Help-a-Noob

[Havana 216]

Not true. I help actual noobies all the time. And I see ppl teamkill and use Osmaw and run them off nearly every day. 

[Trivirium 62]

I'm currently amidst training 3 new players and 2 of 3 have bought Armas items in the 1 week they've been playing. 

 

As they're true silver/bronze material it can be quite hard trying to teach people as the tutorial basically tells you what to do, but not how to do it effectively. 

 

They use N-Tecs, NSSWs and the likes, it's very hard to encourage weapon changing as the cool down is 4 minutes if they decide that the weapon they change to is ineffective or they don't like it. Considering how APB is about weapon flexibility idk how I can further that reinforcement to use more then just one weapon per game.

 

What I mean by teaching effectively is the tutorial may teach you how to open a door the dumb way, walk up and hit F. Though the MLG gold standard of APB is jumping, hit f mid air and slide out of the way of the door. Nobody teaches you that.

 

Survival tips like not getting out of your car opposite to your opponent for cover, hiding behind corners/walls and waiting, prenading and pretty much any other habitual thing like even constantly switching weapon sides to cover all view angles. All things the tutorial and even game tips sometimes forget to mention.

 

In short, I find that the long standing community of APB has different ways of doing things that'll be always obsolete compared to what the tutorial teaches you. For example, Being able to throw nades under doors, or shoot perfectly between the doors when they're closed (never done it but I've had it happen to me on several occasions). Things like these are not exactly taught yet they're used every day in APB and being a new player is hard enough without all the bells and whistles of an arsenal of effective guns, halved cool downs or even an knowledgeable tutorial.

 

As for this proposed system, it might work, it might not. We have a very small and sometimes unfriendly playerbase and salt is inevitable if someone is using explosives or cheap tactics all together against low ranks and when names get thrown in, things can get messy.

 

And at the end of the day lower ranks which are the new players, are barred off from explosives or even the means to effectively protect themselves from said explosives till R195. 

Friendly reminder that the OPGL is still a 1 hit at distance, and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to land those massive nades.

 

In what way is that fair? The joker store isn't exactly a fair substitute for using flak 24/7 till R195.

But that's a personal gripe I have with full gold teams who go explosive spam against a team of 1 R255 and 3 <R60s.

Edited January 29, 2019 by Trivirium
Consistency/typo

[CookiePuss 5377]

39 minutes ago, Havana said:

Not true. I help actual noobies all the time. And I see ppl teamkill and use Osmaw and run them off nearly every day. 

Wait, you are a bronze dist player?

[Havana 216]

Not true. I help actual noobies all the time. And I see ppl teamkill and use Osmaw and run them off nearly every day. 

[Uru! 50]

19 minutes ago, Trivirium said:

 

you understand that the entire point of the tutorial, or any tutorial in any game, is to teach you the basics

yes?

you also understand how silly it would be to implement "get out of a car on the other side of an enemy" into a tutorial?

i fail to see how you associate that with the tutorial when also mentioning tips, which is where situational things like that belong

 

also, you have to understand that things like jump kicking doors just won't make it into tutorials because it wasn't necessarily an intended feature. do you suppose smash should have tutorials on wavedashing?

[Havana 216]

18 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

Wait, you are a bronze dist player?

Lol, see the focus here. 

That's the problem. Instead of looking at ways to keep new people and them have a good experience, we go straight back to egotism. 

 

I am the low life pos Low Gold / Hi Silver that has No place to play. 

I am 52yo.

I don't use Osmaw EVER!, like everone does when it comes to kill mission, or use car det, etc. I play against myself for my own personal improvement! 

I am 255 with 55k kills mostly from along time ago. 

I am lvl 14 or 15 in every role except sniper (13).

I don't TRYHARD. I don't use some form of Ntec 80%of the time. 

I don't switch weapons 3 or more times a mission to gain every last advantage. I dont park cars on objectives, I don't take objectives up on cheap roof top exploits. 

I am a freak, I like to help train new people, cop or crim. 

I am not part if a group nor do I have any friends that I play with. 

I almost never call in backup even if its a 2 vs 1on Bronze or Silver. 

When I play in Gold I switch to a character that is not 255  usually might as well gain some standing. 

I do just fine with randoms in Gold most cases. Then get ripped by opposing teammates, groups clans that are clearly on discord or TeamSpeak. 

I have nearly every Legendary, All if the ones I want anyway. 

Very rarely use any of them. 

I have used True Ogre about 3 times and felt like a tool. 

I play what gun I feel like at the time. I earned lvl 15 Machine Gunner the old fashioned way. 

All Shaw. No Medusa, Rabid, or the NTEC lmg... Forget the name. 

 

So yeah, I am a really High Silver. 

And I do go back and forth. 

But, Get sick to my stomach seeing people purposely dethreat and doing all the cheapness to new players. I have seen soo many new players quit recently. 

Some ppl I refuse to play with. 

255 but not always use nothing but OPGL and osmaw, car det. 

If I could name names.... Lol

Some so called uber Golds that are well known are seen there on a regular basis. 

Yea, a good time for me is not how  many kills that I got. 

But rather unique kills. Odd untraditional weapon combos. 

Like the hated ISSR and pig or LCR. 

Or, recently going in close quarters with sniper. Iwas always and still am a really shitty sniper player. 

Still practicing jump shots. Quick switching. 

I have fun. I would like to have a mature friend teammate that does not do all the cheap crap listed above. 

But, its always been me, myself and I. 

I guess that shoul be my clan name

MMAI. 

 

[vsb 6171]

6 minutes ago, Havana said:

Like the hated ISSR

you really are a silver lol

[CookiePuss 5377]

6 minutes ago, Havana said:

Lol, see the focus here. 

 

Maybe I have you confused with someone else... I though you were they guy always saying "git gud".

My apologies if I'm mistaken.

[Havana 216]

41 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

Maybe I have you confused with someone else... I though you were they guy always saying "git gud".

My apologies if I'm mistaken.

I have not nor would I ever say that. 

[CookiePuss 5377]

1 minute ago, Havana said:

I have not nor would I ever say that. 

My bad, homie. 

[Havana 216]

42 minutes ago, BXNNXD said:

you really are a silver lol

Oh, Golds frequently rock the Artemis in Silver.?

Or, another put down cuz I don't use the same guns that the majority of you use? 

Whats a tryhard again? 

2 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

My bad, homie. 

All good,  u r 2 of my fave things in one. 

[CookiePuss 5377]

Just now, Havana said:

 

Whats a tryhard again? 

Usually a tryhard is anyone better than you when you have a fragile ego. 

 

[Havana 216]

Most are better than my ol patootie. 

I never understood that term. 

As if to imply its bad to try hard or put forth your best effort. 

And that everyone else is sooo good there barely even looking at the screen when they play and are eating, watching TV,  and having sex all while beating you. 

Worst gaming yerm of all time. 

Let's help new players instead of having pissing contests and selfishly worrying about our APBstatus that no one cares about. 

 

Git Gu...... Lmfao! 

[Xandra94 14]

10 minutes ago, Havana said:

As if to imply its bad to try hard or put forth your best effort. 

And that everyone else is sooo good there barely even looking at the screen when they play and are eating, watching TV,  and having sex all while beating you. 

Worst gaming yerm of all time. 

Let's help new players instead of having pissing contests and selfishly worrying about our APBstatus that no one cares about. 

i always feels bad when i kill a Trainer or a Non-experienced player, i don´t like be hard to the new players 

[Trivirium 62]

3 hours ago, Uru! said:

you understand that the entire point of the tutorial, or any tutorial in any game, is to teach you the basics

yes?

you also understand how silly it would be to implement "get out of a car on the other side of an enemy" into a tutorial?

i fail to see how you associate that with the tutorial when also mentioning tips, which is where situational things like that belong

 

also, you have to understand that things like jump kicking doors just won't make it into tutorials because it wasn't necessarily an intended feature. do you suppose smash should have tutorials on wavedashing?

To have a game with an incredible skill gap and such a small population, yes. Take Blade and Soul for example, with the implementation of the training room, they allow you to learn EVERYTHING there is to know about your class, right down to end tier skills. So like, yeah, I expect to learn how to play the game well through a tutorial. 

 

I don't think it'd be silly at all, it's something that's super simple to do that can save your life and give you the fighting edge in a fight. ESPECIALLY in a game where cover is kinda the point in having a firefight...

 

You're an idiot if you think a tutorial isn't to inform a player as much as possible to improve their time playing the game.. 

 

If it's not an intended feature, fix it. 

 

Be rational.

 

As a side note I'd like to point out your criticism helps nobody, you failed to give an alternate to helping new players deal with the new game/experienced players.

Edited January 30, 2019 by Trivirium
Added side note.

[dailytism 16]

9 hours ago, TheOppositePolarBear said:

idk, having to play a mission while paying attention to the newbie... i could never make it work this far.

 

can we get an spectator mode instead? i would actually love to log in just to watch newbies play and give advice.

or laugh

[Uru! 50]

this is one of the silliest completely serious posts i've read in a while so i'll take your bait

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

To have a game with an incredible skill gap

lol

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

Take Blade and Soul for example,

you mean a game that is not a shooter, with many more mechanics and different classes?

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

 I expect to learn how to play the game well through a tutorial.

"see enemy, shoot enemy, do objective"

tutorial seems fine enough to me

but then, how did generations of kids get by just fine playing megaman without a tutorial holding their hand?

but go ahead and enter a tournament in soulcalibur right after playing the tutorial

what do you mean you can't teach skill in a tutorial?

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

I don't think it'd be silly at all, it's something that's super simple to do that can save your life and give you the fighting edge in a fight. ESPECIALLY in a game where cover is kinda the point in having a firefight...

it's almost like something that belongs as an occasionally useful TIP rather than in the tutorial since it's not a core mechanic to the game

please try to convince me how getting out of a car on the opposite side of an enemy is reliably useful when you're at the beacon

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

You're an idiot if you think a tutorial isn't to inform a player as much as possible to improve their time playing the game..

you're an idiot if you think adding superfluous details to a tutorial will improve a bad player's aim, gamesense, reaction speed, etc.

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

If it's not an intended feature, fix it.

throughout gaming history there have been dozens if not hundreds of instances of unintended interactions being treated and recognized as official techniques by the community and the developers

if you want a super easy example of this, just look at the tribes series where an unintended exploit of the physics engine allowed players to slide incredibly fast on the ground

the result? skiing becoming an integral mechanic of the franchise

how about wavedashing in SSB melee being officially added as a tech to smash ultimate, among many other techs?

honestly, this is such a stupid statement that i think you would get good benefit from just looking at how often this happens here

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

Be rational.

people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones

3 hours ago, Trivirium said:

As a side note I'd like to point out your criticism helps nobody, you failed to give an alternate to helping new players deal with the new game/experienced players.

did you stop to think for one moment that it wasn't my intention

 

i don't believe there is any real solution aside from better matchmaking when a game is more dependent on aim and awareness than anything else

and if you haven't noticed, most people are sick of the absolute state of handholding in games that don't need it, apb is not nearly as complex a game as you make it out to be

 

verdict: 0/10 see me after class

 

Edited January 30, 2019 by Uru!
word

[CookiePuss 5377]

3 minutes ago, Uru! said:

 megaman 

 All these years of therapy and you go and trigger my PTSD with one word. 

 

Now THOSE were some difficult games. 

[Uru! 50]

1 minute ago, CookiePuss said:

 All these years of therapy and you go and trigger my PTSD with one word. 

 

Now THOSE were some difficult games. 

it's a humbling but rewarding experience when you can say that you beat / got better at a game tough as nails without being handheld

i definitely look back on things like that positively

 

similarly, i played a lot of UT2k4 when i got my own first PC, which hardened my aim better than i probably would have playing anything else

Edited January 30, 2019 by Uru!

[CookiePuss 5377]

28 minutes ago, Uru! said:

it's a humbling but rewarding experience when you can say that you beat / got better at a game tough as nails without being handheld

i definitely look back on things like that positively

 

similarly, i played a lot of UT2k4 when i got my own first PC, which hardened my aim better than i probably would have playing anything else

Amen... Amen. 

[Noob_Guardian 417]

8 hours ago, Trivirium said:

I'm currently amidst training 3 new players and 2 of 3 have bought Armas items in the 1 week they've been playing. 

 

As they're true silver/bronze material it can be quite hard trying to teach people as the tutorial basically tells you what to do, but not how to do it effectively. 

 

They use N-Tecs, NSSWs and the likes, it's very hard to encourage weapon changing as the cool down is 4 minutes if they decide that the weapon they change to is ineffective or they don't like it. Considering how APB is about weapon flexibility idk how I can further that reinforcement to use more then just one weapon per game.

 

What I mean by teaching effectively is the tutorial may teach you how to open a door the dumb way, walk up and hit F. Though the MLG gold standard of APB is jumping, hit f mid air and slide out of the way of the door. Nobody teaches you that.

 

Survival tips like not getting out of your car opposite to your opponent for cover, hiding behind corners/walls and waiting, prenading and pretty much any other habitual thing like even constantly switching weapon sides to cover all view angles. All things the tutorial and even game tips sometimes forget to mention.

 

In short, I find that the long standing community of APB has different ways of doing things that'll be always obsolete compared to what the tutorial teaches you. For example, Being able to throw nades under doors, or shoot perfectly between the doors when they're closed (never done it but I've had it happen to me on several occasions). Things like these are not exactly taught yet they're used every day in APB and being a new player is hard enough without all the bells and whistles of an arsenal of effective guns, halved cool downs or even an knowledgeable tutorial.

 

As for this proposed system, it might work, it might not. We have a very small and sometimes unfriendly playerbase and salt is inevitable if someone is using explosives or cheap tactics all together against low ranks and when names get thrown in, things can get messy.

 

And at the end of the day lower ranks which are the new players, are barred off from explosives or even the means to effectively protect themselves from said explosives till R195. 

Friendly reminder that the OPGL is still a 1 hit at distance, and it doesn't take a rocket scientist to land those massive nades.

 

In what way is that fair? The joker store isn't exactly a fair substitute for using flak 24/7 till R195.

But that's a personal gripe I have with full gold teams who go explosive spam against a team of 1 R255 and 3 <R60s.

I agree, but i'll be honest, those door "glitches" are rather annoying and should be fixed.

[Trivirium 62]

4 hours ago, Uru! said:

-snip-

A whole paragraph and a half just to throw a bow on basically saying "ur bad, get gud". 

 

Mega man, yeah, a platformer that afaik, doesn't have more than one person playing at a given time, nor is it against other people.

 

>Uses BnS and genre to debunk previous point, uses a platformer as a point of own. Can't tell if you actually keep track of what you're saying or if you just missed that all together.

 

Also, Soul Calibur and smash both have extensive tutorials on comboing.

 

I don't expect to be a master at a game after a tutorial, and in the instances that game mechanics become usable in game are in the rare instances where again, skill gap is involved and the likes. Regardless the things I mentioned are clearly not intended as apart of APB, that's like saying that every ban ever done over exploiting out-of-map areas shouldn't have been done because "it was a feature".

 

A tutorial is meant to help a player and you just seem to want to hinder any sort of help that the new players could use by saying "fuck em, I didn't have my hand held." The tutorial can also be skipped so there's that too if you're that afraid of having your hand held.

 

What's your deal? Did someone hurt you? Just because you, and like myself and others, have figured out how to play this game, new players who sometimes never have even seen a third person shooter, have a hard enough game to play as it is, but when you have people with the mindset of sink or swim it makes learning a game a lot less fun.

 

The game will die if it doesn't get the help it needs and a tutorial or even an easier way for new players to cope with the current stigma. Something has to change.

 

Moronic to think this game doesn't have a skill gap. Kinda why the threat system has so many issues no?

 

APB might be a simple game, but with weapon ranges, modifications that change statistics that aren't even reflected in game or market properly, mod descriptions being broken and just about every other small thing adds up to a learning curve and complexity intended or not.

 

And after all the whole point of a game is to be fun no? And if you have a hard time learning said game it might not be fun any longer.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 30, 2019 by Trivirium
Additional stuff

[Spillra 135]

2 hours ago, Noob_Guardian said:

I agree, but i'll be honest, those door "glitches" are rather annoying and should be fixed.

its a mechanic that has been there for years and it prevents door camping. I don't see a reason for it to be removed

[Trivirium 62]

44 minutes ago, I3ox said:

its a mechanic that has been there for years and it prevents door camping. I don't see a reason for it to be removed

I very much doubt it was intended, to prevent door camping or not. Throwing a nade clean under a door or through the cracks of a door is silly. Especially with legendary guns with mods specifically designed to punch through doors/objects.

[Spillra 135]

27 minutes ago, Trivirium said:

I very much doubt it was intended, to prevent door camping or not. Throwing a nade clean under a door or through the cracks of a door is silly. Especially with legendary guns with mods specifically designed to punch through doors/objects.

It's not designed for that, but it is a thing though.