Cheating

[Knite 158]

On 1/22/2019 at 9:34 PM, Darkzero3802 said:

And thats key, freq updates that requires the makers of the cheats to constantly spend more time keeping them up to date which then they lose time to do anything else. Then they stop making them. Hacking is a constant battle of updates to get the 1up on the other party and eventually one side will cease, normally the side making said hacks. This would especially be for a game as dead as APB. The prob is that battle eye isnt being updated often enough nor are hackers being dealt with fast enough. If LO sped these up wed see alot less

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk here between devoting effort to stopping the ongoing cheating issue and pushing forward with 3.5; once 3.5 lands, we should have some blessed quiet from the cheaters for a little bit while cheatmakers rush to make something that works for APB.

 

Besides, I'm fine with knowing as little as we do about how LO is handling anti-cheat, as it means the cheaters also have less information to go on.

30 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

If you really think that's true, I hope you are reporting them to support. 

And reporting the stream itself.

[DedGaem 148]

13 hours ago, Knite said:

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk here between devoting effort to stopping the ongoing cheating issue and pushing forward with 3.5; once 3.5 lands, we should have some blessed quiet from the cheaters for a little bit while cheatmakers rush to make something that works for APB.

 

Besides, I'm fine with knowing as little as we do about how LO is handling anti-cheat, as it means the cheaters also have less information to go on.

And reporting the stream itself.

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk continuing to rely on an already bypassed anticheat and having cheaters move from closet to blatant brazenly.  At this rate there won't even be a gaming population left for their engine upgrade. A totally hacked game is out of control.  If LO can't figure this out, all their hard work is going to be ruined.  They need to bring back FairFight and put a couple of GMs in-game at random times to temp kick on the fly.

[Haganu 105]

4 hours ago, Hey! said:

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk continuing to rely on an already bypassed anticheat and having cheaters move from closet to blatant brazenly.  At this rate there won't even be a gaming population left for their engine upgrade. A totally hacked game is out of control.  If LO can't figure this out, all their hard work is going to be ruined.  They need to bring back FairFight and put a couple of GMs in-game at random times to temp kick on the fly.

Because Fairfight wasn't bypassed continuously? You must be joking.

Edited January 31, 2019 by Haganu

[Knite 158]

12 hours ago, Hey! said:

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk continuing to rely on an already bypassed anticheat and having cheaters move from closet to blatant brazenly.  At this rate there won't even be a gaming population left for their engine upgrade. A totally hacked game is out of control.  If LO can't figure this out, all their hard work is going to be ruined.  They need to bring back FairFight and put a couple of GMs in-game at random times to temp kick on the fly.

So, because BattlEye is a "bypassed anticheat", LO should bring back FairFight, which was proven to be less than useful? 

 

[Rebelliousness 85]

47 minutes ago, Knite said:

So, because BattlEye is a "bypassed anticheat", LO should bring back FairFight, which was proven to be less than useful? 

I don't think G1 was properly using FF, after all weren't they relying on manual bans and personal opinions?  FF did work, it compiles statistics.  Yes, closets could "game" the system by deliberately missing a lot of shots, tking or suiciding to lower scores, but if it were properly implemented, it could detect this as well as togglers who play like poop but suddenly become godmode when losing. As for BE, if it's bypassed, it isn't even there. FF wasn't "bypassed" it banned a lot of accounts.  It just wasn't configured well, and G1 probably wasn't paying for version updates.  In the end, people were being banned with FF broadcasts because Tiggs didn't like them.

How can you compare?  Oh wait, maybe FF properly updated and configured is MORE EXPENSIVE, so LO gives us this totally hacked useless 32 bit version. LO seems more and more like a G1 shadow company.  New name, same crap.

[CookiePuss 5382]

It's odd to see all this "BE is useless" nonsense right after a large ban wave. 

I guess that's APB fo you. 

[Knite 158]

33 minutes ago, Rebelliousness said:

LO seems more and more like a G1 shadow company.  New name, same crap.

[Rebelliousness 85]

28 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

It's odd to see all this "BE is useless" nonsense right after a large ban wave. 

I guess that's APB fo you. 

BE isn't useless.  We have the 32 bit version and it's easily bypassed, which causes the program to be useless for it's intended purpose... to detect cheaters who bypassed it's detection... doh. The ban wave simply underscores the VALIDITY of people who said, HEY it's being bypassed.  Because if you read MattScott's whole post, they INVESTIGATED and RELIED ON /REPORT and VIDEOS... so yeah, BE itself wasn't the sole criteria for detection.  Moreover, people continue to witness impossible feats such as speedhacking, even AFTER the banwave... this implies BE, as it is configured is INADEQUATE.

3 minutes ago, Knite said:

Or maybe G1 which is now a subsidiary was bought out by a new company which retained the basic structure and staff of the subsidiary and is essentially no different.

[CookiePuss 5382]

Just now, Rebelliousness said:

BE isn't useless.  We have the 32 bit version and it's easily bypassed, which causes the program to be useless for it's intended purpose... to detect cheaters who bypassed it's detection... doh. The ban wave simply underscores the VALIDITY of people who said, HEY it's being bypassed.  Because if you read MattScott's whole post, they INVESTIGATED and RELIED ON /REPORT and VIDEOS... so yeah, BE itself wasn't the sole criteria for detection.  Moreover, people continue to witness impossible feats such as speedhacking, even AFTER the banwave... this implies BE, as it is configured is INADEQUATE.

All BE bans start as temporary. 

LO then evaluates the bans using among other things, the info provided by other players. 

/Report also allows BE to more quickly catch cheaters by flagging their accounts for closer scrutiny.

 

Once coupled with LOs in house server sided anti cheat, we should see even fewer cheaters than the few we had / have now. 

 

Not that I have any faith that it will stop people crying that cheaters are everywhere. 

[vsb 6174]

im curious as to why so many "BE is bypassed" posts speak as if implementing an anticheat is a one-time deal, like all the funding was used to build this one wall and if someone tunnels underneath it cant possibly be fixed

 

 

[Darkzero3802 613]

On 1/30/2019 at 12:19 PM, Knite said:

There's an extremely fine line for LO to walk here between devoting effort to stopping the ongoing cheating issue and pushing forward with 3.5; once 3.5 lands, we should have some blessed quiet from the cheaters for a little bit while cheatmakers rush to make something that works for APB.

 

Besides, I'm fine with knowing as little as we do about how LO is handling anti-cheat, as it means the cheaters also have less information to go on.

And reporting the stream itself.

We dont need to know yea but we do know that what they have isnt enough, and thats all hackers need to get on and keep doing what there doing knowing they can get away with it, and force others to leave the game.

[Knite 158]

4 minutes ago, Darkzero3802 said:

We dont need to know yea but we do know that what they have isnt enough, and thats all hackers need to get on and keep doing what there doing knowing they can get away with it, and force others to leave the game.

Given the issues many people experienced with FF, I'd rather we have an anti-cheat that has a good reputation regarding false-positives; we know BE works, and I'll wager it gets better as it has more data to work with and /report is more frequently used.

 

And remember that 3.5 is coming.

[Darkzero3802 613]

2 minutes ago, Knite said:

Given the issues many people experienced with FF, I'd rather we have an anti-cheat that has a good reputation regarding false-positives; we know BE works, and I'll wager it gets better as it has more data to work with and /report is more frequently used.

 

And remember that 3.5 is coming.

BE has a good rep as far as im aware and yea it is but it wont take long to hack it as long as things remain the same. anti cheat should be priority above it so its in place when this upgrade finally comes out 5+yrs late.

[Rebelliousness 85]

21 hours ago, BXNNXD said:

im curious as to why so many "BE is bypassed" posts speak as if implementing an anticheat is a one-time deal, like all the funding was used to build this one wall and if someone tunnels underneath it cant possibly be fixed

Well from what I'm reading the current version is inadequate and we can't upgrade it until the engine upgrade so hopefully LO will be able to hit 2 birds with 1 stone,,, an upgrade which wont do a lot but enable an even better upgrade which will, but at the same time allow for the 64 bit version of BE which is supposedly then industry standard... donno about "gold" standard though.

[vsb 6174]

18 minutes ago, Rebelliousness said:

Well from what I'm reading the current version is inadequate and we can't upgrade it until the engine upgrade so hopefully LO will be able to hit 2 birds with 1 stone,,, an upgrade which wont do a lot but enable an even better upgrade which will, but at the same time allow for the 64 bit version of BE which is supposedly then industry standard... donno about "gold" standard though.

i’m no code expert but i would assume that the BE is more or less a separate program that scans whatever processes your pc has running/interacting with apb, i wouldn’t think that really depends on any of the game code itself

 

by the same assumption, an anticheat like fairfight would be more susceptible to “bad game code” because it relies on the game functioning properly to get correct player statistics 

[Revoluzzer 274]

On 1/30/2019 at 6:19 PM, Knite said:

once 3.5 lands, we should have some blessed quiet from the cheaters for a little bit while cheatmakers rush to make something that works for APB.

Is UE3.5 some bastion that cheaters haven't conquered yet? I'd expect working cheats to appear within minutes of release, assuming there is no "mole" in the testing group(s). Otherwise they'll probably exist long before release. Bottom line it should be trivial to use existing cheats for UE3.5 in APB, no?

[Rebelliousness 85]

23 hours ago, Revoluzzer said:

Is UE3.5 some bastion that cheaters haven't conquered yet? I'd expect working cheats to appear within minutes of release, assuming there is no "mole" in the testing group(s). Otherwise they'll probably exist long before release. Bottom line it should be trivial to use existing cheats for UE3.5 in APB, no?

Cheat makers would have to recode their APB cheats for the new engine... and with such a huge dropoff in population, the market demand for all that work, and subsequent payment is not there.  Sure, there's still people who don't mind using cheats in APB.... most of those, the vast 98% majority I would reckon, don't have the smarts to actually code their own cheats so... I believe the old cheats would be outmoded and new cheats vastly fewer and scarce.

[Dead_Game 73]

20 hours ago, Rebelliousness said:

Cheat makers would have to recode their APB cheats for the new engine... and with such a huge dropoff in population, the market demand for all that work, and subsequent payment is not there.  Sure, there's still people who don't mind using cheats in APB.... most of those, the vast 98% majority I would reckon, don't have the smarts to actually code their own cheats so... I believe the old cheats would be outmoded and new cheats vastly fewer and scarce.

they dont since we have live streaming ones who are proud to show of their cheats to rub it in our faces. 

[DedGaem 148]

11 hours ago, Hypothesis said:

they dont since we have live streaming ones who are proud to show of their cheats to rub it in our faces. 

Think he's talking about after the new engine upgrade changing the code so new cheats have to be coded to compensate. 

[oinkpoinks 2]

Hi,

as a former devop i can  recommend to re-compile your executable file on a every-day-basis. That's the only effective way to get them out. If you do it right it's only a button click (with the right algorythm).

[TheNightingale 4]

On 12/30/2018 at 9:59 AM, Darkzero3802 said:

Once upon a time you couldnt jump kick doors in APB. You had to stand infront of it and sacrifice urself so the team could get to the obj. Fast foward abit and a bug appeared where ppl could kick on doors while jumping moving out of the way as the door opens to stay alive. Its not an intended mechanic of door opening and as such is considered a bug. Doesnt matter if u can kill someone doing it or not a bugs a bug at the end of the day. Not to mention its against the TOS at the end of the day as well.

Jump kicking a door is not in the same league as some of the other exploits being abused. Indeed, it is so normal a thing that LO probably didn’t realise it came to be from yet another of reloaded’s screw-ups rather than part of intended mechanics. That said, how about allowing a satchel charge to blow open doors within a 2m radius?

[Darkzero3802 613]

On 2/9/2019 at 8:42 PM, TheNightingale said:

Jump kicking a door is not in the same league as some of the other exploits being abused. Indeed, it is so normal a thing that LO probably didn’t realise it came to be from yet another of reloaded’s screw-ups rather than part of intended mechanics. That said, how about allowing a satchel charge to blow open doors within a 2m radius?

I agree its not in the same league but at the end of the day it is a exploit, to be blunt. That would be realistic as a breach charge is used to blow open doors in reality so ppl arent sitting ducks opening a door. It would also mean anyone camping the door would be blown up on either side which personally adds abit of a challenge to gameplay so id be all for it. 

[safdfsgkjhdgsjkhs 140]

you can say BE works and they just did a "huge" banwave but the same hackers are still rage hacking on Jericho... so the banwave doesn't seem effective. same 4-5 players in the same clan every single day... everyone reports them nothing happens.

[Eixo 33]

Is there any kind of flagging towards rerollers? Especially players who cheat on alt accounts?

[TheSxW 47]

* Knowledge of the map is huge advantage
* then u get knowledge of the map you looking for respawns systems so u can tell in 80% sure where someone who u kill will respawn and from where he will come at you
* after that knowledge of weapons granades usage and imagination
@Eixo propably IP adress in 2 jumps (so we grab 3 ip adresses) + hwid of hardware CPU/GPU/DRIVES/MAC Adress/CD ROM (i will do that if i will made an game with anticheat)
oh and there is an bug with concusion granades which makes 0 damage after bouncing from car or floor or something similar to this -> @MattScott