Loitering in a " Action District " yes/no?

[SpuzvaBob 92]

Hey everyone,

 

I had to remove quite a few posts from this thread due to them continuing to derail the topic of the thread. Regardless of what inspired the creation of this thread, this topic is not about that. The OP stated a question to the community and to LO. Please keep this in mind before posting from now on.

 

-Spuzva

[Eisena 86]

I enjoy talking in district chat. And I am unable to do so in an empty server.

[poptartzzz 7]

no one mentioned that when people interrupt the streamers loitering session, they respond by clipping it and trying to get them banned for griefing. 

[Recon_Puppy 43]

I'm not going to let 1 person's way of playing define everyone else's. To think your way of playing is the only way to play is ignorant and misguided.Video games are entertainment for a reason, its up to player interpretation, even games that have stories allow you to screw around and have shenanigans because the developers realize that is also part of gaming. It doesn't have to be tryharding all the time, or only this one singular way of playing. The more that happens in games the less people play them.

And as a news flash, the less people that play the game, the more likely it is to just shut down and make all your missions/Armas weapons be wasted and lost to time. Like it or not, people should be allowed to play the game as they want, as for the player made events, I know that they specifically choose the least populated district to join, even if the district is empty. Most of the time its on Citadel so that doesn't leave as much wiggle room.

 

You have to understand that missions isn't the defined way to play the game, its an Open World (Technically) sandbox shooter, the design of this game is for people to play and enjoy the game how they want to. Trying to punish people for having fun in this game is like punishing people in GTA 5 who don't buy shark cards, or who don't do missions but act like a civilian when driving. Its counterintuitive and shouldn't even be considered.

[jarko 43]

From the first post i made it sure did sound selfish to ruins everyone fun for my own opinion upon a certain situation.

 

We all have different opinions and not everyone will be happy over it. You can't satisfy everyone.

 

I'm just trying to find an alternative to a problem that could possibly have a sudden impact due to the fact that our playerbase isn't what it was back when the game was released. 

 

As some of you said " i don't know why its a problem now when it wasn't a few years ago "  We just aren't in the same timeframe and need to realize that. Since we aren't probably having the same luxury with our population. You might not see it now but it might be inevitable & then what will it be.. what will we do..?

 

Finding a solution now instead of when it will be too late is better isn't?

 

Have a nice day 

[speee 90]

7 hours ago, Mitne said:

Ahhh. Nothing like pool which favors only one side of argument. And more idiotic one.

BuT mAh MiSsIoNs.

Can't even drive around or do some alternative shit, that's totally haram to you, eh?

I might be try-hard but i'm so totally against killing fun part of community.

Fun is subjective. Many people have fun doing missions. Just because you don't, doesn't mean you have to ruin it for others. The way things sit currently, there is no other viable way to level up your characters. When there is only one district with possibly enough players to get opposition, and there are one or two groups sitting around not participating in the only aspect of the game that allows players to progress their character, you could imagine how that could cause issues.

[Recon_Puppy 43]

3 minutes ago, jarko said:

From the first post i made it sure did sound selfish to ruins everyone fun for my own opinion upon a certain situation.

 

We all have different opinions and not everyone will be happy over it. You can't satisfy everyone.

 

I'm just trying to find an alternative to a problem that could possibly have a sudden impact due to the fact that our playerbase isn't what it was back when the game was released. 

 

As some of you said " i don't know why its a problem now when it wasn't a few years ago "  We just aren't in the same timeframe and need to realize that. Since we aren't probably having the same luxury with our population. You might not see it now but it might be inevitable & then what will it be.. what will we do..?

 

Finding a solution now instead of when it will be too late is better isn't?

 

Have a nice day 

I get it, you legitimately care for the game and it's population. This just isn't the right way to solve something that isn't an actual issue.
The game needs to be fixed first, if the game gets fixed LO could start promoting the game drawing new people in and bringing old people back into missions, then LO could focus on content expansion.
I want to see this game thrive just as much as the next person, but attacking and pushing away part of the already small community is more detrimental than it is helpful.
Threads like this divide the community on it's own, now more than ever  the community should be banding together and trying to keep the game afloat for LO to fix, not attacking each other.

[vsb 6171]

7 minutes ago, speee said:

Fun is subjective. Many people have fun doing missions. Just because you don't, doesn't mean you have to ruin it for others. The way things sit currently, there is no other viable way to level up your characters. When there is only one district with possibly enough players to get opposition, and there are one or two groups sitting around not participating in the only aspect of the game that allows players to progress their character, you could imagine how that could cause issues.

if the game's population is so low don't you think the loiterers make no real difference?

 

they'll leave and then the district will still be 30v40 or whatever

[speee 90]

8 minutes ago, Recon_Puppy said:

I get it, you legitimately care for the game and it's population. This just isn't the right way to solve something that isn't an actual issue.
The game needs to be fixed first, if the game gets fixed LO could start promoting the game drawing new people in and bringing old people back into missions, then LO could focus on content expansion.
I want to see this game thrive just as much as the next person, but attacking and pushing away part of the already small community is more detrimental than it is helpful.
Threads like this divide the community on it's own, now more than ever  the community should be banding together and trying to keep the game afloat for LO to fix, not attacking each other.

Nothing about the original post was attacking or pushing any one away. It addresses a real issue and opens a discussion. You want a community that comes together to keep the game afloat, but you don't want threads that open discussion about issues. I fail to see how some individuals could agree with the idea that we should not participate in a core aspect of APB "until they fix the game". The fact is that the game is the way it is right now, and if you do not like certain aspects of it, then do not ruin it for people who actually want to play it the way it is meant to be played in its current state.

Just now, Glaciers said:

if the game's population is so low don't you think the loiterers make no real difference?

 

they'll leave and then the district will still be 30v40 or whatever

The players who sit around not readying up are affecting the matchmaking process. The game requires people to ready up so that matches can start. If the loiters left, the district could fill up with players who want to participate in the missions. There are plenty of people spamming to get in when it is full, while certain people decide it is better to drive around in dump trucks for hours.

[Recon_Puppy 43]

1 minute ago, speee said:

Nothing about the original post was attacking or pushing any one away. It addresses a real issue and opens a discussion. You want a community that comes together to keep the game afloat, but you don't want threads that open discussion about issues. I fail to see how some individuals could agree with the idea that we should not participate in a core aspect of APB "until they fix the game". The fact is that the game is the way it is right now, and if you do not like certain aspects of it, then do not ruin it for people who actually want to play it the way it is meant to be played in its current state.

The players who sit around not readying up are affecting the matchmaking process. The game requires people to ready up so that matches can start. If the loiters left, the district could fill up with players who want to participate in the missions. There are plenty of people spamming to get in when it is full, while certain people decide it is better to drive around in dump trucks for hours.

The OP is actually very much attacking, all you have to do is read it, its attacking the population that likes to have fun in the game. This isn't a thread discussing an issue. This is a thread that discusses a personal dislike of a certain group. There are real issues in the game i.e. server lag, to some degree poor optimizations (though it is better than before), low pop on it's own is an issue, but not how people play the game.
Now, let's say that a group just jumps into the game and sits at Double B doing Absolutely nothing (Actual Loitering), that'd be an issue, but to a certain degree, the group he is attacking is actually doing a boycott of missions until things are fixed. Most of what I did in the game was Missions, and I have a few livestreams on it. However, not once did I say "Why are these people doing this? This isn't the way to play the game." No I said," Oh, that looks cool." and continued on my way. There are complaints of mission queue times  due to fake loitering, maybe currently with low pop, but you have to realize the pop will increase with improvements to the game, lessening the impact of fake loitering.

Again, you are attacking just as much as the OP, you want to do missions, they aren't stopping you, and the amount of people who ride Dump Trucks is miniscule compared to the people doing the missions, I've been there. The only detriments are those who use the trucks as grief trucks.

[speee 90]

24 minutes ago, Recon_Puppy said:

The OP is actually very much attacking, all you have to do is read it, its attacking the population that likes to have fun in the game. This isn't a thread discussing an issue. This is a thread that discusses a personal dislike of a certain group. There are real issues in the game i.e. server lag, to some degree poor optimizations (though it is better than before), low pop on it's own is an issue, but not how people play the game.
Now, let's say that a group just jumps into the game and sits at Double B doing Absolutely nothing (Actual Loitering), that'd be an issue, but to a certain degree, the group he is attacking is actually doing a boycott of missions until things are fixed. Most of what I did in the game was Missions, and I have a few livestreams on it. However, not once did I say "Why are these people doing this? This isn't the way to play the game." No I said," Oh, that looks cool." and continued on my way. There are complaints of mission queue times  due to fake loitering, maybe currently with low pop, but you have to realize the pop will increase with improvements to the game, lessening the impact of fake loitering.

Again, you are attacking just as much as the OP, you want to do missions, they aren't stopping you, and the amount of people who ride Dump Trucks is miniscule compared to the people doing the missions, I've been there. The only detriments are those who use the trucks as grief trucks.

Just because you feel attacked by someone's opposing view, does not mean they are attacking you or anyone who shares your view. This is why we have discussions. Unfortunately, people prefer to appeal to their feelings instead of reality. The fact that you are willing to admit said group is doing a boycott should be enough for anyone to understand that it is not favorable for the game if it continues to happen. If you want to protest, do it here on the forums with open discussion. But leave it out of the game.

[Recon_Puppy 43]

1 minute ago, speee said:

Just because you feel attacked by someone's opposing view, does not mean they are attacking you or anyone who shares your view. This is why we have discussions. Unfortunately, people prefer to appeal to their feelings instead of reality. The fact that you are willing to admit said group is doing a boycott should be enough for anyone to understand that it is not favorable for the game if it continues to happen. If you want to protest, do it here on the forums with open discussion. But leave it out of the game.

I'm not basing my posts because of how I "feel". I am legitimately concerned with the form that the OP chose to take with this discussion. Its poor taste and poor execution. A post on a topic like this should be neutral and unbiased. The OP is not. Protesting is a very valid thing to do even in game. It has even been stated in the forums of what they want changed, LO is just focusing on content expansion first instead of trying to fix the game.
As is the boycott is not harming the game but helping it. The boycott is actually bringing people in because they see the fun that you can have in the game. The main reason we don't have more people in the game doing missions is because of poor performance and thats what the group wants LO to see, and fix. Its not a bad thing, they want LO to come out and own those performance issues, fix the game so all can go back to normal. RIOT mode should not be attempted, not while these issues remain in place. The whole purpose of the boycott is to show people just how much better off the game is screwing around because the game is unenjoyable any other way due to performance issues. Matt Scott has even addressed these issues and realizes how much of a problem they are. As far as myself, and the group can tell, nothing is being done to solve them, its getting ignored.

We don't want the game to be abandoned, we want the game to be better than it ever has been, and for that to happen LO needs to step up and do something about the problems the game itself has. This isn't a community issue, this is a game issue. Fix the game, you fix the community.

[dogfish 22]

This is actually dumb. Do you complain when GMs do events in action districts? Did you complain about people hunting pumpkins during halloween?

[speee 90]

49 minutes ago, dogfish said:

This is actually dumb. Do you complain when GMs do events in action districts? Did you complain about people hunting pumpkins during halloween?

Are you suggesting that it is okay to intentionally NOT play the game in protest because the game needs to be fixed?

Edited May 16, 2019 by speee

[Recon_Puppy 43]

2 minutes ago, speee said:

Are you suggesting that it is okay to intentionally NOT play the game in protest because the game needs to be fixed?

It is Okay. Free speech and all.

[speee 90]

2 minutes ago, Recon_Puppy said:

It is Okay. Free speech and all.

Right. But this is not about what someone is saying. If you want to sit around and chat, the game already has a district for that. The action of not readying up in action districts has an adverse affect on other players. 

[Recon_Puppy 43]

1 minute ago, speee said:

Right. But this is not about what someone is saying. If you want to sit around and chat, the game already has a district for that. The action of not readying up in action districts has an adverse affect on other players. 

The boycott falls within the category of free speech, they are allowed to do it and express it as they want as long as it doesn't negatively effect everyone.
That being said the boycott isn't stopping you from doing missions. They aren't stopping you from getting opp, they are playing the game and having fun in their own way. Thats how the game was meant to be. You interpret the game as you want and play it as such, no one has the right to tell you that you can't do that, especially no one who is part of the same community, another player.
You could say it, but it has no power.

6 minutes ago, speee said:

Right. But this is not about what someone is saying. If you want to sit around and chat, the game already has a district for that. The action of not readying up in action districts has an adverse affect on other players. 

Also, I am heading to bed so I'll respond when I get back up. So feel free to respond.

[speee 90]

21 minutes ago, Recon_Puppy said:

The boycott falls within the category of free speech, they are allowed to do it and express it as they want as long as it doesn't negatively effect everyone.
That being said the boycott isn't stopping you from doing missions. They aren't stopping you from getting opp, they are playing the game and having fun in their own way. Thats how the game was meant to be. You interpret the game as you want and play it as such, no one has the right to tell you that you can't do that, especially no one who is part of the same community, another player.
You could say it, but it has no power.

Also, I am heading to bed so I'll respond when I get back up. So feel free to respond.

As it is, if someone plays the game with a group of 4 high threat players, the opposition is little to none. There is definitely negative affects by not readying up in an action district. There is almost no purpose to be doing any of the activities in the action district e.g. ram raiding.  And this is really just a flaw of the game itself. Lots of ideas the original developers had but did not flesh out. The reality is, these "protesters" are not doing any of those activities anyways. 

 

I am not directly blaming them for the issues the game has. I think the game does need to be fixed in many areas. But deciding to not ready up only compounds those issues. 

Edited May 16, 2019 by speee

[Aeronaut 647]

2 hours ago, Recon_Puppy said:

They aren't stopping you from getting opp, they are playing the game and having fun in their own way. Thats how the game was meant to be. You interpret the game as you want and play it as such, no one has the right to tell you that you can't do that, especially no one who is part of the same community, another player.
You could say it, but it has no power.

...but they are. Like several others have discussed, if you are taking up a slot in a mission district without participating in missions, you're messing up the matchmaking algorithim because you're reducing the eligible pool of players that can be placed in matches...If there are free empty districts then just utilize those.

[Outofmyway 39]

9 hours ago, jarko said:

As some of you said " i don't know why its a problem now when it wasn't a few years ago "  We just aren't in the same timeframe and need to realize that. Since we aren't probably having the same luxury with our population. You might not see it now but it might be inevitable & then what will it be.. what will we do..?

People who loiter and don't do missions are for the most part people who don't want to play missions and won't play missions for X reason.

 

So, if you have them in the district, goofing around and have fun, show to the community this game can still be fun, because as we all know, it hasn't the best of reputation, in fact it's reputation is pretty garbage on every game quoting website.

 

See it this way, they loiter and have fun, show a good image, or they just won't play the game at all ... in one way or another it won't change the time needed to find opposition.

 

Those "loiters" are so few they don't even fill up a district, especially on NA. It just doesn't change a thing at all. 

Let the people that want to have fun, have fun! weather it is by playing mission, or by loitering around.

[Saxtus 497]

Back to the topic: This thread's subject is a moot point from the beginning.

 

At first I thought it would be ok to joke about it and lighten up the mood, but unfortunately, people took this forum thread too seriously, and even moderators had to step in.

We are a small community that is getting smaller every day. Stop bickering to each other, become friends and coexist.

 

The poll's question is about kicking those that are loitering action districts:

1. What exactly defines loitering?
   Racing?
   Smashing stores and stealing from pedestrians?
   Hunting bounties?
   Working towards daily Joker ticket objectives that require you to deliver cars or run over a high amount of pedestrians?
   RPing?
2. How will the game be able to detect them automatically?
3. What guarantees, even if such a mechanism is built in the game, that the space that will be made to the district by kicking them, will be filled by people that will be entered in the next mission with them?

Either the original poster didn't think it through, either his intentions are different, and his goal is not such a mechanism to be implemented, but to masquerade his displease about the actions of specific individuals that he doesn't approve.

 

 

[Kanashimi 39]

his intention was to belittle a particular streamer

 

[Outofmyway 39]

1 hour ago, Saxtus said:

The poll's question is about kicking those that are loitering action districts:

1. What exactly defines loitering?
   Racing?
   Smashing stores and stealing from pedestrians?
   Hunting bounties?
   Working towards daily Joker ticket objectives that require you to deliver cars or run over a high amount of pedestrians?
   RPing?
2. How will the game be able to detect them automatically?
3. What guarantees, even if such a mechanism is built in the game, that the space that will be made to the district by kicking them, will be filled by people that will be entered in the next mission with them?

this will put a complete end to every form of gameplay outside of missions, including ram raiding, mugging, delivering cars (note that's an achievement) and all of that, even in empty districts.... unfortunately

Edited May 16, 2019 by Outofmyway

[Mitne 724]

11 hours ago, speee said:

Fun is subjective. Many people have fun doing missions. Just because you don't, doesn't mean you have to ruin it for others. The way things sit currently, there is no other viable way to level up your characters. When there is only one district with possibly enough players to get opposition, and there are one or two groups sitting around not participating in the only aspect of the game that allows players to progress their character, you could imagine how that could cause issues.

Taking that each district can house 40 players for each faction (in past and hopefully future even 50) makes up for that.

Taking freedom from game makes it less fun, no matter what game it is.

 

I understand that it's issue for some. But it's not really issue at all if we take percentage of population doing that. And if OP just end up in events ruining them (events usually take place in gold district or non-populated one, to not disturb others), then thinking it's serious problem - then who is to blame?

And there is more to this game than missions. Hopefully there will be much more in future.

Edited May 16, 2019 by Mitne

[Recon_Puppy 43]

7 hours ago, speee said:

As it is, if someone plays the game with a group of 4 high threat players, the opposition is little to none. There is definitely negative affects by not readying up in an action district. There is almost no purpose to be doing any of the activities in the action district e.g. ram raiding.  And this is really just a flaw of the game itself. Lots of ideas the original developers had but did not flesh out. The reality is, these "protesters" are not doing any of those activities anyways. 

 

I am not directly blaming them for the issues the game has. I think the game does need to be fixed in many areas. But deciding to not ready up only compounds those issues. 

 

5 hours ago, Aeronaut said:

...but they are. Like several others have discussed, if you are taking up a slot in a mission district without participating in missions, you're messing up the matchmaking algorithim because you're reducing the eligible pool of players that can be placed in matches...If there are free empty districts then just utilize those.

I don't think you both get it, the matchmaking in the game is broken, regardless of people loitering. Why is that? You may ask, its because the game has gone too long without care for it and thats precisely why these people are doing this, They want to be able to do missions again but LO is preventing them from doing so because they don't want to address the issues the games has but want to for RIOT mode into an already broken game. The inclusion of such will likely be the breaking point for the game, especially on Jericho. The game doesn't have the pop for a broken content expansion. Believe it or not, those who are "Loitering" as you say are doing you all a favor. They aren't holding you back in missions, they aren't griefing you, they are letting you work for your stuff and progress, not that most of you need it with being max rank. My point is you should be appreciative of them for keeping people interested in the game and bringing them back in, and most of those that are brought back will do missions so it works both ways.