Call me sensitive but...

[vsb 6171]

5 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Yeah, that must definitely be an American thing, guys calling each-other "whores".

Mirriam:
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/nice lady

Oxford:
https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/nice lady

it's not really limited to guys calling each other wh*res, but yeah

your own first link shows multiple definitions for the word, some of which are clearly gender neutral 

 

i just don't understand why this instance of potentially offensive language specifically is a problem, especially when equipping the title itself is completely voluntary 

[Kiida 455]

no one cares

[Tigrix 308]

 

@Gateron

Oh my, you went full out with the furry insults and all.... sorry, I didn't realize I hit such a soft spot calling out your den living-ground mentality.
At least you didn't use the next 10 lines trying to convince me how you've got a real life and all. 
 

7 minutes ago, Solamente said:

it's not really limited to guys calling each other wh*res, but yeah

your own first link shows multiple definitions for the word, some of which are clearly gender neutral 

 

i just don't understand why this instance of potentially offensive language specifically is a problem, especially when equipping the title itself is completely voluntary 

In those same links, contextually they firstly address it as being known use to describe females.

Further links:
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/pl/dictionary/english/nice lady

(How many dictionaries do British ppl need btw?) 

I don't deny that guys can call each-other whatever they want. Hell, some guys probably even refer to their male friend as bitches.

That doesn't change the definition of the word though, neither how it's used by the far far majority of people and hence defined and published in dictionaries.

As for this specific instance, IMO - I made this topic for the EXACT reason I wrote in the OP.
IMO, this is one step too far, when a company greenlights such known derogatory word as a reward?
Then that same company can't possibly pretend to hide behind rules of "TOS" and "no sexual swearing allowed" or other bs that they warn players for.

Consistency in policy, is a minimum requirement to be taken serious imho.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Tigrix

[Iazer 204]

29 minutes ago, Kitty Yekaterina said:

Ok then lets hear the source of Cambridge dictionary out of United Kingdom, the source of an official English language: 

 

wh0re noun UK  /hɔːr/ US  /hɔːr/

 

a female prostitute

a woman whose behaviour in her sexual relationships is considered immoral

 

 

Source :  https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/nice lady  

The Cambridge dictionary has been outdated for years now and with the context that the term is being used in game for the title being "Candy nice lady" is not related to its derogatory term and has nothing against women OR men because no it is not just focused towards one.

[vsb 6171]

36 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

That doesn't change the definition of the word though, neither how it's used by the far far majority of people and hence defined and published in dictionaries.

33 minutes ago, Iazer said:

with the context that the term is being used in game for the title being "Candy nice lady"

the context very clearly pointing to the "secondary" definitions were conveniently left out of the original post

 

 

36 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

As for this specific instance, IMO - I made this topic for the EXACT reason I wrote in the OP.
IMO, this is one step too far, when a company greenlights such known derogatory word as a reward?
Then that same company can't possibly pretend to hide behind rules of "TOS" and "no sexual swearing allowed" or other bs that they warn players for.

maybe i'm reading too much into this but did one of you get a warning or something for calling another player a wh*re?

 

because it seems like there's a (hopefully) obvious distinction between calling someone a wh*re and someone voluntarily displaying a title

 

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Solamente
typo

[Kitty Yekaterina 111]

17 minutes ago, Kiida said:

no one cares

nobody cares that you dont care. you dont speak in the name of all people in community.

go back to camping other peoples streams and trash talking strangers behind their backs, about whom you know nothing about and who you never meet, thanks God,

[Tigrix 308]

11 minutes ago, Solamente said:

the context very clearly pointing to the "secondary" definitions were conveniently left out of the original post

maybe i'm reading too much into this but did one of you get a warning or something for calling another player a wh*re?

 

because it seems like there's a (hopefully) obvious distinction between calling someone a nice lady and someone voluntarily displaying a title

So you can't see a problem in using officially listed derogatory language as a title reward?
The same language that you don't want your players using in district chat, you add it as titles? you don't see the irony here Solamente?

How deep does that rabbit hole go then? Which word is then derogatory by your standard if wh+re isn't? 

And how do we go by the policies that we're supposed to "agree to follow" of the game then? That little box we have to click after each update.... Tell me then, do we define sexual swearing and racial swearing and yada yada so on, via dictionaries and how these words are used by the vast majority of people?.... or else, what do we define the "rules" by exactly then? Gaterons den' rules? lol.
 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Tigrix

[mattskoii 67]

Let's have a few coldies n all be friends ye?( too bad for social distancing ) Edit. Just trying to defuse the tension.

[Zolerox 564]

You can't even use that word on steam "hence the ' After the W on the steam forums"

 

I have no problem with this word, Swaffling on the other hand...

[mtz 496]

18 minutes ago, Kitty Yekaterina said:

Ok then lets hear the source of Cambridge dictionary out of United Kingdom, the source of an official English language: 

The geographical region of Cambridge does not hold any monopoly on definitions existing in the English language, nor does the University of Cambridge. In fact, there is no single governing entity deciding upon how a language operates because this is not how languages work. Depending on cultural events and transformations, words may change their meaning (sometimes through misinterpretation by people) or gain new ones altogether.

 

For your own sake, please don't cite dictionaries alone — the only thing it does is make it glaringly obvious that you have a surface level comprehension of the subject. Dictionaries are not the be-all-end-all guidelines to language because of the reasons mentioned earlier. They exist to categorize words and define/describe them based on their use in human culture. That's what lexicographers do — they observe the use of language and write it down. This is why we've had that shitshow a few years ago when Merriam-Webster listed one of the definitions of the word "literally" as "figuratively" (so the exact opposite). That's not some evil plot to change language, it's literally (pun intended) what happened to the word because of its misuse by humans.

 

Going back to the original point: no, nothing in the word "wh0re" indicates or implies female gender of its subject. Neither does the word "prostitute", for that matter. Wikipedia offers a streamlined explanation of the word's etymology:

Quote

The English word [wh0re] derives from the Old English word hōra, from the Proto-Germanic *hōrōn (prostitute), which derives from the Proto-Indo-European root *keh₂- meaning "desire", a root which has also given us Latin cārus (dear), whence the French cher (dear, expensive) and the Latin cāritās (love, charity).

Why do you think that prostitution is sometimes called "the oldest profession in the world"? The act itself has a history spanning pretty much all of human civilization and, because of several social mechanisms, has been most commonly associated with women. However, it is not exclusively the domain of that sex. You don't have to be female to be able to prostitute yourself.

By the way, just to clear things up: the order of definitions in a dictionary does not imply their importance or significance.

 

I cannot imagine any real reason as to why anyone would raise this complaint about the use of a specific word, other than posturing and virtue signalling. (Or nitpicking, though that one's just a theory here.)

 

I would understand (and perhaps even sympathize with) the point that in some areas of the world it is considered a heavy insult, but — for the love of God — have you never noticed what game you've been playing? ESRB assigned APB the M ("Mature 17+") rating, explicitly describing the type of content you can encounter in the game. Do you not have a problem with killing other people in the game? Do you not have a problem with us smuggling animals to sell them for profit? Do you not have a problem with Gumball indirectly offering the player to fuck his dog? All of these are quite immoral and unacceptable things, yet you're taking offense to a single specific word that's not even aimed directly at you?

 

Yes, the word is banned on the forums, because different etiquette is required here. As Solamente already pointed out, anyone can access these forums and read them, but in the actual game itself you have to register an account to interact with it. In the game chat you can (note: I'm saying that you can and not that you should) curse like a sailor, preferably without aiming the curse words at other people — but on the forums you're expected to be a bit more courteous or professional. You're out in the open. The world can see you. Act like it.

 

The thing that I find the most funny about this is that the word "wh0re", which is oh so problematic, is included in a title. It's never going to be aimed at any other player. It describes your character. If you don't want to title yourself a "candy wh0re", just use a different title. No one — not a single goddamned person in this game — can force you to wear that title if you don't want to.

 

[Shui 225]

Weak humans, you can only hate them.
Grow the fuck up

[vsb 6171]

16 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

So you can't see a problem in using officially listed derogatory language as a title reward?
The same language that you don't want your players using in district chat, you add it as titles? you don't see the irony here Solamente?

How deep does that rabbit hole go then? Which word is then derogatory by your standard if wh+re isn't? 

And how do we go by the policies that we're supposed to "agree to follow" of the game then? That little box we have to click after each update.... Tell me then, do we define sexual swearing and racial swearing and yada yada so on, via dictionaries and how these words are used by the vast majority of people?.... or else, what do we define the "rules" by exactly then? Gaterons den' rules? lol.
 

i've already said there's a difference between someone voluntarily calling themselves a wh*re and someone slinging the word at others, so no i do not see the irony nor do i think i can really help you understand the difference if you don't already

 

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Solamente
edit

[Iazer 204]

If worst comes to worst I can remove it for both of you with a very simple localisation edit  

[Tigrix 308]

2 minutes ago, MartinPL said:

 

The thing that I find the most funny about this is that the word "wh0re", which is oh so problematic, is included in a title. It's never going to be aimed at any other player. It describes your character. If you don't want to title yourself a "candy wh0re", just use a different title. No one — not a single goddamned person in this game — can force you to wear that title if you don't want to.

 

You managed to miss the entire point of the subject.
It's not that anyone forces you or me to use a title - it's the fact that using a known derogatory term as a reward is greenlighting that term as being perfectly acceptable.
At the same time, you don't want your players actually using that term in any public/district chat. 

As I asked Solamente, i'll ask you too;
How deep does that rabbit hole go then? where is the line drawn then if not by LO following their own TOS? Or are you arguing that the TOS doesn't mention swearing, racial, sexually etc etc as rules that we all are supposed to abide and accept? 

[iRawwwN 282]

game is for mature players only;

 

The forums are like PG-13 or some shit.

 

get the fuck over it and go back to erping with your bud in social and afking missions.

[Tigrix 308]

4 minutes ago, Solamente said:

i've already said there's a difference between someone voluntarily calling themselves a wh*re and someone slinging the word at others, so no i do not see the irony nor do i think i can really help you understand the difference if you don't already

 

 

Uhm, ALL titles are something we choose to wear or not wear.... THIS has nothing to do with the fact of a very derogatory word being greenlighted by LO as a reward.

So titles have no limits by your logics then, and you find that a good argument, ok then  
I won't use racial examples, but by your logics I could as a developer and then say "well who cares, don't use it then".

Edited April 4, 2020 by Tigrix

[mtz 496]

Just now, Tigrix said:

You managed to miss the entire point of the subject.
It's not that anyone forces you or me to use a title - it's the fact that using a known derogatory term as a reward is greenlighting that term as being perfectly acceptable.
At the same time, you don't want your players actually using that term in any public/district chat. 

Just out of curiosity, why did you choose to respond to only that specific part of my post? Did you accidentally or knowingly skip the part where I point out that this is one of many mature themes in this M-rated game?

[Tigrix 308]

13 minutes ago, MartinPL said:

Just out of curiosity, why did you choose to respond to only that specific part of my post? Did you accidentally or knowingly skip the part where I point out that this is one of many mature themes in this M-rated game?

Actually no, I read all of your long post. But as I replied... imo you missed the point.

We're not arguing whether APB has mature this or that in it, Kyoki already pointed out before you that there's words as "fuck" and toe-sucking (which imo, neither those terms are listed as derogatory terms anyway?).

This topic is whether or not a line has been crossed and imo LO is crossing a line when they're greenlighting a clear derogatory term as a reward title. 
It doesn't matter that you "choose to use it or not" ... you could say same for ALL titles then and literally add the word ... (i won't post it, but there are lots of racial and sexual swears out there, i'm sure I don't have to list them under the silly argument of "well duhhh, just don't use it".)

I feel a game developer company should exemplify their own TOS before they ask that their players do.  

Edited April 4, 2020 by Tigrix

[vsb 6171]

Just now, Tigrix said:

Uhm, ALL titles are something we choose to wear or not wear.... THIS has nothing to do with the fact of this word being greenlighted by LO as a reward.
So titles have no limits by your logics then, and you find that a good argument, ok then  

at best little orbit rewarding a title with wh*re in it might create a loophole when calling players with that specific title wh*res but i don't understand how you've managed to wrangle this around to it allowing someone to call any player a wh*re, there's clearly a disconnect somewhere

 

and no i don't really think titles or rewards really have a limit beyond what will garner too much negative PR, and having a title with wh*re in it is nowhere near that arbitrary limit in a game most players expect to be a gta clone

 

its already been mentioned several times, but the use of wh*re seems insignificant in a game that references no/sex trafficking, bestiality, describes female contacts as "bitches", etc - is the issue specifically that this title is a new (is it even new) addition? if little orbit added a new mission tomorrow and the mission stage flavor text referred to the other team as something offensive, would you take this as a complicit allowance that you are allowed to call every player that offensive term, regardless of mission or faction?

[Tigrix 308]

1 minute ago, Solamente said:

at best little orbit rewarding a title with wh*re in it might create a loophole when calling players with that specific title wh*res but i don't understand how you've managed to wrangle this around to it allowing someone to call any player a wh*re, there's clearly a disconnect somewhere

 

and no i don't really think titles or rewards really have a limit beyond what will garner too much negative PR, and having a title with wh*re in it is nowhere near that arbitrary limit in a game most players expect to be a gta clone

 

its already been mentioned several times, but the use of wh*re seems insignificant in a game that references no/sex trafficking, bestiality, describes female contacts as "bitches", etc - is the issue specifically that this title is a new (is it even new) addition? if little orbit added a new mission tomorrow and the mission stage flavor text referred to the other team as something offensive, would you take this as a complicit allowance that you are allowed to call every player that offensive term, regardless of mission or faction?

Good argument, but this is the flaws;

As a game developer (personal life also), IMO you're responsible (in most countries, even by law required to have a EULA) for setting the rules and boundaries of your community/game.
Every game/community usually does that via a TOS that users have to agree to follow.

When LO took over, one of the first things they did was run through the current TOS and update it and re-issue a Little Orbit rules of conduct/tos.
That's not strange, that's expected. Each company have their own slight adjustments, but generally there's a broad understanding of whats okay and not okay, as these TOS's

simply rely mostly on common sense and what you'd expect to behave as IRL. (luckily, most people can generally agree to whats common decency and whats not:o)

Copy Pasta from LO's eula:
9.4 You shall not (and you agree to not) generate any User Generated Content, or use the Game in a way, that:
(a) is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, abusive, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, or offensive (whether in relation to race, sex, religion or otherwise) or denigrating to anyone's reputation or general standing (whether or not actionable);

UGC vs DGC.....Since this is developer generated content, they're IMO greenlighting the same type of vulgar language that they don't want their players to use.
People can try clutter the subject with insults. Others can try to argue "well you don't HAVE to use it..." ...., but surely you can see that it's entirely besides the point. 
I also don't have to name my character XXXXXXgger and get banned for violating the TOS right... it's a self-choice. But when the company itself is using such language as content rewards in their game, then yeaaaaaaah, something seems very very awry. 

I refer to my previous statement. A game developer company should exemplify their own TOS before they ask that their players do.
 

[mtz 496]

54 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

... imo you missed the point.

I'm afraid you are not the authority in deciding who understood your post and who didn't.

 

54 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

We're not arguing whether APB has mature this or that in it, Kyoki already pointed out before you that there's words as "fuck" and toe-sucking (which imo, neither those terms are listed as derogatory terms anyway?).

This topic is whether or not a line has been crossed and imo LO is crossing a line when they're greenlighting a clear derogatory term as a reward title. 

Last time I checked, the word "fuck" was pretty derogatory. So was "b!tch". So was "motherfvcker". So was sodomizing animals. The first one is used several times in the game, the middle two are dispatch briefings (APB Reloaded\APBGame\Localization\INT\Subtitles_FEM.int), the last one is a quote from Gumball. I ask again: exactly why are you singling out that specific word as especially offensive?

 

54 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

It doesn't matter that you "choose to use it or not" ... you could say same for ALL titles then and literally add the word ... (i won't post it, but there are lots of racial and sexual swears out there, i'm sure I don't have to list them under the silly argument of "well duhhh, just don't use it".)

I feel a game developer company should know to follow their own TOS before they ask that their players do.  

You didn't address the point though. And it's not that you skipped it — you disregarded it, presumably thinking that it means it's invalid and that you don't have to address it anymore.

 

Titles literally don't target other players, aside from the two "I'm With Stupid" ones you can get from Joker Distribution in Social (which barely even work as "insults" because of how childish they are and because of how only its user will be able to see the intended result since the titles are always pointed towards a player's camera). And let's just get it out of the way: if you fear being on the receiving end of an "I'm With Stupid -->" title, you should probably get off the internet and seek adult supervision.

 

Titles are not invitations nor licenses to use words within them. They are labels and self-descriptors you can put on yourself for additional self-expression in the game.

You can put the "Idiot" title on yourself to additionally taunt people about how they were killed by someone who openly calls themselves stupid.

You can put the "Lukewarm" title on yourself as a bit of comedic self-deprecation about your appearance.

You can put the "Candy Wh0re" title on yourself to express how you fucking love candy so much that you'd engage in sexual acts for them.

 

You choose if a title is to be applied to you. If you get hung up on a single specific definition of one of the words used in a title, 1) there's a chance you don't meet the age requirement of this game, 2) you're forgetting that you can always just not use the title. It's not even tangentially related to following the Terms of Service because no one could come reasonably close to breaching the ToS by putting that title on themselves (because which rule are you even breaking? "no use of derogatory language on yourself"?); neither is this title's existence a breach of Terms of Service, because this is not a situation where an individual is insulting or otherwise bullying another individual.

 

To repeat the question from earlier: why are you singling out the word "wh0re" as especially offensive?

 

15 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Copy Pasta from LO's eula:
9.4 You shall not (and you agree to not) generate any User Generated Content, or use the Game in a way, that:
(a) is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, abusive, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, or offensive (whether in relation to race, sex, religion or otherwise) or denigrating to anyone's reputation or general standing (whether or not actionable);

You omitted point 9.4.3., which explicitly states that determining whether something breaches this is left to "Little Orbit's absolute discretion". They have the final say in whether something is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, offensive, or denigrating to another person's reputation or social standing. You should know that if you agreed to the Terms of Service. And clearly having a self-deprecative joke as a title (which isn't even forced upon anyone) is not any of these things.

If you don't like that, you can always not participate in this game or its community anymore.

 

Lying by omission to prove your point is not the way to go.

 

15 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

UGC vs DGC.....Since this is developer generated content, they're IMO greenlighting the same type of vulgar language that they don't want their players to use.

...towards other people. Exactly which word in "Candy Wh0re" is an insult to another person?

 

I feel like you're reading into this title a bit too much and trying to present it as more malicious than it really is or could be, presumably in a bout of self-righteousness or in pursuit of those sweet, sweet internet karma points.

 

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by MartinPL

[Tigrix 308]

Quote

 54 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

... imo you missed the point.

Quote

I'm afraid you are not the authority in deciding who understood your post and who didn't.

 

Well I am when using the context of IMO, unless you don't know what IMO is an abbreviation of.
 

Quote

Last time I checked, the word "fuck" was pretty derogatory. So was "b!tch". So was "motherfvcker". 

Oh? list me where fuck is a derogatory term please. I saw lots of people using "fuck" in district and never heard or saw a GM hush them or say hey chill your language.
It's a commonly used curse, but is it a derogatory insult?
 

Quote

 

You omitted point 9.4.3., which explicitly states that determining whether something breaches this is left to "Little Orbit's absolute discretion". They have the final say in whether something is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, offensive, or denigrating to another person's reputation or social standing.

Lying by omission to prove your point is not the way to go.

 

 

Oh, but again - I've been saying THE WHOLE TIME that this is the determination of LO. They set the boundaries.
See? This really proves how badly you miss-read my original post. My entire topic was about LO crossing the boundary when using such a term as a reward title in their game.
LO should be an example of their own TOS, i've literally said it since the start of this thread, how did you manage to still miss it by now MartinPL?

And luckily I do think that LO has more reason and rationale than the infamous segment of the community that frequents this forum the absolute most.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Tigrix

[vsb 6171]

8 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Good argument, but this is the flaws;

As a game developer (personal life also), IMO you're responsible (in most countries, even by law required to have a EULA) for setting the rules and boundaries of your community/game.
Every game/community usually does that via a TOS that users have to agree to follow.

When LO took over, one of the first things they did was run through the current TOS and update it and re-issue a Little Orbit rules of conduct/tos.
That's not strange, that's expected. Each company have their own slight adjustments, but generally there's a broad understanding of whats okay and not okay, as these TOS's

simply rely mostly on common sense and what you'd expect to behave as IRL. (luckily, most people can generally agree to whats common decency and whats not:o)

Copy Pasta from LO's eula:
9.4 You shall not (and you agree to not) generate any User Generated Content, or use the Game in a way, that:
(a) is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, abusive, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, or offensive (whether in relation to race, sex, religion or otherwise) or denigrating to anyone's reputation or general standing (whether or not actionable);

UGC vs DGC.....Since this is developer generated content, they're IMO greenlighting the same type of vulgar language that they don't want their players to use.
People can try clutter the subject with insults. Others can try to argue "well you don't HAVE to use it..." ...., but surely you can see that it's entirely besides the point. 
I also don't have to name my character XXXXXXgger and get banned for violating the TOS right... it's a self-choice. But when the company itself is using such language as content rewards in their game, then yeaaaaaaah, something seems very very awry. 

I refer to my previous statement. A game developer company should exemplify their own TOS before they ask that their players do.
 

putting aside that the ToS is very specific about user generated content, i would reuse your own words - how deep does that rabbit hole go then?

 

should little orbit remove the potentially offensive content that i listed in my previous post? should less derogatory titles like 'scrub' or 'noob' be removed as well? should certain clothing items be removed for being obscene? do the voiceovers need to be censored?

 

 

[mtz 496]

28 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Well I am when using the context of IMO, unless you don't know what IMO is an abbreviation of.

Your opinion =/= fact. It's a frequent misconception on the Internet, I know.

 

28 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Oh? list me where fuck is a derogatory term please. I saw lots of people using "fuck" in district and never heard or saw a GM hush them or say hey chill your language.
It's a commonly used curse, but is it a derogatory insult?

There is a sincerely deep conversation about linguistics, pragmatics and practical use of language to be had here — for example, about how words only have a meaning when they are contextualized, or about how pragmatics of a discussion influence the reception of the word and how insulting words become not insulting in specific contexts and situations depending on the relations between the speaker and the listener, or about how a word conventionally considered a curse word becomes an expression or exclamation when not aimed at any target — but I'm afraid there's no point in having it here. Not in this environment, not at this time, not with someone unwilling to listen.

 

28 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Oh, but again - I've been saying THE WHOLE TIME that this is the determination of LO. They set the boundaries.
See? This really proves how badly you miss-read my original post. My entire topic was about LO crossing the boundary when using such a term as a reward title in their game.
LO should be an example of their own TOS, i've literally said it since the start of this thread, how did you manage to still miss it by now MartinPL?

You were told in this thread already — several times, in fact — that the "offending" word in the title that is the subject of this thread, "wh0re", is not aimed at anyone but the user. It does not breach the Terms of Service because there's no rule against being a pottymouth, just against insulting other players.

 

The word is "derogatory in other cultures"? Poles use the word "kurwa" (one of its meanings is, surprise surprise, "wh0re") very liberally. When someone slams their finger while trying to hammer in a nail, they'll scream "KURWA!" just like English speakers would shout "FUCK!" in pain. If you're a grown person, you should be able to figure out that the Pole is not calling for a prostitute to come to his aid, nor is the English speaker in sudden need for intercourse. Like I said earlier: pragmatics.

 

Oh, and since you're so eager to reference "the start of this thread"...

3 hours ago, Tigrix said:

I mean most kids are very susceptible to reading the language and usage of it,

Quote

Eligibility:

5.3 You acknowledge and agree that you shall only be entitled to use the Game if you are an adult of at least 18 (eighteen) years of age or if you are at least 17 (seventeen) years of age in applicable jurisdictions where you are legally permitted to purchase the Game.

5.4 By agreeing to the terms and conditions of this End User License Agreement, and installing and using the Game, you warrant that you are an adult of at least 18 (eighteen) years of age or have the consent of your parents or legal guardians to enter into and be bound by this End User License Agreement.

The "think of the children" defense is 1) a cheap cop-out, 2) non-applicable here because children aren't even allowed to play this game.

 

[Tigrix 308]

13 minutes ago, MartinPL said:

I'm afraid you are not the authority in deciding who understood your post and who didn't.

 

Last time I checked, the word "fuck" was pretty derogatory. So was "b!tch". So was "motherfvcker". So was sodomizing animals. The first one is used several times in the game, the middle two are dispatch briefings (APB Reloaded\APBGame\Localization\INT\Subtitles_FEM.int), the last one is a quote from Gumball. I ask again: exactly why are you singling out that specific word as especially offensive?

 

 

 

You omitted point 9.4.3., which explicitly states that determining whether something breaches this is left to "Little Orbit's absolute discretion". They have the final say in whether something is defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, harmful, harassing, hateful, invasive of another's privacy, sexually explicit, offensive, or denigrating to another person's reputation or social standing. You should know that if you agreed to the Terms of Service. 

 

Lying by omission to prove your point is not the way to go.

 

 

 

I feel like you're reading into this title a bit too much and trying to present it as more malicious than it really is or could be, presumably in a bout of self-righteousness or in pursuit of those sweet, sweet internet karma points.

 

 

I am when using the context of IMO, unless you don't know what IMO is an abbreviation of.
We already discussed the mature content of APB, what did you miss? go back and read the reply.
 

Oh, but again - I've been saying THE WHOLE TIME that this is the determination of LO. They set the boundaries - it's THEIR eula we follow, hence they should be the shining example of it.
See? This really proves how badly you miss-read my original post. My entire topic was about LO crossing the boundary when using such a term as a reward title in their game.
LO should be an example of their own TOS, i've literally said it since the start of this thread, how did you manage to still miss it by now MartinPL? maybe your underlying passive-aggressive hunt for those sweet sweet acceptance points among your fellow buddies is clouding your ability to read objectively what's being replied to you.  

Luckily I do think that LO has more reason and rationale than the infamous segment of the community that frequents this forum the most.

 

9 minutes ago, Solamente said:

putting aside that the ToS is very specific about user generated content, i would reuse your own words - how deep does that rabbit hole go then?

 

should little orbit remove the potentially offensive content that i listed in my previous post? should less derogatory titles like 'scrub' or 'noob' be removed as well? should certain clothing items be removed for being obscene? do the voiceovers need to be censored?

 

 

Ok, i'll go along with that.

Firstly, since LO took over APB, they've inherited the game "as-is", by all definitions and standards, that's the outcome of taking over an active project.
All the mature stuff that is in APB,  is taken as-is and personally as I already made clear with my reply to Kyoki, there's IMHO nothing wrong in tough language, aka "fuck" or "suck" or w/e examples.
That's APB, that's the mature rating. I don't see anything derogatory insulting in the word "fuck".

Anyway, LO inherited APB as-is and right away made a very clear point of wanting to ASAP update the eula to their "own standards" (if you dig among the first posts of LO, this was the primary first topics).
All good so far yes? Aka, they've shown responsibility imo so far. They take a pride in the work they do and they understand that they're the ones in charge and being looked up to in a certain way for "whats okay and whats not okay". They made a big point of wanting to re-establish in-game moderation (active GM's partaking in chat and actually warning/moderating for TOS violations).

All good so far yes?
Ok, so LO imo so far has made good strides to try and turn this community around to a more positive and shall we say... functional one. 
I'm not saying they've done any miracles or anything, ofc not ... but they've definitely improved the community IMO, since they took over. (Yes LO, this is a compliment, i'm not just bashing you guys).

In fact, my post about this specific derogatory word being randomly tossed into the game as a reward title, should show how much I've come to respect LO for their stances and their attempts at bettering the community via rules and moderation/GM's etc etc. It's IMO disappointing that they in this way joke with their own TOS, because it sends the wrong signal to people who look for excuses and greenlights to insult others with this type of derogatory language.

I think Matt understands that and I really doubt he had a hand in this or was aware of it going out. I guess we will wait and see.