Siamsol 31 Posted August 16, 2018 I'm wondering if LO factors fragile into their ideas of proper weapon balance. They nerfed the Strife so it couldn't one-shot fragile, yet they upped the Shredder to the point where a 2-shot on fragile is almost guaranteed. Before these shotgun changes, one of the most dangerous guns versus fragile was the OBIR, with its 0.45s burst interval and dying in only 2 bursts. With the shotgun consistency change, Shredder getting both a damage increase AND a rate of fire increase is inane. Previously, it would take 0.42s with high accuracy requirements to 2-shot fragile. Yet now the damage is high enough that it's extremely easy to deal >860 damage compared to before, and it happens in only 0.37s. Shredder now tops OBIR for killing fragile almost instantly, easily offsetting the Yukon bug-fix. In my opinion for fragile to be an actual choice, dying to a primary weapon in 0.37s is unacceptable. There's no counter-play there, even with Shredder's range or damage nerfed slightly. I think the rate of fire should be reversed in whatever post-shotgun-patch you test, else it becomes very problematic for fragile. I can deal with getting two-shot since that's the price I pay, but not with TTK creep being added. And yes, I know everyone is going to comment about fragile being a joke. The meta is CA3 and nothing but CA3. I've been using fragile since it released, and I think it is undervalued - it gives opportunities for flanking, dodging shots, faster corner peeking, stacks with epinephrine, doesn't nullify med-spray like CA3, and doesn't suffer from the insanely high time to full-heal that CA3 does. You'd be surprised what you can pull off with it. Even if you think it's a joke, having the lowest TTK on fragile upset by 20% is a huge change - and that's while classifying it as a fragile counter-pick and not a normal gun. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vsb 6174 Posted August 16, 2018 even if the rof is reverted the gun is still going to be a problem for fragile users, the mod itself just isnt very good tbh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tennogrineer 71 Posted August 16, 2018 i never saw fragile as a "joke". to me it's a handicap people choose to use for an added challenge and serves that purpose well. seen many do well with it (even after the patch), much like how i seen many run completely modless and still do better than anyone else. while i'd admit this most likely means these people are just better players.. does it really need changing if its just a niche way to play? for example, using kevlar or flak jacket..just fun alternatives to change it up. nothing has to be as optimal as clotting agent. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vsb 6174 Posted August 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, tennogrineer said: i never saw fragile as a "joke". to me it's a handicap people choose to use for an added challenge and serves that purpose well. seen many do well with it (even after the patch), much like how i seen many run completely modless and still do better than anyone else. while i'd admit this most likely means these people are just better players.. does it really need changing if its just a niche way to play? for example, using kevlar or flak jacket..just fun alternatives to change it up. nothing has to be as optimal as clotting agent. i kind of understand your point but in a game that has the "rock paper scissors" balance method so ingrained (or at least it used to), wouldnt it be more optimal to actually have paper and scissors instead of just rock? granted i dont think giving fragile a speed increase to the point where its a truly viable green mod option would be very balanced Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CombatMedic02 25 Posted August 16, 2018 I've been using it recently to run further, quicker in order to arrest my stuns. Ducking in and out of cover is a must but it's a decent mod. Previously I had been using CA3 solidly, it's a real shock when you realize how fast you could have been healed having not used it for a couple of matches. Now days I'm switching between Flak Jacket and Fragile. I really like Flak Jacket too, I think that mod is also a bit underrated. Would be nice to see more green mods to challenge the CA3 culture, shake up the gameplay a little and provide a bit of mod diversity. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheHidden-Tember 142 Posted August 16, 2018 I honestly think that nerfing the strife so it doesn't 2shot fragile users is a joke. The only point of the strife is doing 99% damage at ridiculous ranges, if it doesn't have that it's not worth using due to the piss-poor rate of fire. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foolish ninja 59 Posted August 16, 2018 42 minutes ago, TheHidden-Tember said: I honestly think that nerfing the strife so it doesn't 2shot fragile users is a joke. The only point of the strife is doing 99% damage at ridiculous ranges, if it doesn't have that it's not worth using due to the piss-poor rate of fire. Its so rare seeing people using fragile, why even bother? Also strife is just bad with his high TTK as a CQB weapon with just 7,5m range. Any gun can outperform it at any range. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
V2050 31 Posted August 16, 2018 I guess the problem with making Fragile too viable would be turning it into the new non-plus-ultra meta. Players can be already so fast to track for me, I dread in terror thinking about a whole district equipping a buffed-up Fragile. The only thing faster than that would be a Warframe PvP match. But still, Fragile is a fun mod and it's just a pity to see how undervalued it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
