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Tunner

PVE in APB (NPC enemies and solo/coop missions)

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The population is very low as always, even seems to be dropping slightly (as always), which is making the game more and more difficult to play (and making more people quit). An MMO PVP game always needs a lot of players to make sure any matchmaking the developers put into it works perfectly. Since the population is currently so low, matchmaking doesnt exist and top players get matched against mediocre players and newbies (and vice versa). I'm sure the population will increase as soon as the game itself improve significantly (after the engine update and whatnot). But what can we do to make the game playable no matter how many players are in, so it is enjoyable even if it's dead?

 

Well, we can do the very same thing all other games do - add enemy NPCs. Instead of having a completely useless unopposed mission, why not add enemy bots into the mission and remove them as soon as real opponents join? Or maybe there can be a whole PVE gamemode/set of missions players can do solo/coop against enemies including bosses or whatnot? Every MMO that has enemy NPCs lives no matter how many or few players play the game. The fun is always there, you don't need full servers to have fun. You can have it with a small group of players or even solo.

 

If NPCs are too hard to get into the game right now, then singleplayer/coop missions should be added into the game, which will trigger when matchmaker cant find you anyone to play against. These missions will give decent rewards allowing you to progress at a reasonable rate, but they will give less rewards than PVP missions, making it everyone's priority to go into PVP whenever possible.

Edited by Tunner
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Adding NPCs is not going to happen (any time soon anyways), mainly because adding NPCs is a lot more work than most people anticipate. Especially any kind of NPC that is supposed to play an objective based game such as APB is. NPCs would be an absolute non-challenge to play against, see Counter-Strike bots as an example. On top of that APB is a multitude more complicated than CS is, meaning the bots needed to run it would need to be just as complicated, and they'd run on the server, which can struggle enough as it is. And this isn't even addressing issues like pathing, logic or prioritisation in the AI.

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We need to get them in game sooner or later. This game cant survive on living players alone. And if its too hard to make NPCs right now, why not just increase unopposed mission rewards so people dont spend half a day waiting for enemies or doing missions for 1$? Its unacceptable not to be able to progress in the game without other players playing. Not to mention when other players actually exist, they just rek you cause they have been gold for like a million years and have all weapons and stuff.

Edited by Tunner
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npc on APB....?! seriously...

I know that the population of this game was really poor, but we need only some more players.

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Agree with Whiskey, there's no need for npc (actually), as i don't even know the actual plans for the development of apb.

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Oke, maybe no npcs. But some dynamic events could give players a bit more to do and it is a nice little break between missions

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Posted (edited)

I think NPCs do make sense and should be added in the long run. But Ill be happy for any kind of PVE, which a person can do solo or in coop and grind rank/money/standing without other players. Especially enforcers need this badly because they have literally no way to farm money properly. They have to create crim chars and go steal. Ridiculous. Same goes for solo grinding rank. Crims can just mug civilians. Neither enfs nor crims can grind standing solo/coop tho. Of course PVE should give you less rewards than PVP, but it should still be a good enough reward for your time and effort put into it.

 

As soon as people know their time in game wont be wasted by constantly waiting for something, they will stay in the game, populating it. Why would anyone play outside prime time when there is literall ynobody to play with and they can tprogress in gam ewithout other players?

Edited by Tunner
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Of course - It'd be much more engaging on low-pop and core additions like enemy AI are a whole mechanic that make a game more fleshed out. The better bonus of enemy AI would be that if behavior was fluid, it'd give replayability and value to combat. More casuals would appear, more content could be built to serve as live-missions that change San Paro as it goes and many more concepts could be expanded on...

 

BUT

Scripting NPC AI that performs like an actual opponent... in a sweaty world... is problematic. It'd take a lot of time, resources and testing. At a bumpy and slow pace that APB goes, it's risky to do that.  It'd also change the core of the whole game by just adding something of the sort. It'd require to game be fixed and stable first. It'd require constant resources for the AI to think. The game would have to go through a ton of stabilisation. A decision to add Enemy AI would also cause divided opinions of the playerbase. Everyone here will be able to express reasonable doubt, but when a chance and resources get presented... I think it'd be something to pay attention to.

 

Imagine though... as a criminal... you going to defend a warehouse that has an attempted police raid. Just Cop NPC's coming at you or Enforcers as a special attack unit, engaging on a criminal enterprise... taking out enemy AI that supposedly operate there... Story bits with AI that lead to random events around the town... Enforcers can find NPC crims and bust them for cash... Criminals can harass npc enforcers to estabilish 'territory'. This is just dreaming and all and would need a bigger world than the districts we have...

 

It's easy to say it'd be cool, but it would take so much risk and time to pull of something in APB...

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From a game design perspective, implementing PvE out of the blue has the potential to wreak unprecedented havoc in an exclusively PvP game.

 

I personally would love a properly-done implementation of PvE.

 

In APB, however, I don't see PvE being a safe direction to include into the game, with essentially all of its design being centered around PvP.

 

8 hours ago, Pufty said:

It's easy to say it'd be cool, but it would take so much risk and time to pull of something in APB...

 

This, and besides all the technical and resource challenges, PvE could very easily damage the value of PvP gameplay for everyone except the most skilled competitive players. PvE could bring in more players, but, of those who would continue to play, it would divide the existing population and their time between PvP and PvE. This is problematic because PvP players will have their matchmaking pool reduced, furthering one of the problems we face with today's matchmaking.

 

From this perspective, I'd only consider entertaining the thought of PvE after matchmaking is improved.

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there's been a thread before about wanting pve and many explained why this wouldn't work for APB in it.

if i find it ill link the thread

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On 9/27/2019 at 5:17 PM, WhiskeyTangoFoxX said:

Adding NPCs is not going to happen (any time soon anyways), mainly because adding NPCs is a lot more work than most people anticipate. Especially any kind of NPC that is supposed to play an objective based game such as APB is. NPCs would be an absolute non-challenge to play against, see Counter-Strike bots as an example. On top of that APB is a multitude more complicated than CS is, meaning the bots needed to run it would need to be just as complicated, and they'd run on the server, which can struggle enough as it is. And this isn't even addressing issues like pathing, logic or prioritisation in the AI.

Nothing significant to the game is gonna happen  is the actual truth. This game is dead and LO is just baiting for last chance revenue to call it quits. Just stop being a sheep of their lies and admit the truth. Every plan that will significantly change the game has been postponed or in other words a fabricated lie. 

giphy.gif

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14 hours ago, Hypothesis said:

Nothing significant to the game is gonna happen  is the actual truth. This game is dead and LO is just baiting for last chance revenue to call it quits. Just stop being a sheep of their lies and admit the truth. Every plan that will significantly change the game has been postponed or in other words a fabricated lie.

Matt:  "Lets buy this nearly bankrupt company with an awful reputation that has two dead games that cost more to run than they make and not do anything, that'll bring in the revenue"

 

Mhm sure.  Something being postponed doesn't make it a lie.  It's just coming out later than expected.  Game development is unpredictable, especially in APB's case.  I mean we have a few members of the community that have played the engine upgrade and even posted videos and screenshots.

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16 hours ago, BrandonBranderson said:

Matt:  "Lets buy this nearly bankrupt company with an awful reputation that has two dead games that cost more to run than they make and not do anything, that'll bring in the revenue"

 

Mhm sure.  Something being postponed doesn't make it a lie.  It's just coming out later than expected.  Game development is unpredictable, especially in APB's case.  I mean we have a few members of the community that have played the engine upgrade and even posted videos and screenshots.

postponed is another word for "we dont have it but we give  you a false hope it will happen soon"   and truth is none of the postponed crap is happening. ALL THEY DID SIGNIFICANTLY WAS FIX ARMAS AND ENCOURAGE CHEATERS TO STREAM APB WITH THEIR CHEATS.

giphy.gif 

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