MeanBetsy

YOU GOT ME LOL

Most of these are great ideas, and I fully support them. However, I don't want to dox myself to play a game. I also don't need the hackers in this game giving my picture an evil mustache and horns

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Yet, somehow, APB players cry whenever a single modification to the game's balance takes place.

Oh yeah! So here's the reason why we can't have the Engine Upgrade right now: we don't have enough reddit karma

That opening line literally told me everything I need to know about the rest of this essay. So tbh, didn't bother reading it Anyone with eyes can literally see that you're purposefully arguing in bad faith

I appreciate how much time you actually took to dissect what I said, I think discussions like this can be helpful even for the developers. But at the same time I don't think you were actually reading what I am saying. What makes you think they don't? The C.E.O said it himself, while LO sold the IP to the Chinese, the selling deal involved retaining complete control over THIS game, APB. LO can do anything gameplay related to this game and they did, both the good and the irrational. In the text that you quoted from me, I clearly never said they did or didn't vault weapons. I was just stating that it would be in their best interest to do so on a much more game-changing/overall balancing level - if that is even possible without much backlash. This is a first-grade online games problem. 'If it doesn't bring money there is no need to fix it or even talk about it', hmm? This is the mentality of short-term thinkers, a.k.a failures. They don't really have to be in order to receive fixes/improvements. If anything, if you think about it, there are players who religiously bought premium for the extra benefits such as more end-of-mission payout to skip grinding. Hence to them, indirectly, Mobile Radar Tower (amongst other things) were indeed paid for. Again, I clearly never said they didn't need to fix it or not talk about it - it was just irrelevant to our conversation because I was specifically talking about the paid content getting vaulted. Saying that Mobile Radar Tower was indirectly paid for via premium is silly at best, you're reaching. NOW you do. Had you known previously, you wouldn't have said this: But you always seem to say things that you don't really mean so it is whatever. I always knew, that screenshot doesn't prove the point you're trying to make here. I still never said LO will or would, I said it may involve refunding upset customers - this doesn't insinuate at all whether LO would do that or not. In essence, this was my opinion on what it would take to be able to change the business model. Just because it didn't achieve balance up to the standards that most games today would be balanced by doesn't mean they didn't try. In Halo CE, you wouldn't use a shotgun against a sniper player at long distances, correct? You wouldn't use the pistol against a shotgun in CQC would you? It's a good example because there are rules that very much resemble that of chess. That's also why spawn points and map design generally follows the same rules across most shooter games - they almost always symmetrical in nature to ensure fairness. Here you're literally agreeing with me past the example of Halo CE lol That's pretty chessy in nature to me. Each pawn is dangerous in their own right. I do agree, and have always agreed with that point: APB Is not competitive - hence why people are leaving. Hence why I said things need to be drastically changed, starting with the business model lol. There are definitely steps they can take to ensure that the player base doesn't leave to annoyingly unfair gameplay advantages and an unfun meta thats been the same for 11 years - but like I said, it'd be in their best interest to have more creative control with APB. The current business model prevents that. I literally never said that in this conversation lol Doesn't need to but it's dying? Struggling to reach 100 people in a whole server yet it doesn't need to be a more strategic game? I am pretty sure APB is already on its last leg, even if the engine upgrade comes unless something changes drastically.

I never said they had to vault weapons, but it would definitely benefit them to have total creative control over the project. Mobile Radar Tower was not a paid mod and the Heat System was not paid content either. I am strictly talking about purchased items from the Armas causing LO a lot of grief when it comes to even attempting to balance the poophole that is APB. Go to a lot of the updates regarding any update to do with weapon changes when LO first got in - most people who were complaining were talking about the weapon they had purchased in the past now suddenly becoming bad. I know what the EULA says, which all EULA's say that. I am not saying LO will or would, but it would definitely help populate the player base and force them into being more open-minded to a new type of business model. And it's not like they couldn't change it anyway (they changed a couple of EULA when they kicked G1 out). Shooters are, especially nowadays, and always have been arcade-y chessboards. Even down to Halo: CE, your weapon choice mattered very much depending on distance and your ability to aim. Those two factors are like that of chess pawns. In fact, most well-thought out games play a lot like analog games. And Halo still does this to this very day because it is very viable and generates healthy player competition - and a successful product. Trust me, the game is not balanced in its current state and should definitely play more like a chessboard when it comes to weapon variables. A "shooter", as you put it, is what a single-player game is - not a competitive multiplayer game sadly

I didn't say the community was in the wrong, I specified that. I do agree, a LOT of those changes missed the mark - but I see why it's hard for LO to really come up with a balance that will make people happy. It's not like they have the same liberties that game devs have when they're developing a game (pre-retail). They can't vault weapons (because of the paid weapon issue from earlier) and they can't modify modded weapons or else people's paid for weapons will stop working as intended. About the RFP, I haven't played the game lately enough to know about that situation - but I'll take your word on that. In order for this game to even become viable, the complete business model needs to change concerning weapons - which may have to involve refunding upset customers about their fav premium weapon being nerfed. This is why their balance attempts are less than stellar - a successful company would realize this also, and avoid attaching weapons to real life money at all costs unless you're a looter shooter.

To LO's credit, every time they've tried to even tap the concept of balance in this game at all the community just starts attacking them and demanding that they revert their precious mods/ntec. The bad part about this game and balance is that people paid for weapons (when they used to be exclusive to the Armas Marketplace) - so it's not even like the community is in the wrong when they get mad at their weapon getting nerfed. This was the hole that G1 dug themselves; when a player pays for something, they expect it to just work and be the same way since you bought it. This is how any purchase you make should be. It's a double edged sword whenever they nerf/buff any weapon whatsoever. I still remember the backlash that G1 got for touching the shotgun spread.

Its funny how toxic players are to people who suggest that they should give LO some slack. Consensus on hardcore apb forum dwellers: "nO I DoNT THiNk I wILl! SHuDAp". You guys do realize that it's harder for a company to please you if everything they suggest for the game is met severe backlash? I get it, some updates you all felt like were a miss but I think ANY change to this game should be welcome since it can always be fixed later down the line in your lifetime. This is a stance I've also had with G1, but they never did anything ever except for cash grab with premium weapons for like 7 years. The game is NOT even close to perfect in its current state, otherwise it would live forever and LO wouldn't have had to buy it off of G1. Also, programming on top of someone else's mess, especially a heavily modified engine from pre-2010, is not a cake walk. We've had so much progress, updates, and EVEN OPEN BETA TESTING for the new engine - I don't understand this baseless mentality that "Oh LO has never done anything". Some people are clearly just stuck in 2011.

Unpopular Opinion: I think it was necessary since the toxic APB community can't even be trusted with a dislike button lol. You can tell if the community truly dislikes something by observing the comments, dislikes just enable trolls to be trolls without even reading the post while staying anonymous. I think everyone is overreacting to this change, especially since other social medias do the same thing and people/ideas can still get negative backlash. I get it, it's a feature that some of us used - I understand that we don't like having stuff taken away from us but at the end of the day comments are more powerful and telling anyway. This change encourages the people that dislike something to say specifically why they dislike it instead of just pressing a button. Some people might say "why not just remove reactions all together?". You don't really need to communicate what you like about a post or why you're saying thanks about something, but if you have criticism for something then it's better to voice it so people can assess themselves and others better. A dislike button really doesn't communicate anything at all besides "I disagree" which helps no one and won't convince an opposing view point. Merged. You do bring up an interesting point, but here's the thing: while it may have helped you grow thick skin and properly channel their emotions, the rest of the community hasn't grown up at all. I'll be honest, the majority of APB players (retired and active) are like worse than sweaty CoD and CS players. Also, I don't think it's not up to the game to teach someone how to properly channel their emotions. That just comes with just wanting to be a decent human being. Another thing about people is that you can't trust/expect them to do the things that require them to learn from their mistakes - 9/10 times they won't. Why? If you never cared about being a decent human being to other players then you won't care to learn how to channel emotions either.

Yeah but I think that's what most people's conception of competitive video games are. Technically, you can have a casual game pvp shooter - yes it is competitive in nature still but it is by no means designed to be an esport (the definition of competitive to most gamers). Yes we can use dictionary definitions or whatever, but we all know semantics are governed by the social group you're in/the individuals you're surrounded by. I am not disagreeing with you or anything, APB is technically competitive in nature due to its pvp - but most people believe that the ranking system, design flaws, random elements, and balance stop it from being an esport (or what most consider to be a competitive game). This is also why people didn't consider Battle Royale games to be competitive, since they are technically based mostly on luck despite it being a literal battle till the last person is standing.

I think he/she means e-sports viable, not so much competitive - if so then I agree

On certain snipers only? no ty. adding extra collision for only a few weapons in the game just sounds like a waste of performance