Question for N-TEC mains

[RespectThis 121]

2 minutes ago, Luminesca said:

To versatile, needs to have a through look at it.
I've beaten whispers, pmgs, manics, shotguns, auto shottys, 
It's in the meta for a reason, and should be brought down a notch on par with the f2p guns.

Beating a gun with a gun doesn't make it broken....

[Luminesca 102]

1 minute ago, RespectThis said:

5 minutes ago, Luminesca said:

To versatile, needs to have a through look at it.
I've beaten whispers, pmgs, manics, shotguns, auto shottys, 
It's in the meta for a reason, and should be brought down a notch on par with the f2p guns.

Beating a gun with a gun doesn't make it broken....

Why does everyone use it, even skipping the plethora of other guns you unlock on the road to 255.

[B0N3EZ 2]

9 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

Ntec is better 40-50
far n ntec better 20-40
star n far better 0-20


also, the ntec is 18stk by 70m... if yer beating snipers at or past that range, then something isnt right

Unless they are just oblivious stay in the middle of the street with no cover. Seen it once to many times.

[RespectThis 121]

12 minutes ago, Luminesca said:

Why does everyone use it, even skipping the plethora of other guns you unlock on the road to 255.

-One of the Two Free2Play assault rifles
-Its versatile
-Enjoyable gameplay
-Like using assault rifles

People aren't skipping the other guns. Everyone has used every gun at some point im sure. People tend to have favorites though. Also in regards to the "plethora" amount of guns. There aren't alot... They're just pre modded versions of the guns. They've only added ONE new primary (the oscar). Not a whole lot.

Edited July 19, 2018 by RespectThis

[Slickmund 58]

One has to consider how meta works before wanting to change it. Meta will always be a thing, in any game, no matter how much you balance it. The main question is: Is the one with the highest meta truely OP?
As an example, lets take the CSGO weapon meta for comparison (even though it is a fps, and on top of that has a completely different damage system, but meta wise we can still compare the two on an abstract level). On CSGO the meta is tilted if not leaning entirely on the AK-47, which is the only assault rifle besides the SG553 which can kill with 1 shot, a headshot. On top of that if the headshot is missed, its recoil pattern works great for short bursts that are quite equally fatal if aimed properly. The AK-47 would rule supreme, and at a competitive level (ESL) dominates the picking because players there are quite confident on being able to headshot. But only one side has direct access to this gun, the terrorist side. Yet the Counterterrorist side has to make due with a 2shot to kill if headshotted, the M4 in two variants. Its way more controlable, and easier to use in terms of recoil management and therefore more forgiving. Is the AK-47 too strong? No its not, people still pick the M4 over the AK and outperform it, why? Because the AK is unforgiving, and a 1 trick pony. 1 Tap to headshot, or a tilted down spray which is damn inaccurate. The M4 doesnt suffer from that, and can easily 2 tap an ak user if the ak user misses the initial headshot. Meta is nothing more than a measurement of what most players, can use well according to their average skill. I see a NTEC, at most on average, on 2/5 players I see even though its one of the few F2P guns, most days, its not even 1/5. Because its hard to use and unforgiving. So can we even consider this gun to be on top of the meta? I dont think so. 
A weapon you can consider OP once it beats pretty much every weapon in its niche. In the NTEC's case, it simply isn't.  If you have beaten SMGs, shotguns whatever gun that should be advantageous in it's niche, it either means you have gotten the drop on the player and caught him off guard, or he didn't play accordingly to the weapons playstyle, or but I'd rather not consider this factor, the player was simply performing poorly (Poor perfomance of a player you can't take into account when talking balance really). TTK on any SMG is on par with the NTEC, ease of use almost always exceeds the NTEC's which refers to its margin for making mistakes and recovering from it and most importantly situational accuracy which has the biggest effect on TTK. On the NTEC this is very low, bad accuracy whilst moving and firing, low rof that allow for very few misses before your enemy is swimming in spare time to kill you and arrange your funeral. If you lose to an NTEC with a shotgun whilst getting the drop on him or engaging him quite fairly, you didnt use your shotgun well end of story. Same goes for any niche weapon. Ive met plenty of players which can consistently beat my NTEC in CQC with SMG's, and shotguns alike. I have yet to lose against a NTEC whilst using an ATAC or shotgun properly and well. People often mention the NTECs versatility and deem it OP by it, consider its weaknesses: Low mobility whilst firing, very unforgiving when shots are missed or recoil managed inproperly and most of all, very predictable. Its a one trick pony, if you can't beat that, youre going to have a lot of issues against a lot of weapons used by good players.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Slickmund

[Noob_Guardian 417]

it's used so much because no other rifle is as reliable mid range. Far and Star kill slower from recovery window, but Far would be better in that case. The Ntec seems to be more accurate and reliable. Sure star and far is better in cqc, but if you are good with the NTEC you really don't need to worry about a star at all.

[WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN 4]

Let's look at the other AR's tho... there's an obvious problem
*not including the JT versions

STAR:
Eh, kinda the middle child. Doesn't excel at anything, isn't useless at anything... it's description is literally 'jack of all trades'

COBR-A:
Kinda like the STAR, slow firing, slow blooming, slow recovering, medium-long range accuracy
ARMAS WEAPON


ATAC:
The opposite of the first two, fast firing, less accurate, short-medium range
ARMAS WEAPON

Condor:
The ATAC except with a special mod... who cares
Not even purchasable on ARMAS, RNG

The apocalypse guns or whatever the hell they're called :
These guns were never meta
ARMAS

SR-15 (Carbine):
The ATAC of semi auto rifles... kinda
SEMI AUTO

CR-762 (Obeya):
Long range semi auto gun, more accuracy at range, dookie up close
SEMI AUTO

OBIR:
Basically a burst fire CR-762
BURST

OSCAR:
Burst fire Carbine
BURST - Rank 190+ exclusive



See the problem? If it isn't an ARMAS weapon, it's a niche weapon.
The NTEC's niche is everything.

It's one of the first guns you unlock, and you can use it exclusively if you really wanted to all the way through your progression of the game.

[vsb 6171]

4 minutes ago, WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN said:

Condor:
The ATAC except with a special mod... who cares
Not even purchasable on ARMAS, RNG

nitpicking, the non-legendary variants of the raptor 45 are available on armas

[Slickmund 58]

If you want to consider the NTEC too versatile, how about we pull the Burst Rifle into the discussion. The gun that if used well, brings about the demise of most decent NTEC user. Exposure whilst firing a burst rifle is minimal since it recovers after its burst allowing you to take cover, a good burst rifle player will take 3-4 hits at most whilst fighting a NTEC. You have to be caught off-guard with a burst rifle or caught with your ding dong out in CQC if you want to lose to a NTEC with it. Perfect counterpick to a NTEC, even gives mediocre snipers some lead to chew on. I have yet to see a gun in APB that is truely OP and is desperate for tweaking besides the bugged Yukon (which still isnt even that great). There are plenty of inefficient guns that do need tweaking.
@WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN What the STAR and SR-15 have in common, is being able to recover better after missing a shot, allowing a bigger margin for error within its effective range, and more maneuverability whilst firing meaning less exposure whilst dealing damage if played properly. What the CR-762 and the OBIR have in common is that they beat the NTEC at range because of their higher effective range. People can make the NTEC work within other niches by overcoming hardships in terms of game mechanics. If you want to play NTEC you practically need HS3 and IR3 on it, otherwise it can not perform at range like most experience, which is why you pretty much always see these mods on NTEC's. HS3 in close range is absolutely terrible though, your FOV is lowered drastically which makes tracking much harder. Its like being able to use the gun only with a big ol 4x scope on it, in close range (unless were talking barrel to the chest kind of range, believe me all weapons get weird at that range). In close range, you can either try to overcome this scoped advantage through skill, or you can avoid its FOV restrictions by becoming a sitting duck, crouching and hip firing, still with less accuracy of course and high recoil. I see plenty of players overcoming this playstyle. And like I mentioned before, I have yet to see the NTEC being as popular as most claim. Those that do use it, often perform really well and thats where I see no issue. Much like a sniper even with QS, takes a lot of skill to use in close range, why should that not be rewarding? Ease of use should not be more rewarding than mastery if you ask me.

Edited July 19, 2018 by Slickmund

[WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN 4]

14 minutes ago, BXNNXD said:

19 minutes ago, WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN said:

Condor:
The ATAC except with a special mod... who cares
Not even purchasable on ARMAS, RNG

nitpicking, the non-legendary variants of the raptor 45 are available on armas

I didn't know there were non-legendary versions lol.
Point still stands tho, still an ARMAS weapon

[Slickmund 58]

27 minutes ago, WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN said:

I didn't know there were non-legendary versions lol.
Point still stands tho, still an ARMAS weapon

Yet all the in game available weapons rule their classes, along with their armas reskins (without considering some special JMB weapons like medusa, which defenitely is on par if it doesnt outperform the SHAW in many scenarios). Not to be offensive mate, but whats your point really? That theres only two assault rifles to pick from besides armas? Theres only 2 shotguns to pick from as well, 2 smgs, 2 snipers, 2 explosive weapons and oddly 4 semi-rifles. It was intended that way, and it works pretty well. Plenty of ARMAS unique weapons are available through Joker tickets as well, still, I wouldnt consider it because the standard weapons are still a lot better in most situations. The NTEC outperforms the STAR in most situations most say, the NHVR outperforms the DMR in most situations most say, the NFAS outperfoms the JG in most situations some say, the OBIR outperforms the Obeya some say, the OSCAR outperforms the SR-15 some say. I say bogus to all of that. I see all of these weapons, used well, used poorly, day in day out on high level and on low level. OSMAW is op? Mortar that shit with the OPGL, gl OSMAW, seeya on the next stiff walk.

The more I play, the more I start using all the guns, non-armas, and start to see how well balanced they are. I see a lot of players agreeing on this, and less whining about it in game. Yet I see the opposite on the forums, cus hey guess what, the one that appreciates it rarely takes it to the forums, whilst the annoyed brat that calls "unfair" goes to the forum to convince the rest of us and the staff along with it preferably.
Sorry if I seem agitated throughout my posts, its the narrow perspective most seem to deliver critique from that annoys me at this point, and your argument seems really irrelevant to me at this point. Weapon pool is as intended on most ends. You see high weapon diversity because of this, yet loudmouths still focus and nitpick on silly stuff to make a statement. Nearly all armas weapons are extremely niche and limit your playstyle, which keeps the game from become P2W. How is that a bad thing? Add Raptor to the in game accesible weapons? Youre gonna see it just as rarely as you do now, just like the ATAC, which you can actually get through the joker stores. Why? Because the standard weapons can still beat it in most situations. Edited July 19, 2018 by Slickmund

[Similarities 226]

21 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

People who hate the ntec cant use the ntec. 
Also, why does other ARs being bad make you laugh? 

I can't use anything but Carbine, N-SSW, PMG, or OCA (well, beyond a reasonable level that is, I can use any gun that isn't god awful, but not necessarily well) and I don't think the N-TEC is broken. 

[CookiePuss 5378]

1 hour ago, Similarities said:

I can't use anything but Carbine, N-SSW, PMG, or OCA (well, beyond a reasonable level that is, I can use any gun that isn't god awful, but not necessarily well) and I don't think the N-TEC is broken. 

^this guy gets it

[dett2 64]

N-TEC is a good gun not OP.
If its nerfed , i will use FAR or ATAC or Frenzy ^^

[Keshi 436]

I main the ntec but the carbine is my second main. It depends how you feel like playing. If i use my ntec, my fbw will be my carbine.
The ntec is perfectly balanced. closerange a good oca/pmg user will outplay it VERY quick.
Midrange a carbine user can outplay an ntec if he is good. 
Don't forget that sometimes the bullet doesnt register
Most importantly..its not p2w :)

tldr: ntec is fine, anyone with great skills on certain weapons/combo can outplay any other

[Fennel 62]

personally i find the ntec boring, i prefer guns that give me movement, like the jg shotty, joker carbine, oca smg.  I can probably use a ntec all the time and win plenty of times with it, but its just boring, nor is it broken, it restricts my movement whenever i use it, and it hates it when jump with it

[Aggression 2]

[SantaBox 2]

After its base dmg was reduced to fix the fact that HB2 still offered a 6 stk within its effective range, I have no reason to believe the N-Tec is overpowered or needs any other nerfs. Yeah, it can be annoying when you're in a point-blank battle and your enemy just squats on the ground with his N-Tec and outguns your OCA, or when you miss that second HVR shot that you needed to finish off the player, but that's not going to happen every time unless you're really not aware of your surroundings or you're against someone who is really good with that weapon. I don't main the N-Tec either, my most used weapon as of recent is the Volcano just because it feels like it's the only thing I can use when the server is on mitigation 24/7. Normally, I do generally prefer explosives or AV weapons, SMGs and marksman weapons because they challenge me to adapt to certain situations or stages of a mission. I myself get bored of using meta weapons really quickly and find myself switching to quirky weapons that don't really fit a niche.

[CrimeCleaner 2]

I dont know if this topic is relevant, because LO said weapon changes are coming. Just wait for that.

cheers

[WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN 4]

23 hours ago, Slickmund said:

Yet all the in game available weapons rule their classes, along with their armas reskins (without considering some special JMB weapons like medusa, which defenitely is on par if it doesnt outperform the SHAW in many scenarios). Not to be offensive mate, but whats your point really? That theres only two assault rifles to pick from besides armas? Theres only 2 shotguns to pick from as well, 2 smgs, 2 snipers, 2 explosive weapons and oddly 4 semi-rifles. It was intended that way, and it works pretty well. Plenty of ARMAS unique weapons are available through Joker tickets as well, still, I wouldnt consider it because the standard weapons are still a lot better in most situations. The NTEC outperforms the STAR in most situations most say, the NHVR outperforms the DMR in most situations most say, the NFAS outperfoms the JG in most situations some say, the OBIR outperforms the Obeya some say, the OSCAR outperforms the SR-15 some say. I say bogus to all of that. I see all of these weapons, used well, used poorly, day in day out on high level and on low level. OSMAW is op? Mortar that shit with the OPGL, gl OSMAW, seeya on the next stiff walk.

The more I play, the more I start using all the guns, non-armas, and start to see how well balanced they are. I see a lot of players agreeing on this, and less whining about it in game. Yet I see the opposite on the forums, cus hey guess what, the one that appreciates it rarely takes it to the forums, whilst the annoyed brat that calls "unfair" goes to the forum to convince the rest of us and the staff along with it preferably.
Sorry if I seem agitated throughout my posts, its the narrow perspective most seem to deliver critique from that annoys me at this point, and your argument seems really irrelevant to me at this point. Weapon pool is as intended on most ends. You see high weapon diversity because of this, yet loudmouths still focus and nitpick on silly stuff to make a statement. Nearly all armas weapons are extremely niche and limit your playstyle, which keeps the game from become P2W. How is that a bad thing? Add Raptor to the in game accesible weapons? Youre gonna see it just as rarely as you do now, just like the ATAC, which you can actually get through the joker stores. Why? Because the standard weapons can still beat it in most situations.

Nah I get what you're saying. I've been playing for a long patootie time, I've seen the coming and going of different guns... I remember the jump scouts being ridiculously accurate, the god-tier Whisper.... The N-TEC just fills every role decent enough to be viable in any situation. Running around with a JG can be fun, but not every fight is up close and personal, the objective moves, a bunch of things can change. So what do you do? Switch guns obviously, but what do you switch to? A long range gun? I guess you could... or you can grab an N-TEC.

8 hours ago, CrimeCleaner said:

I dont know if this topic is relevant, because LO said weapon changes are coming. Just wait for that.

cheers

The one post that was made so far made no mention of the N-TEC, though I do see a change of some sorts to come.

[CookiePuss 5378]

9 minutes ago, WELCOMETOFLAVORTOWN said:

Nah I get what you're saying. I've been playing for a long patootie time, I've seen the coming and going of different guns... I remember the jump scouts being ridiculously accurate, the god-tier Whisper.... The N-TEC just fills every role decent enough to be viable in any situation. Running around with a JG can be fun, but not every fight is up close and personal, the objective moves, a bunch of things can change. So what do you do? Switch guns obviously, but what do you switch to? A long range gun? I guess you could... or you can grab an N-TEC. The one post that was made so far made no mention of the N-TEC, though I do see a change of some sorts to come.

Ntec is great all around, but only best from roughly 30m-57m.
Otherwise other weapon classes outperform.
Full disclosure: a fuck ton of fights happen between 30m-57m lol

[Excalibur! 207]

15 hours ago, dett2 said:

N-TEC is a good gun not OP.
If its nerfed , i will use FAR or ATAC or Frenzy ^^

Why not star? Its unbelievable underated.
But honestly if they touch ntec i will really lose my will to play apb. THey already nerfed yolos without saying a word... probably they will start ninja nerfing other stuff for sure.

[Similarities 226]

20 hours ago, Fennel said:

personally i find the ntec boring, i prefer guns that give me movement, like the jg shotty, joker carbine, oca smg.  I can probably use a ntec all the time and win plenty of times with it, but its just boring, nor is it broken, it restricts my movement whenever i use it, and it hates it when jump with it

This is exactly why I'm not a huge fan of the N-TEC, I can use it, I can even use it to a pretty decent level, but I don't enjoy being stuck in one place at any range beyond 20m, I like to be able to move around while firing, if you get good at strafe firing and being unpredictable with the way you move then you can beat a lot of people with a Carbine, even if it's out of the range that the weapon is most effective in (CQC-mid)

[CookiePuss 5378]

20 hours ago, Fennel said:

personally i find the ntec boring, i prefer guns that give me movement, like the jg shotty, joker carbine, oca smg.  I can probably use a ntec all the time and win plenty of times with it, but its just boring, nor is it broken, it restricts my movement whenever i use it, and it hates it when jump with it

>Not using Mob Sling and jumpshooting every corner.

14 minutes ago, Similarities said:

This is exactly why I'm not a huge fan of the N-TEC, I can use it, I can even use it to a pretty decent level, but I don't enjoy being stuck in one place at any range beyond 20m, I like to be able to move around while firing, if you get good at strafe firing and being unpredictable with the way you move then you can beat a lot of people with a Carbine, even if it's out of the range that the weapon is most effective in (CQC-mid)

Seriously, why are you nerds not using mobility sling?

[Similarities 226]

1 hour ago, CookiePuss said:

>Not using Mob Sling and jumpshooting every corner.

Seriously, why are you nerds not using mobility sling?

TIL everyone has a R195 char. 

I have 4 chars, of which none are R195 (and my main is inactive), and I'm not spending my joker tickets on a 7 day trial of a mobility sling.