be removed completely... It's just a dumb gimmick that lets players justify having poor positioning 3 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LilyV3 322 Posted May 16, 2019 Noo, mah boombox. Don't delete them. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flaws 1001 Posted May 16, 2019 As far as the fixes go, I assume that the new engine would make it easier for them to fix those instead of figuring it out on the current code. In terms of consumables, I think they should become proper mods without having to play missions to get more of them, but have a more significant cooldown before you can deploy them again (2-4min). They can still take some nerfing like you suggested, sure. There are two ways to go about low-yields. One is where they still remain a direct upgrade to frag grenades (the one you suggested). OR similarly to what @Glaciers suggested which will still keep frags as a viable option which does not put you at a disadvantage. I think that their blast radius AND/OR damage should be lowered. Although, through all that I believe that grenades in the game IN GENERAL need to be reworked because as it is currently and as it has been for years, grenades are our primary weapon which is nothing other than awful game design. I believe that grenades should have overall less damage (taking CS:GO's grenades for example). And with that, vehicle health should be reduced so that car gameplay does not dominate even harder after that. The grenades will not be fixed by just nerfing yolos, that's for sure. Shotguns are abysmal as they always have been. The fact that they allow you to peek-shoot around corners with taking minimal damage should be made into something that requires skill. Make them less effective, maybe increase their TTK a slight bit more and make them about as forgiving as the CSG is currently (center mass or nothing). They would already be very efficent in a good aimer's hands. The JG needs to be reverted or just nerfed as it currently is BS on way too many levels and we all know what the current NFAS situation is. It requiers heavy nerfing in terms of range as it is not supposed to be so efficent past 5-8m or so. The True Ogre should still be more efficent than the regular NFAS that is accessible to literally everyone (which it currently is not). I agree about the HVR, I think that quickswitching and jumpshooting with it was fine as it is very RNG based. Like I repeat constantly, QS and jumpshooting was NEVER the main issue with the HVR. The damage output and the range it delivers it to is. Those need to be looked at as they are completely game breaking as they have been for years. If LO do not want to have quickswitching and jumpshooting as a thing for the HVR, they should revert it and then change it so that 3PS3 does not affect the HVR. Or better yet, make it so that after applying 3PS3 it lowers to what the default equip time is currently. That will emphasise to new players that the gun is definitely not supposed to be used in CQC (but you could if you manage to pull it off, which would require tremendous skill compared to before). There are a lot of other things that need to be looked at. The OBIR is BS, the PMG's range is BS. The AMG weapons are BS. The Thunder is absolute BS. Explosive weapons should not be as effective as they are. And a bunch of other things. I could write 10x times more than what I've already written on how broken the balancing is currently. 3 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DeadPixels 253 Posted May 16, 2019 Flaws why didn't you say anything about N-TEC 5, is it because it's your main weapon or do you really think it's ok? Let's face it, most of the APB players still use N-TEC 5 because it's a powerful and so versatile weapon. You say that jumpshooting with N-HVR is fine, what about with N-TEC 5. I really think it's too accurate with jumpshooting... 8 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mitne 663 Posted May 16, 2019 6 hours ago, swindIe said: I think shields (and the other consumables) should be removed completely... It's just a dumb gimmick that lets players justify having poor positioning Yeah, right? I called them out on that when consumables were introduced. Was called silly then. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PersianTiger 28 Posted May 16, 2019 8 hours ago, shhift said: Releasing the new game mode as well as the engine at the current state of the game is going to be a huge mistake, I understand that you want to release both as close together as possible. However, I don’t think you should be delaying fixing the current game because of that. A lot of the players who quit the game quit because of the state the game was in and not because the lack of content. Besides from what we’ve seen from Riot it seems like it’s a far way from being finished and should probably be put to the side for now imo. Currently there are tons of broken things in the game, many of whom you’ve broken after patches/events. If the engine were to be released in the current state that the game is currently I’m afraid most of the players who come back to check out the engine and the gamemode would just leave again after realising that the basics of the game actually somehow got worse than before and the same problems still persist. Things that needs to be fixed Car Radar It’s just unreliable to the point where it’s not even worth running it anymore, spawn next to one and you’re permanently stuck until you die, spawn far away from one and you’re invisible while on top of the car. Spotter Did get a lot better after you applied the fix for it, but broke the patch after with the Halloween event. Currently the spotter is even worse than it was before you applied the fix for it. Points not appearing has been around for the last couple months and desperately needs a fix. The only way to stop this from happening is logging out from your account between every character swap and once it occurs the only fix is to restart the game. Ghostshots, names not showing up on corners and desyncing has also gotten a lot worse. However, some of these bugs might be very difficult to figure out a solution for so it’s understandable that some of them have been around for a while. On the other hand hitreg like this: Reveal hidden contents https://gyazo.com/4f81a65620cef4e505c8827b7197f8dchttps://gyazo.com/910ee9c51468350e5359a9373122d340https://gyazo.com/0fd14b4c83b2d6c9d8ffeef9f6eb339chttps://gyazo.com/0314cad6cd32b7543cdcd4d2981decb7https://gyazo.com/514b03372087046c59e36bbe5cc754fbhttps://gyazo.com/aee381e25ebc17ef3955d8fd4d7dbe4chttps://gyazo.com/ea2695911d9dc3c67d54faa58459fc5chttps://gyazo.com/58505735f6eb5a52045c96fed3b92970https://gyazo.com/dcee2ca571769fe578451ea79de65a11https://gyazo.com/0b9ac43a61381b3a76adbc5040fb603bhttps://gyazo.com/1920ead4bd709f2dc5b2c27886257ce6https://gyazo.com/583c97c254704e52c9ca9e48e97ddbe8https://gyazo.com/ffbf76052863ef1acbb0de5d68e5d68ehttps://gyazo.com/7c53c2bf6d9d44fdd792c468ecb39917 Is just ridiculous, specially considering these clips are just a small portion of the hitreg from the last week. Balance Changes Something else which I just don’t understand is some of the balance changes which has not yet been made, such as: Low-Yields We still have 3 low yields, should be reduced down to 2 to start with. Remote detonator Still has no cooldown should be around 2 - 4 minutes cooldown. Yellow mods Yellow mods are still in the game, should be removed completely or nerfed significantly. Example: Shield HP reduced by 60% (Currently takes slightly less than 1 and a half mag for most guns to destroy a shield) You should no longer be able to resupply nades or explosive ammo from the yellow ammo boxes. (Would also give people a reason to play Field Supplier again) Shotguns Shotgun changes have yet to be reverted even though there has been numerous threads made about it, the change failed to make the hitreg of the shotgun more reliable which was the point of the change. Shotguns like the NFAS, Thumper and JG are now incredibly overpowered while the CSG is completely useless. The fact that it’s near impossible to miss with the shotguns also make SMGs completely useless within 20m if you play vs someone close to your own skill level. Cooldowns Why has premium / non premium cooldowns for both character mods as well as vehicle mods yet to be normalised to the current premium ones? HVR HVR still deals 850 damage. 850 damage is way too much for any gun in this game to deal, the damage should be reduced and the zoom in nerf should be reverted, this just made the gun feel clunky and unfun to play. The quickswitching was never really the problem with the gun but more so the fact that it deals 850 damage and takes you out of the fight for 10-15 seconds for minimal effort. What you should've done was reduce the damage of the HVR to 720 and make it drop down to 50 at 90-100m so you don't get 1 tapped at render distance. Side notes: Why does the Talon still have 10m less range than the regular RFP? with all respect, speak for your self. 3 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, DeadPixels said: Flaws why didn't you say anything about N-TEC 5, is it because it's your main weapon or do you really think it's ok? Let's face it, most of the APB players still use N-TEC 5 because it's a powerful and so versatile weapon. You say that jumpshooting with N-HVR is fine, what about with N-TEC 5. I really think it's too accurate with jumpshooting... The main issue with the gun is that it’s too accurate in some situation. I said it a lot of times but I repeat. Ntec with meta mods overshoots obeya with damage drop off in 60m. Its ttk is also fast to be reliable in cqc, but it’s not a fault of ttk, it’s an accuracy that allows you to spray first three shots like a laser. the minimum bloom is also small when you’re spraying It just needs a slight accuracy nerf, by 5-10%, and ofc remove the benefiting from hs3 in jump. That’s i Merged. 8 hours ago, shhift said: ~~ You also forgot to mention why pocket obir has much faster ttk than the regular obir Edited May 16, 2019 by Lign 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VanilleKeks 686 Posted May 16, 2019 Give N-tec 5 the Scoped N-tec stats. Scoped N-tec is a better range killer but it has actual downsides, Spotter is beyond overpowered. Even if they made it so that you can see when you are tagged, it's still a free wallhack for essentially no effort. Same goes for car radar. JG is absolutely busted. You can hit 1/3rd of the pellets and then still two tap. The counter argument here is the bad range but this can be completely negated with a pistol, or car gaming whenever you can. Especially with this being a 3rd person game, corner peaking with this thing is absolutely ridiculous. Nfas is stupid for the same reasons, all-though that one is a little easier to avoid. OCA has too much range and whisper is beyond brain-dead, As someone who has been practicing snipers lately, HVR is still insanely powerful. Quickswitching is also still viable if done at more than ~20m. If you play it right you won't even feel the clumsiness of that zoom nerf. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhosT 1287 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) You missed other problematic things such as the unnecessary OCA buff and the current state of the N-TEC and RFP-9. Though I agree with all your other points. And regarding the cooldown for remote detonator, make it 90 seconds so it fits the meteor mod. 24 minutes ago, Lign said: The main issue with the gun is that it’s too accurate in some situation. I said it a lot of times but I repeat. Ntec with meta mods overshoots obeya with damage drop off in 60m. Its ttk is also fast to be reliable in cqc, but it’s not a fault of ttk, it’s an accuracy that allows you to spray first three shots like a laser. the minimum bloom is also small when you’re spraying It just needs a slight accuracy nerf, by 5-10%, and ofc remove the benefiting from hs3 in jump. That’s i N-TEC is one of the few weapons that don't rely on RNG and that's one of the reasons why it's so popular. What I'd suggest instead would be slowing down the accuracy recovery time so you can't spam it as fast. Nothing wrong with its long range versatility, but it shouldn't be able to outgun obeyas or other long ranged guns. The CQC jump shooting does need an accuracy nerf. OCA just needs the G1 buff removed so it's at its previous state. We don't need to try other things to bring it back down in line. RFP-9 needs a drastic range decrease. Edited May 16, 2019 by GhosT added a quote and other gun things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 1 minute ago, GhosT said: You missed other problematic things such as the unnecessary OCA buff and the current state of the N-TEC and RFP-9. Though I agree with all your other points. And regarding the cooldown for remote detonator, make it 90 seconds so it fits the meteor mod. oca buff was due to overpowered shotguns. As I remember old oca had slower ttk than overbuffed jg and csg back in the days. But I might be wrong about ttk. I would like to see old oca if only they nerf shotguns Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhosT 1287 Posted May 16, 2019 Just now, Lign said: oca buff was due to overpowered shotguns. As I remember old oca had slower ttk than overbuffed jg and csg back in the days. But I might be wrong about ttk. I would like to see old oca if only they nerf shotguns OCA has been buffed when the CSG and JG were in a perfect place and the OCA was mostly the thing to pick over those anyway, the buff was completely unnecessary and unasked for. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 Just now, GhosT said: OCA has been buffed when the CSG and JG were in a perfect place and the OCA was mostly the thing to pick over those anyway, the buff was completely unnecessary and unasked for. It was unasked but pre-LO shotguns were a bit too op for old oca, now jg and nfas are pretty op for the current oca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhosT 1287 Posted May 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Lign said: It was unasked but pre-LO shotguns were a bit too op for old oca, now jg and nfas are pretty op for the current oca Pre-LO shotguns were perfectly fine and OCA had its place. It was a viable alternative to shotguns and it could outgun them without much effort. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, GhosT said: Pre-LO shotguns were perfectly fine and OCA had its place. It was a viable alternative to shotguns and it could outgun them without much effort. Pre-LO shotguns were perfectly fine with the current OCA. JG could always make 2 shots against old oca, there wasn't even a point to stay at the corner, you just run and shoot without brain. After oca buff shotguns were forced to go to their best niche - corners. So, everyone was in the equal position. Shotguns users had to think how to not allow oca users to run to their corner, at the very same time oca users had to think how to run over the corner of shotgun user to catch him and not die Edited May 16, 2019 by Lign Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhosT 1287 Posted May 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Lign said: Pre-LO shotguns were perfectly fine with the current OCA. JG could always make 2 shots against old oca, there wasn't even a point to stay at the corner, you just run and shoot without brain. After oca buff shotguns were forced to go to their best niche - corners. If anything, the OCA buff made shotguns less useful. At that point it was too easy to fight shotguns. I've barely seen any shotguns used outside of asylum since they buffed the OCA, as it was easily the better choice. Now with the JG and CSG nerfed into uselessness, it triumphs even more. Revert LO shotgun changes, revert G1 OCA changes, Pointman-Category problem solved. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, GhosT said: If anything, the OCA buff made shotguns less useful. At that point it was too easy to fight shotguns. I've barely seen any shotguns used outside of asylum since they buffed the OCA, as it was easily the better choice. Now with the JG and CSG nerfed into uselessness, it triumphs even more. Revert LO shotgun changes, revert G1 OCA changes, Pointman-Category problem solved. JG is overpowered at the moment. If you're average player, you barely can miss a shot with it, when with oca to overshoot jg you have to track an enemy perfectly Edited May 16, 2019 by Lign Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GhosT 1287 Posted May 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Lign said: JG is overpowered at the moment. If you're average player, you barely can miss a shot with it, when with oca to overshoot jg you have to track an enemy perfectly A whooping range of 7.5 meters. With the current OCA you can easily outgun shotguns, especially if you're out of their tiny range. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Queen of Love 402 Posted May 16, 2019 deploy yellow ammobox is the best claymore if used with percs :3 every oppo like free ammo until it explode Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, GhosT said: A whooping range of 7.5 meters. With the current OCA you can easily outgun shotguns, especially if you're out of their tiny range. It's theoretical situations. Practically, jg user never tries to outplay oca without cover on 7.5+ meters. If you want a braindead gameplay like it was before when shotguns were a superior choice during old oca time, then okay. Just run like a locomotive and always hit 2 shots, because oca's ttk is slow Edited May 16, 2019 by Lign Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flaws 1001 Posted May 16, 2019 1 hour ago, DeadPixels said: Flaws why didn't you say anything about N-TEC 5, is it because it's your main weapon or do you really think it's ok? Let's face it, most of the APB players still use N-TEC 5 because it's a powerful and so versatile weapon. You say that jumpshooting with N-HVR is fine, what about with N-TEC 5. I really think it's too accurate with jumpshooting... Nah, the N-TEC is a great versatile weapon but at high/top level, SMGs and Shotguns melt it at CQC, oscar/carbine can shit all over it in mid range and HVR/OBIR/Obeya etc beat it long range. People need to understand that just because a really good N-TEC player can beat casual players who don't know how to play their weapons, it does not make the N-TEC unbalanced. Just because of players who don't know how to aim/position themselves with the weapon they have in their hands and they lack team play. Also, jumpshooting with the N-TEC isn't as good as people think. The only times it works is when you can catch someone by surprise (again talking about high level play). The rest of the time you will get yourself perfectly tracked as most good players known the jump and fall arc in the game which you cannot avoid when jump shooting. On top of that, most players play the N-TEC with IR3 which increases full auto + jump bloom and loss of accuracy significantly so it's a lot of RNG involved as well. No offense to anyone, but if you are struggling with killing an N-TEC in CQC with an OCA (especially with CJ2/3 on it), I don't think weapon balancing is your biggest concern. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Flaws said: Nah, the N-TEC is a great versatile weapon but at high/top level, SMGs and Shotguns melt it at CQC, oscar/carbine can shit all over it in mid range and HVR/OBIR/Obeya etc beat it long range. People need to understand that just because a really good N-TEC player can beat casual players who don't know how to play their weapons, it does not make the N-TEC unbalanced. Just because of players who don't know how to aim/position themselves with the weapon they have in their hands and they lack team play. Also, jumpshooting with the N-TEC isn't as good as people think. The only times it works is when you can catch someone by surprise (again talking about high level play). The rest of the time you will get yourself perfectly tracked as most good players known the jump and fall arc in the game which you cannot avoid when jump shooting. On top of that, most players play the N-TEC with IR3 which increases full auto + jump bloom and loss of accuracy significantly so it's a lot of RNG involved as well. No offense to anyone, but if you are struggling with killing an N-TEC in CQC with an OCA (especially with CJ2/3 on it), I don't think weapon balancing is your biggest concern. It's not about people can't play with their weapons, it's about that you have to switch weapons based on situations to outplay ntec or you can just take ntec for all situations Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Flaws 1001 Posted May 16, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Lign said: or you can just take ntec for all situations And get outperformed by players who have the actual weapon for the actual range? EDIT: Just wanna remind you guys how good the FBW and the .45 AP are for killing N-TECs in CQC or even Mid range sometimes due to their mobility. Edited May 16, 2019 by Flaws Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lign 360 Posted May 16, 2019 Just now, Flaws said: And get outperformed by players who have the actual weapon for the actual range? dunno, based on arranged matches, ppl barely switch from ntec. And oca can be easily outplayed by ntec users with some brain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
