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2016 State of the Game


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#41
Wariwulf

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Sure, this game didn't get the treatment he had need. But the experience was great.

Players carried the game for years.
Past, bugs and balance FE is one of the best MMO I played.

Hope they'll tell us before shutting down, want to jump in for the last hours !


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#42
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Whats really sad about all this is FE changed hands to Gamersfirst back in the day, and they talked a big game about making it better then they did for awhile and did the same thing the old company did, so one of two things well happen it well get shut down or change hands again to a new company



#43
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I'm sitting here with my FE T-shirt on .. listing to Radioactive and remembering all the fun this game has given me over the years, trying not to be so sad over its obvious demise. I have loved Fallen Earth since my first day in Alpha testing, there really is no other MMO that can come close to OUR apocalypse.

 

I want to have hope, but G1 throws silence at us instead of a life preserver.

 

Not even a Valentines Day event last month, that's how much G1 thinks of us.

 

I told you this game will end if you push pvp on people, that is what they did, nerf loot for pve and placed it all on pvp small areas, and this is one of many things done to pve community, you can see how well pvp community survive without pve community, GOOD LUCK saving FE.


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#44
Calais

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I told you this game will end if you push pvp on people, that is what they did, nerf loot for pve and placed it all on pvp small areas, and this is one of many things done to pve community, you can see how well pvp community survive without pve community, GOOD LUCK saving FE.

Why do you word it like this? We all went to crafter market, we all attended little events here and there, we all farmed bosses, we all done gore, we all sat at new flagstaff and citadel crafting together. We all wanted bugs to be fixed and we all loved this game and hoped for amazing new content but Fallen Earth is built on a bad engine that has a lot of shortcomings coupled with the amount of new titles and how inflated the gaming market is with new stuff Fallen  Earth was bound to be abandoned.


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#45
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If anything the PvP community provided much needed CPR as long as possible. As Clammy said, they participated in almost every aspect of the game including RP (even if some of them were not aware of it ..hahaha).  Although  blamed for exploiting bugs in actuality they were the ones who did the most testing and reporting. 

 

PvP is a type of gameplay not a prereq for Terrorism 101, get over it.

 

The blame goes to G1 entirely for breaking every single promise they made during the podcast held when it was announced that Icarus sold FE to them.  They repeatedly made bad choices and refused to advertise our game, the devs took orders and lost touch with the heart of the game .. its players.

 

The only difference is that they just stopped pretending that they give a crap, it obviously no longer matters that we know this.



#46
Reaps989

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If anything the PvP community provided much needed CPR as long as possible. As Clammy said, they participated in almost every aspect of the game including RP (even if some of them were not aware of it ..hahaha).  Although  blamed for exploiting bugs in actuality they were the ones who did the most testing and reporting. 

 

PvP is a type of gameplay not a prereq for Terrorism 101, get over it.

 

The blame goes to G1 entirely for breaking every single promise they made during the podcast held when it was announced that Icarus sold FE to them.  They repeatedly made bad choices and refused to advertise our game, the devs took orders and lost touch with the heart of the game .. its players.

 

The only difference is that they just stopped pretending that they give a crap, it obviously no longer matters that we know this.

 

One of two ways to fix this...

 

Bring Scapegoat back so we actually have updates, since once they were gone we didn't see a single change.

 

Or

 

Just hand it over to me and let me pull a team together that actually gives a flying gosh darn. Which ya, people will go "If Nysek is Dev/GM the game will die". Which I will not deny I have enemies in many many places. But at no point can anyone begin to claim that "this" Fallen Earth would be a better one than dealing with Ze Pope :o

The more beautiful thing is Clan Banner's "hotfix" to stop people from using it to block entrances or other such nonsense. 10kg? Last I checked it is completely possible to make it so you cannot place certain objects within a certain range of another. So how do you fix it?

 

  • Increase the range a flag can be placed near another.
  • Increase the cooldown before you are allowed to place another flag, which would also help PVP flag spamming,
  • Increase the range a flag can be allowed to be placed next to objects such as Lifenets and Progress Town buildings.

 

Truthfully I would like to see clan banners removed, completely, or at least nerfed to where they die much faster and their range is reduced at least to 60m rather than 100m.

 

At no point to clan banners make PVP interesting, at best they provide an efficient way to handle zergs if they do not possess one themselves.


Edited by Reaps989, 29 May 2016 - 09:55 AM.

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#47
wastelanderer

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If anything the PvP community provided much needed CPR as long as possible. As Clammy said, they participated in almost every aspect of the game including RP (even if some of them were not aware of it ..hahaha).  Although  blamed for exploiting bugs in actuality they were the ones who did the most testing and reporting. 

 

PvP is a type of gameplay not a prereq for Terrorism 101, get over it.

 

The blame goes to G1 entirely for breaking every single promise they made during the podcast held when it was announced that Icarus sold FE to them.  They repeatedly made bad choices and refused to advertise our game, the devs took orders and lost touch with the heart of the game .. its players.

 

The only difference is that they just stopped pretending that they give a crap, it obviously no longer matters that we know this.

 

PVP is a type of gameplay that should not be forced on everyone, it should only be as a choice, giving all materials and loot to PVP is a big mistake that FE owners made.


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#48
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PVP is a type of gameplay that should not be forced on everyone, it should only be as a choice, giving all materials and loot to PVP is a big mistake that FE owners made.

 

No, the mistake of taking away resource nodes and making them random was a big mistake.

 

The choice of not providing a PVE Alternative to harvesters that you have to defend, was a big mistake.

Giving more reward for entering a PVP zone has never been a mistake.


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#49
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Hmm, blame pvpers, cmon bro bro.... Personally I think fe had a mommyty dev team. Really, lets not keep balance with new items and gear at end game. I don't understand why they didn't keep consistency and add diversity instead making a majority of their work obsolute. No point to tw/faction/dt weapons (but hey, fight for center keep lol)

Wastelander, would it really have been hard to add those reskins as recipes for the omnibus system and have clothing, armo, drinks, food ect with more diverse modifiers? Shirt with dodge or ea, reduction of harvest time, social. Shooooot the content was there, some locations could be changed to monsters ect, and the reward changed to a new book with a recipe. Pvers would run around each zone, and people would even farm for books. They could have even made some items require 180 crafting skill

Gore didn't have to be op, just different modifiers, or coresuit, ect. I took a super rough stab at what that could look like (of course it would need huge fixes) I've been playing eso and their last dlcs added new gear that didn't trash away existing content.

I wish they could have found a better equalizing system for pvp zones and pve instances. And put dev. Time to expanding skills. For example, adding a banker or riders perks/skill line or expand the sub faction story line or skill line or items. If this was done in par with existed content the game could have been so much better.

Sadly even a lot of new games are garbage. Not much has really captured me. Of course they could have potentially relaunched a new engine as well. Repop did with fragmented. As people suggested, they could even crowdsourced especially when it was the craze.

Well i say nysek for dev/gm.......or maybe you've been all along.....muahahaha

#50
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Well i say nysek for dev/gm.......or maybe you've been all along.....muahahaha

 

We all know I'm the best GM NA


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#51
LilRedhare

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PVP is a type of gameplay that should not be forced on everyone, it should only be as a choice, giving all materials and loot to PVP is a big mistake that FE owners made.

PvP was never forced on anyone:

 

1) When G.O.R.E. was OP, it was gotten in PvE....DT was never a requirement to make a G.O.R.E. weapon and ANYONE could make them, as the skill requirement was ONE (1). Yes, rothium is/was required and harvesting is/was the most efficient way to get it...but you could also BUY it if PvP was so distasteful.

 

2) DT/AP weapons aren't required for PvE...and never have been. A pair of Neverenders are nice to have and sound cool when grinding Radburg, but a pair of Puma Invictus work just fine (and look cool as hell), and a Retooled Hexweave or Stage 2 Coresuit is plenty of protection from Armored Hulks.

 

3) Nowadays, you can get everything you need to make GT gear without ever having to set foot in a PvP zone. I just completed a GT Support Suit two weeks ago for a friend and didn't have to harvest a thing. What exactly would you need that REQUIRES you to PvP, then and now?

 

4) We've had this talk before...and the conclusion hasn't changed.

 

FE makes PvE BORING...it's practically handed to you. There's nothing you need that you HAVE to go get in a PvP zone (or can't simply buy off the AH that someone else went and got in a PvP zone...then again, you don't HAVE to have Lizard Dog Serum). There's a big difference between being forced into PvP rather than getting bent over by a kill team while trying to harvest piles of rothium in an effort to flood the market and make yourself rich. I'm sorry...I may be wrong, but this sounds like sour g****s to me.


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#52
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1) When G.O.R.E. was OP, it was gotten in PvE....DT was never a requirement to make a G.O.R.E. weapon and ANYONE could make them, as the skill requirement was ONE (1). Yes, rothium is/was required and harvesting is/was the most efficient way to get it...but you could also BUY it if PvP was so distasteful.

 

G.O.R.E. weapons did all require a particular component that could only be gotten by buying it with DeathToll from DT merchant in TC sector OR winning /roll in CItadel amongst all the other players from the boss (good luck with that) or buying it or the completed weapon itself from AH.

 

The thing about AH is that for PVE players, earning money is a chore. A very boring chore.  Yes I have seen the threads about earning chips, but those methods are so dull, slow-paced and not engaging at all. They may have been the norm 10+ years ago during the dawn of Korean MMORPGs but the bar has been raised; we want to have fun earning money, not act like robots at a factory assembly line drooling our sanity away doing some simplistic pre-programmed routine a thousand times.

PVE hits a wall here and loses all motivation to continue playing. I can totally understand a player for leaving the game at this point, there is nothing fun left for them.

 

 


 

2) DT/AP weapons aren't required for PvE...and never have been. A pair of Neverenders are nice to have and sound cool when grinding Radburg, but a pair of Puma Invictus work just fine (and look cool as hell), and a Retooled Hexweave or Stage 2 Coresuit is plenty of protection from Armored Hulks.

 

3) Nowadays, you can get everything you need to make GT gear without ever having to set foot in a PvP zone. I just completed a GT Support Suit two weeks ago for a friend and didn't have to harvest a thing. What exactly would you need that REQUIRES you to PvP, then and now?

 

And here is the root of the problem. They simply stopped developing proper PVE content. I consider the top tier Faction gear to be the goal PVE players should strive to get (despite that earning faction rep is also another dull problem). Everything that came afterwards is very anti-PVE.

 

- GORE weapons with exclusive components that PVE will have a very hard time to get their hands on. Getting GORE boss baits is another pain. And their luck-based recipe drops makes said pain grow into a tumor.

- Dome.  Stupid. It's just stupid. Very build-restrictive and repetitive as @#$! using the very hated token system.  It doesn't belong in FE at all. Llike Adam Jensen said:  "I never asked for this."

- Outpost: Broken and incomplete as hell. Also, more token BS-ery. Getting Strong Rubber from the right nodes is another %(@#  rng instead of just adding a Refine Strong Rubber recipe. And as usual nobody bothers with the Faction town world events due to terrible rewards; some are impossible to finish due to time limit and OP enemies. ("defend radio tower before enemies destroy it" at Trav town for example)

 

So by saying "you don't need to have this", you might as well say "you don't need to play anymore".  Because the PVE players have no other content left to strive for. Their frustration builds up and they need to take it out on somebody else. PVP players just happen to be in the room with them.

PVE: IT'S GOOFY TIME!  :chairwack:

 

PVP: NO, PVE! NO!   :waah:

 

 

(and yeah, I know it's not PVP that ruined the game for PVE. It's critically bad design choices by the devs/G1 that did that)

 

 



but this sounds like sour g****s to me.

 

Oh lawl that auto-censorship. Not even a sweet piece of fruit is spared.  :Ha Ha Ha:


Edited by MystMan, 31 May 2016 - 03:57 AM.


#53
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- Dome.  Stupid. It's just stupid. Very build-restrictive and repetitive as @#$! using the very hated token system.  It doesn't belong in FE at all. Llike Adam Jensen said:  "I never asked for this."

 

Gonna stop you here...

 

  • 156 FA and 129 Empathic is hardly "build restrictive"
  • Even without both players having it, it's smart to team with someone that has heavy heals while the other tanks.
     

But I agree, Dome was never "asked" for. If you can find content in FE that would warrant AP weapons as a reward... humor me. Because the rest of PVE is depressing.


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#54
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Just LOL, PVP caused PVE to be in the state it is?

 

GORE cited as a problem? GORE isnt even relevant anymore, but when it was it was easy enough to get, without ANY PVP involvement,  The big problem with it wasnt the baits or boss loots but the shop item needed to prevent loss on upgrade fail. 

 

Above posts are right, for PVE you dont even deed GORE, DT, stage3 armour, etc, pumas and faction or vol armour will do it, DT and stage3 is just for rambo soloing bosses (and PVP).

 

The PVP is what has kept as many in the game for this long, your right that PVE is kinda pointless once you hit 55, but thats Gamerslast fault, not the PVP players.



#55
MystMan

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Gonna stop you here...

 

  • 156 FA and 129 Empathic is hardly "build restrictive"
  • Even without both players having it, it's smart to team with someone that has heavy heals while the other tanks.
     

But I agree, Dome was never "asked" for. If you can find content in FE that would warrant AP weapons as a reward... humor me. Because the rest of PVE is depressing.

 

I should've said Gear-restrictive instead of build-restrictive.  Mah bad.

 

I tried Dome with a pistol user (Redstone 0.40) and my partner was melee.  He obviously didn't stand a chance in round 2. After he dies, alone I can't dish out enough DPS to kill the eggs fast enough so when there were only 3 Scorpions left they became so huge and fast I couldn't win that. After I saw how much token we won and the price for Dome items, I realize the grindfest Dome was intended to be.  "Screw this I'm out" was my reaction.

 

There is grinding done right, there is grinding done wrong.  Dome is the latter.

It would've been nice to at least be able to select the order you could fight the bosses to change the pace. Not the same thing over and over in the exact same order. Jeez that is depressingly dull.


Edited by MystMan, 31 May 2016 - 04:19 AM.


#56
Reaps989

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I should've said Gear-restrictive instead of build-restrictive.  Mah bad.

 

I tried Dome with a pistol user (Redstone 0.40) and my partner was melee.  He obviously didn't stand a chance in round 2. After he dies, alone I can't dish out enough DPS to kill the eggs fast enough so when there were only 3 Scorpions left they became so huge and fast I couldn't win that. After I saw how much token we won and the price for Dome items, I realize the grindfest Dome was intended to be.  "Screw this I'm out" was my reaction.

 

There is grinding done right, there is grinding done wrong.  Dome is the latter.

It would've been nice to at least be able to select the order you could fight the bosses to change the pace. Not the same thing over and over in the exact same order. Jeez that is depressingly dull.

 

Well you can thank round 2 for being annoying thanks to them balancing it based on Big B's -_-

It used to be doable by all weapons level 45+. But since they listened to the tards going "This is too easy" with Big B's when they had 147 damage and easily 50% higher DPS or more than anything else we could use... ya it was special.


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#57
LilRedhare

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1) G.O.R.E. weapons did all require a particular component that could only be gotten by buying it with DeathToll from DT merchant in TC sector OR winning /roll in CItadel amongst all the other players from the boss (good luck with that) or buying it or the completed weapon itself from AH.

 

2) The thing about AH is that for PVE players, earning money is a chore. A very boring chore.  Yes I have seen the threads about earning chips, but those methods are so dull, slow-paced and not engaging at all. They may have been the norm 10+ years ago during the dawn of Korean MMORPGs but the bar has been raised; we want to have fun earning money, not act like robots at a factory assembly line drooling our sanity away doing some simplistic pre-programmed routine a thousand times.

PVE hits a wall here and loses all motivation to continue playing. I can totally understand a player for leaving the game at this point, there is nothing fun left for them.

 

 

 

3) And here is the root of the problem. They simply stopped developing proper PVE content. I consider the top tier Faction gear to be the goal PVE players should strive to get (despite that earning faction rep is also another dull problem). Everything that came afterwards is very anti-PVE.

 

- 4) GORE weapons with exclusive components that PVE will have a very hard time to get their hands on. Getting GORE boss baits is another pain. And their luck-based recipe drops makes said pain grow into a tumor.

- Dome.  Stupid. It's just stupid. Very build-restrictive and repetitive as @#$! using the very hated token system.  It doesn't belong in FE at all. Llike Adam Jensen said:  "I never asked for this."

- Outpost: Broken and incomplete as hell. Also, more token BS-ery. Getting Strong Rubber from the right nodes is another %(@#  rng instead of just adding a Refine Strong Rubber recipe. And as usual nobody bothers with the Faction town world events due to terrible rewards; some are impossible to finish due to time limit and OP enemies. ("defend radio tower before enemies destroy it" at Trav town for example)

 

5) So by saying "you don't need to have this", you might as well say "you don't need to play anymore".  Because the PVE players have no other content left to strive for. Their frustration builds up and they need to take it out on somebody else. PVP players just happen to be in the room with them.

PVE: IT'S GOOFY TIME!  :chairwack:

 

PVP: NO, PVE! NO!   :waah:

 

 

(and yeah, I know it's not PVP that ruined the game for PVE. It's critically bad design choices by the devs/G1 that did that)

 

 

 

6) Oh lawl that auto-censorship. Not even a sweet piece of fruit is spared:Ha Ha Ha:

Not that I disagree...but none of that lines up with your original argument...

 

1) That just lends weight to what I said earlier...you could get a small shiva neutralizer by winning a roll at cit-thus no need to engage in PvP. Cit is much less of a grind than most game activities and a lot more rewarding, and I actually still enjoy the occasional G.O.R.E. boss, if for nothing more than the Lols.

 

2) Earning money is a chore for ALL players (God, if real life isn't the same...).

 

3) Amen to that...no argument there...but how is that the fault of the PvP community?

 

4) See no. 1 AND no. 3...and NO ONE asked for Dome.

 

5) And PvP died because that was all that was left for anyone to do? It's not like all PvPers do is PvP. Many players (me included) enjoy all aspects of the game, and the lack of PvE content bothers us, too (well...that and the broke-a$$ combat system...)

 

6) Dammit, Tiggs...leave my fruit alone!

 

I totally agree that PvE content was fumbled like a bar of soap at Attica (with the same end result...pun intended...), but again, where is the PvP community culpable for this? You're going have to lay this one squarely at the feet of the development team, sore as I am to admit it.


Edited by LilRedhare, 31 May 2016 - 08:19 PM.

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#58
MystMan

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3) Amen to that...no argument there...but how is that the fault of the PvP community?

 

 

 

but again, where is the PvP community culpable for this?

 

Are you asking me?  I never blamed PVP. Check my message under the smilies.    Wastelanderer did the pvp-blaming. I only pointed out why many PVE players use the the "forced-pvp" argument so many times through the years. PVP players have a marginal something to do in FE while PVE have absolutely nothing.

 

It's frustration and feeling of neglect that made them have to blame somebody who will actually listen to them. And we all know the devs don't fall in the "I'm listening" category. 

 

 

 

 

2) Earning money is a chore for ALL players (God, if real life isn't the same...).

 

I don't hate chores per se. Chores can be fun.  It's about their execution that make them fun (or not).  Other games just do it better.


Edited by MystMan, 01 June 2016 - 02:52 AM.


#59
LilRedhare

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1) It's frustration and feeling of neglect that made them have to blame somebody who will actually listen to them. And we all know the devs don't fall in the "I'm listening" category. 

 

2) I don't hate chores per se. Chores can be fun.  It's about their execution that make them fun (or not).  Other games just do it better.

1) I'm a firm believer in placing the blame where it belongs, whether the culpable party is listening or not, but as far as the listening thing goes, this isn't just on the development team. In the dev's defense, it's not that they're NOT listening. Some of the lack of response is "they're listening, but aren't able or allowed to respond". They are employees, and the good ones do as their leadership tells them to do. There is also a funding issue at stake here and more going on than we know, most likely. The letter I wrote was to GamersFirst CEO Bjorn Book-Larsen, not Skathi. HE was the one who made the decision to pour millions into APB Reloaded while ignoring Fallen Earth. HE was the one who failed to see it's potential. I blame him as much, if not more, than the dev team, and he's NEVER listened to anything the gaming community has to say. At least we got State of the Game updates on FE until fairly recently from the dev team. Don't get this twisted...I totally agree that they dropped this game like a Mark Sanchez pass...I don't agree that it's all they're fault.

 

2) IMO, The execution of a chore is on the person doing it...don't you agree? I've never found G.O.R.E. bosses boring (albiet a bit easy after you figure them out, especially Buzz). The only thing I find tedious is sitting in the middle of a field grinding mats like cotton, running from node to node for an hour. I offset this by putting on some music and talking with friends on steam or in chat, and then doing something I LOVE to do after I have enough. And don't think for a second that PvP can't get stale or boring. PvPers get tired of PvP, too, especially when the only fights to be had are zergs or toggle kiddie rerolls...THAT crap gets old fast. However, I used to LOVE those TNO zergs, fighting them short at 1-to-2 odds or worse...but when someone b*tches up and toggles on you...it removes the challenge and fun from the game and makes PvP a chore. Then again, how the chore is executed is on me...and I'm the one who has to find the fun in it.


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#60
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Not that I disagree...but none of that lines up with your original argument...
 
1) That just lends weight to what I said earlier...you could get a small shiva neutralizer by winning a roll at cit-thus no need to engage in PvP. Cit is much less of a grind than most game activities and a lot more rewarding, and I actually still enjoy the occasional G.O.R.E. boss, if for nothing more than the Lols.
 
2) Earning money is a chore for ALL players (God, if real life isn't the same...).
 
3) Amen to that...no argument there...but how is that the fault of the PvP community?
 
4) See no. 1 AND no. 3...and NO ONE asked for Dome.
 
5) And PvP died because that was all that was left for anyone to do? It's not like all PvPers do is PvP. Many players (me included) enjoy all aspects of the game, and the lack of PvE content bothers us, too (well...that and the broke-a$$ combat system...)
 
6) Dammit, Tiggs...leave my fruit alone!
 
I totally agree that PvE content was fumbled like a bar of soap at Attica (with the same end result...pun intended...), but again, where is the PvP community culpable for this? You're going have to lay this one squarely at the feet of the development team, sore as I am to admit it.

Not his argument check forum names and dates.

Gore was pvp/pve split no matter how you want to look at it. Gore was only not mandatory due to pve not requiring it but it doesn't change that it was 60/40 when it came to requirements. When the biggest farm material(rothium) is pvp exclusive that makes it pretty pvp mandated. Nevermind they were pushing that heavy on pvp...ever wonder why pvpers were told 'just try it' and it took so long to nerf?

Money is a bigger pain for pvers then and always has been due to quests being absolute trash for rewards and buying/selling not necessarily being that profitable. This was made even worse when harvesters were clearly #1 and they screwed nodes over in an attempt to balance the economy(another part 1 of 3 that never got past stage 1/2 or if it finished it was under terrible guidance). In fact most of the time pvpers had it easier for money due to them finding more of these exploits and keeping them closed house or fairly exclusive exploits(common plastic when it was added in haietta selling for 20 red a stack).

PVP died as there was no reason to. They nerfed the pulls and ties to it. Faction, harvesters, crafting etc. When TC was really active and pvpers kept having pvp and the like it wasn't due to pvper suddenly flooding the game it was there were crafters and the like that wanted in and pvpers wanted a reason to pvp so they fed off each other in this aspect. And then pvp drama which always kept pvp alive in some form. PvPers historically have not cared about pve but due to it being a means to an end and understanding this it was done and finished and they got back to business. If pvpers got involved in other areas(pvpers not people who dabble in pvp and deem themselves pvpers) it was usually out of boredom or to get the ball rolling for themselves.
 

1) I'm a firm believer in placing the blame where it belongs, whether the culpable party is listening or not, but as far as the listening thing goes, this isn't just on the development team. In the dev's defense, it's not that they're NOT listening. Some of the lack of response is "they're listening, but aren't able or allowed to respond". They are employees, and the good ones do as their leadership tells them to do. There is also a funding issue at stake here and more going on than we know, most likely. The letter I wrote was to GamersFirst CEO Bjorn Book-Larsen, not Skathi. HE was the one who made the decision to pour millions into APB Reloaded while ignoring Fallen Earth. HE was the one who failed to see it's potential. I blame him as much, if not more, than the dev team, and he's NEVER listened to anything the gaming community has to say. At least we got State of the Game updates on FE until fairly recently from the dev team. Don't get this twisted...I totally agree that they dropped this game like a Mark Sanchez pass...I don't agree that it's all they're fault.
 
2) IMO, The execution of a chore is on the person doing it...don't you agree? I've never found G.O.R.E. bosses boring (albiet a bit easy after you figure them out, especially Buzz). The only thing I find tedious is sitting in the middle of a field grinding mats like cotton, running from node to node for an hour. I offset this by putting on some music and talking with friends on steam or in chat, and then doing something I LOVE to do after I have enough. And don't think for a second that PvP can't get stale or boring. PvPers get tired of PvP, too, especially when the only fights to be had are zergs or toggle kiddie rerolls...THAT crap gets old fast. However, I used to LOVE those TNO zergs, fighting them short at 1-to-2 odds or worse...but when someone b*tches up and toggles on you...it removes the challenge and fun from the game and makes PvP a chore. Then again, how the chore is executed is on me...and I'm the one who has to find the fun in it.

1) No this is a developer problem. They are disconnected from the reality of the game. Anyone whom has dealt with them or talked to them about things realizes this(trying to talk to them about why the action disabling version of diplomatic immunity was pulling teeth...random changes on someone suggesting it offhand etc). And if it was anything its due to the fact that apb has double or more pop than fe and always has and that's with absolute minimal to no additions to the game in the last 2 years. Nevermind the ceiling and actual income for apb has always been higher. Ever wonder why fe copied the gamble boxes from apb? There's a good reason for that. Everyone I've talked to between fe and apb has spent 1k-2k+ in apb...no one has breached 1k in fe.

Ever talk to the devs about the skills and how they work? That's a fantastic experience that highlights their lack of understanding of how they work or their purpose. And the fact they are afraid of change or taking chances. Ever wonder why ap weapons have everything? Ever wonder why they try to do bad bandaids and forget they did them? Ever wonder why bugs keep coming back? Incompetence, poor habits and not wanting to make people make choices. Which highlights amazingly their lack of understanding of why this game was liked and options that were seen as strong.

2) If the bosses aren't done by total randoms they are a snorefest. I've fallen asleep doing lilith a few times i believe lol. Please those fights in pvp were rarely lost to people toggling. Group fights are the biggest counter to them really. 1/2 hell lets say it was the 5/6 suspected...never impacted the big fights to that extent. They only really impacted small fights.

Grinding is a snorefest in fe hell it's only usually been tolerable as you don't have to pay attention while doing it usually.


edit:

I have a reccuring thought - why did original company fired most of dev team? Why did they sell their product off to g1? What's wrong with fe? Why didn't it make enough money? Why is this project cursed with bad luck? Why is it at every step one step short of success? What's wrong with fe? What caused this failure?

Edit :

Did icarus foresee that fe was unsalvageable and that all the diseases plaguing it now were unavoidable? That they were going to lose money on this and the best thing was to sell this sick horse to someone else? Was it really that unprofitable?

How much does it cost g1 to run this product monthly? With so very little people how is it not costing them more server fees than whatever players give in g1 dollars?

They stated that much of the team was no longer needed as they were acquired for the final push.

And you have to realize early on there were big issues and what not. Little information was out there(current info for the game might as well be a glory age for fe as back then there was nothing or extremely little or it was kept close). This lead to people getting to endgame and either rerolling or not playing.

Then on this you have game changing bugs and fixes/nerfs. Buffing to capstones, wheel flipping, buff limit etc. This lead to borked builds and the like requiring rerolls or quitting again after they got fixed. Nerfs to stuff like dual thermal/sonic...putting 2 skills on a shared cooldown due to their burst being too strong which no other skills had which lead to rerolling/quitting.

No respecs to be hardcore was their biggest early-on mistake which hurt them hugely with how little transparency and support for this stuff there was and the complexity and perceived complexity.

This is something in the dev team. Dunno how after being basically trimmed to a handful from a full proper overflowing team this sort of thing is still around. Incompetence and no overarching plan essentially did them in as they kept redoing(2-4 combat systems so far, multiple projects started and stopped halfway etc).

Edited by AgentNoir, 01 June 2016 - 04:50 PM.

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#61
Reaps989

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@Kit

 

While G1 controls some things, they gained development rights after making Ironfoot Studios.

Now yes, GORE was probably the fault of G1 as an idea of "powerful weapons". The biggest issue was that the current stats of GORE would have been perfectly fine compared to DT tier 2 stats without being broken.

 

As for the rest... simply poor choices. G1 didn't decide the patches, they simply said "We'd like this... do it.". It's the Dev team that made everything that it is.


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#62
DakkaDakkaDakka

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I keep hearing about dome and I just gotta say - I liked dome.

It's not something you're meant to be doing with two random chars with random weapons. You're meant to make dedicated characters with dedicated builds and dedicated gear. It's not a casual thing you drop in for. This actually takes a bit of work and doesn't yield easily just to anyone. I liked it and it shouldn't be made easier. Once you have nothing else to do, dome is kind of a challenge to sink your teeth into. Get chars for it, gear, builds, consumes, to try and fail at it till you figure it out... It was great. They shouldn't have added it to bloodsports window though, that absolutely broke random button. You do not want to be matched up with a fresh level 50 in warlord and a level 40 assault rifle for dome and neither does he.

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#63
Reaps989

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I keep hearing about dome and I just gotta say - I liked dome.

It's not something you're meant to be doing with two random chars with random weapons. You're meant to make dedicated characters with dedicated builds and dedicated gear. It's not a casual thing you drop in for. This actually takes a bit of work and doesn't yield easily just to anyone. I liked it and it shouldn't be made easier. Once you have nothing else to do, dome is kind of a challenge to sink your teeth into. Get chars for it, gear, builds, consumes, to try and fail at it till you figure it out... It was great. They shouldn't have added it to bloodsports window though, that absolutely broke random button. You do not want to be matched up with a fresh level 50 in warlord and a level 40 assault rifle for dome and neither does he.

 

Even before the changes, which made melee far less enjoyable for Dome, it was still a challenge. The biggest, of course, being round 10... once you had to fight Skathi's NPC version which is really the only annoying one there.


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#64
MystMan

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I keep hearing about dome and I just gotta say - I liked dome.

It's not something you're meant to be doing with two random chars with random weapons. You're meant to make dedicated characters with dedicated builds and dedicated gear. It's not a casual thing you drop in for. This actually takes a bit of work and doesn't yield easily just to anyone. I liked it and it shouldn't be made easier. Once you have nothing else to do, dome is kind of a challenge to sink your teeth into. Get chars for it, gear, builds, consumes, to try and fail at it till you figure it out... It was great. They shouldn't have added it to bloodsports window though, that absolutely broke random button. You do not want to be matched up with a fresh level 50 in warlord and a level 40 assault rifle for dome and neither does he.

 

It's great that you like Dome. But the question here would be: for which player group exactly was the Dome made for? Certainly not the majority.

It is so different from everything FE had to offer the years before. Certainly nobody started to play FE with the goal in mind "I can't wait to reach lvl55 so I can start to play Dome!" And it certainly didn't prevent the playerbase from shrinking down to its current considerably smaller size for the past years.

 

Did you notice that in some of the earlier posts many have mentioned "PVE doesn't need this & that endgame gear" ?  Your post implies quite the opposite. So which is it?  For what players was this ferkakta thing made for? Apparently a very niche group. In an already very niche game. Well that was a stupid idea designing it.  :No No No:   That time should've been spent fixing oldgame content, where the real meat of the game is.

 

People are attracted to FE for its vast expansive area and crafting stuff from raw materials you find in the wasteland. Not the idea that that to get ahead, you need to grind grind grind the same location untold number of times to get tokens (defense towns & Dome).

 

Again, it's nice that some like Dome. But the dislikes eclipse the likes. This was simply the wrong game to put it in. It is clearly not the success the devs hoped it would be. It doesn't help that a plethora of people leave the game before even reaching endgame.

 

 

 

 

2) IMO, The execution of a chore is on the person doing it...don't you agree? I've never found G.O.R.E. bosses boring (albiet a bit easy after you figure them out, especially Buzz). The only thing I find tedious is sitting in the middle of a field grinding mats like cotton, running from node to node for an hour. I offset this by putting on some music and talking with friends on steam or in chat, ......, how the chore is executed is on me...and I'm the one who has to find the fun in it.

 

umm... this is not a counter-argument.  You are actually proving my point. The game is not entertaining you so you look for external source of entertainment to tolerate the game you are clearly not enjoying anymore. A videogame is supposed to get our full attention, not just partially.

 

It's like you are cheating on FE and looking for entertainment on the side in the arms of other media, like Music and Chat!  Oh Kit, how could you!!!

 

oh_the_drama.jpg

 

:OpIsFunny:  :OpIsFunny:  :OpIsFunny:

 

 

But in all seriousness, I also liked the GORE boss battles. But the motivation to do so died off pretty fast due to the recipe RNG drops, the Citadel grinding to get their baits, the possible bad luck of GORE weapons downgrading, Rothium, etc etc.  People don't like diminishing returns in videogames. If a dev is going to put that in a game, then at least put ALTERNATIVE BUT EQUAL rewards as substitutes so people don't feel like they are wasting their time. This is why many people leave FE ->  Effort far outweighs the reward. It's not balanced at all.

 

Here's an example: I fight Shiva Cherished trying to get Volatile Chemical. It's a rare drop, I understand I will not get it every time. BUT AT LEAST GIVE ME SOMETHING ELSE WORTH MY TIME FIGHTING THIS BULLET SPONGE!

 

Instead I get this.  R-E-P-E-A-T-E-D-L-Y. The bullets and bandages I used during the fight are worth more than this!!!!!

I should be getting ~30 of each of those items instead, not just ONE!

 

8CuUvzX.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

you could get a small shiva neutralizer by winning a roll at cit-thus no need to engage in PvP. Cit is much less of a grind than most game activities and a lot more rewarding,

 

 

That's a huge "could" right there. It's gambling, plain and simple. Few will win, most will lose the /roll. This is not a means to get that item I would promote as viable as a PVE player.  I myself won /rolls like 2 times at Citadel in the years I have played FE, getting only those Questionable Mutant Juniper things. 20-50 people /roll, only one walks away with it. Try your luck again 70 minutes later.

 

The PVE way (Citadel boss) to generate this item into the game can in no way meet the demand of the MANY pve players. The pvp way by buying it with DeathToll is simply much much much much much much much faster. -> all those "much" is to point out the disproportionate gain between pve-pvp in this game on every level. PVP is OBVIOUSLY supposed to be faster due to higher risk, of course, but the gap here is insane. PVE doesn't come second place behind PVP, it comes dead last. Instead of taking two or three times as long for a PVE to attain the same thing a PVPer has, it instead takes 10-20 times as long.... IF you're lucky thank you very much Random Node Placement!

 

And Cit is the same amount of grind than all activities and not that rewarding considering the time invested in it. (another Diminishing Return reference). You can't even rush it, you have to be there at specific time to participate. If somebody who has nothing else to do logs in and see the next attack is 50min away, they're going to play another game instead and forget about Citadel altogether.


Edited by MystMan, 04 June 2016 - 11:16 AM.


#65
Jager Wolfe

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I keep hearing about dome and I just gotta say - I liked dome.

It's not something you're meant to be doing with two random chars with random weapons. You're meant to make dedicated characters with dedicated builds and dedicated gear. It's not a casual thing you drop in for. This actually takes a bit of work and doesn't yield easily just to anyone. I liked it and it shouldn't be made easier. Once you have nothing else to do, dome is kind of a challenge to sink your teeth into. Get chars for it, gear, builds, consumes, to try and fail at it till you figure it out... It was great. They shouldn't have added it to bloodsports window though, that absolutely broke random button. You do not want to be matched up with a fresh level 50 in warlord and a level 40 assault rifle for dome and neither does he.

 

No.  I would expect to do Dome to get the crafting recipes.  Crafting Recipes cannot be transferred.  If I cannot do Dome with my main who is a melee/crafter, the concept of creating a second crafter just to get the Dome recipes is moronic at best.  It may suit some people, but as a whole Dome was not thought out correctly and was poorly executed.

 

J


Edited by Jager Wolfe, 03 June 2016 - 10:24 AM.


#66
Reaps989

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No.  I would expect to do Dome to get the crafting recipes.  Crafting Recipes cannot be transferred.  If I cannot do Dome with my main who is a melee/crafter, the concept of creating a second crafter just to get the Dome recipes is moronic at best.  It may suit some people, but as a whole Dome was not thought out correctly and was poorly executed.

 

J

 

Um... every stage can be done with melee. The only stages that require empathic would be stage 3 along with stage 7-10 depending on your durability.

But it used to be very possible for anyone to reach round 10, without much requirements. (level 45 weapons, 156 FA, and 129 Empathic... ezpz)


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#67
DakkaDakkaDakka

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It's great that you like Dome. But the question here would be: for which player group exactly was the Dome made for? Certainly not the majority.
It is so different from everything FE had to offer the years before. Certainly nobody started to play FE with the goal in mind "I can't wait to reach lvl55 so I can start to play Dome!" And it certainly didn't prevent the playerbase from shrinking down to its current considerably smaller size for the past years.

That's a fair point, certainly dome isn't for everyone and perhaps time would have been better spent addressing existing problems instead of dome. And I understand the frustration of devs working on something that was niche while everything else was suffering.

Did you notice that in some of the earlier posts many have mentioned "PVE doesn't need this & that endgame gear" ? Your post implies quite the opposite. So which is it? For what players was this ferkakta thing made for? Apparently a very niche group. In an already very niche game. Well that was a stupid idea designing it. :No No No: That time should've been spent fixing oldgame content, where the real meat of the game is.

Well, for those pve'rs that *do* like a challenge, a niche group allegedly, why not dome?

FYI

Quest rewards and other pve stuff *was* being worked on but eventually they just pulled the plug on fe.
We would have had dome + more stuff but for whatever reason powers that be simply chose not to. Possibly because they could make more money with same effort in another project like apb.

People are attracted to FE for its vast expansive area and crafting stuff from raw materials you find in the wasteland. Not the idea that that to get ahead, you need to grind grind grind the same location untold number of times to get tokens (defense towns & Dome).

Again, it's nice that some like Dome. But the dislikes eclipse the likes. This was simply the wrong game to put it in. It is clearly not the success the devs hoped it would be. It doesn't help that a plethora of people leave the game before even reaching endgame.

As I said, there was work being on addressing lower level content. It just got squashed. It wasn't deemed worthwhile to invest time and money in. Obviously none of this was communicated so that more money could be squeezed from players who still paid for subs and items hoping things would turn around. They were working on things. This game could have had a second breath. We would have had dome and more. Just didn't happen unfortunately.

Edited by DakkaDakkaDakka, 04 June 2016 - 01:42 AM.

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#68
Jager Wolfe

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Um... every stage can be done with melee. The only stages that require empathic would be stage 3 along with stage 7-10 depending on your durability.

But it used to be very possible for anyone to reach round 10, without much requirements. (level 45 weapons, 156 FA, and 129 Empathic... ezpz)

 

Except that I am a melee/crafter and require the Intelligence and ummm... what was it Perception? So I could not respec empathic without impacting my Crafting skills.  So that is a big no.  I have a dozen or so respec injectors, but have no interest in redesigning my characters that worked for years because G1 is incapable of balancing the Dome.

 

If I would have known, perhaps I would have made some changes at the start, but there was really no way of knowing back then.   Respeccing wasn't a thing at the start and you lived with your choices.  Not to mention that one of the original selling points of the game was Classless-system and build your character the way you want.  I did, but the Dome came around and said oops you built wrong.

 

 

That's a fair point, certainly dome isn't for everyone and perhaps time would have been better spent addressing existing problems instead of dome. And I understand the frustration of devs working on something that was niche while everything else was suffering.
Well, for those pve'rs that *do* like a challenge, a niche group allegedly, why not dome?

 

Except that Dome was meant to keep the PvE community, as a whole, engaged until the Outpost came out.  That was its original purpose.  And it failed miserably.  You may see it in another light, but how you see it was not the actual intent.

 

J


Edited by Jager Wolfe, 06 June 2016 - 10:59 AM.


#69
Reaps989

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Except that I am a melee/crafter and require the Intelligence and ummm... what was it Perception? So I could not respec empathic without impacting my Crafting skills.  So that is a big no.  I have a dozen or so respec injectors, but have no interest in redesigning my characters that worked for years because G1 is incapable of balancing the Dome.
 
If I would have known, perhaps I would have made some changes at the start, but there was really no way of knowing back then.   Respeccing wasn't a thing at the start and you lived with your choices.  Not to mention that one of the original selling points of the game was Classless-system and build your character the way you want.  I did, but the Dome came around and said oops you built wrong.
 
 

 
Except that Dome was meant to keep the PvE community, as a whole, engaged until the Outpost came out.  That was its original purpose.  And it failed miserably.  You may see it in another light, but how you see it was not the actual intent.
 
J


Before claiming your build can't, link it.

We had this topic during closed and open testing for Dome.... if your build isn't optimized then it's your fault for not allocating AP properly. If you use Bloodlust, you save hundreds of AP. If you use Attack Posture then you need to raise melee to 182 (which makes you far tigher on AP but still doable) and obviously for any other stance choice.

 

Bloodlust - Obviously on this setup I put in what most people would expect to have... healing, crit, armor pen, armor use, and some dodge. Even then, you don't "need" dodge for PVE. But you notice there's still 224 AP left...

 

Attack Posture - Obviously due to spending far more AP reaching 182, so you can hit 195 with shift/weapon on melee, you will be losing a lot of AP. But obviously there's two versions of this... but even so it still has 54 remaining AP.

 

Attack Posture (Max Strength) - Since this build has a large amount of strength, you can lower endurance and not lose health in the process to gain more AP. It will, however, lose access to higher auras in GT and Illumination. But just copying the build above, mostly, you give yourself a solid boost in AP. But it only has 86 AP (32 more than the above build)

Spend your AP wisely, otherwise you're just making excuses for yourself.

 

I do admit that melee has the most trouble in Dome tho. Especially when both are melee as two stages are clearly range based.

 

Edit : Added build examples. You cannot claim you "can't" fit something into your build unless you spent it elsewhere that is clearly less of a benefit overall.


Edited by Reaps989, 07 June 2016 - 08:06 AM.

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#70
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My build is the same damn build I have had since Beta.  Lightbearer healer/crafter. My play style has not changed. The game has.  All my specialty Caps are now gone along with the whole point of having dedicated healing mutations as a LB. Now anyone can heal...Sort of changed the game midstride.  Gore, Dome and AP races  are just fillers not for most of the old crowd.  We did our AP the hard way, doing missions and flipping thru every faction just to get those few extra AP points. Then came all the mutation changes and the free AP races.  Changed the game way to much to quickly. Then Gore and Dome came after we busted to get our faction points maxed out to get the BEST gear in game. Faction gear..only to have that now worthless.   Its a wonder any of the old players like myself still even pop back in. Especially since no one at Gamers First has given us a 2016 State of the Game update or replied to requests of one...


Edited by Mutarenebula, 06 June 2016 - 05:36 PM.

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#71
LilRedhare

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umm... this is not a counter-argument.  You are actually proving my point. The game is not entertaining you so you look for external source of entertainment to tolerate the game you are clearly not enjoying anymore. A videogame is supposed to get our full attention, not just partially.

 

It's like you are cheating on FE and looking for entertainment on the side in the arms of other media, like Music and Chat!  Oh Kit, how could you!!!

WTH are you on about? NO...it's not proving your point; did you even read what I wrote?...please stop...

 

I like music in the background of my games...I'll either play it on youtube or on a DvD, that's all...it does nothing to detract or even add to the game. It keeps me relaxed in PvP or peps me up after a hard day of work, while I play, that's it...seems to me that you're trying to make YOUR definition of what a game is apply to ME.....not gonna happen, cap'n. What games mean to players has to do with their individual choices and likes. FE DOES NOT bore me....I stated very clearly why I left for a while...and it wasn't due to boredom. I find entertainment in it where I can, as I do in anything I do that constitutes entertainment. If it bores you that bad, don't play. It's that simple.


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#72
Reaps989

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WTH are you on about? NO...it's not proving your point; did you even read what I wrote?...please stop...

 

I like music in the background of my games...I'll either play it on youtube or on a DvD, that's all...it does nothing to detract or even add to the game. It keeps me relaxed in PvP or peps me up after a hard day of work, while I play, that's it...seems to me that you're trying to make YOUR definition of what a game is apply to ME.....not gonna happen, cap'n. What games mean to players has to do with their individual choices and likes. FE DOES NOT bore me....I stated very clearly why I left for a while...and it wasn't due to boredom. I find entertainment in it where I can, as I do in anything I do that constitutes entertainment. If it bores you that bad, don't play. It's that simple.

 

 

Kit I think "But in all seriousness" should be when you start considering when they say something :o

@Myst

  • Everyone can agree loot is terrible in FE... especially compared to any other MMO throughout the history of MMOs.
  • Citadel loot was also never meant to be gambled on, if you are looking at it from a mechanics standpoint.
    • Only the drop with the highest DPS gets the loot, you don't "have" to /roll. Is that being a muscet? Yes and no, you are following the rules by securing the loot as game mechanics intend it to be done.
  • RNG is a problem in any game, GORE books obviously included... the problem with GORE is it was "so" powerful it needed to fail on upgrade.
    • The problem is, in it's current state the fact it can still fail with GORE enhancers is dumbfounding.
      • The fact GORE also hasn't been boosted since AP augmentation to make them worthwhile prior to augmentation is also moronic... at least the Lunatic is still the best burst melee weapon.
  • I'm surprised you didn't argue the fact Outpost drops EW loot... making your shiva farming extremely pointless for the amount of ammo and bandages used.
  • Hell I'm more surprised you didn't bring up resource nodes >_>

 

FE has plenty of problems, but until the Devs decide to fix them... or get someone who will... we're gosh darned.


Edited by Reaps989, 07 June 2016 - 08:18 AM.

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#73
MystMan

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..seems to me that you're trying to make YOUR definition of what a game is apply to ME.....not gonna happen, cap'n

 

If it bores you that bad, don't play.

 

Didn't you do the same to me with your last post?  About it being up to the player to define how to execute a chore so it isn't boring?

If that was not your intent, then what was the point of your post?   

As for the leaving part..... look around you. The game is devoid of players, a shadow of its former self. I guess everybody chose to leave instead of finding ways to put up with the boredom. I don't blame them for not trying to salvage a broken game for entertainment where none can be found anymore.

 

What was fun in the past has been rendered obsolete and pointless.

 

 

  • Hell I'm more surprised you didn't bring up resource nodes >_>

  •  

I did, 2nd to last paragraph in post #64.

 

I don't know the full details of what Outpost has to offer. I got the vehicle and armor books and got out of dodge.  That place is horribly unfinished.


Edited by MystMan, 07 June 2016 - 08:23 AM.


#74
Reaps989

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I don't know the full details of what Outpost has to offer. I got the vehicle and armor books and got out of dodge.  That place is horribly unfinished.

 

That you did... :o my mistake

 

But my point still stands xD


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#75
LilRedhare

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Didn't you do the same to me with your last post?  About it being up to the player to define how to execute a chore so it isn't boring?

If that was not your intent, then what was the point of your post?   

As for the leaving part..... look around you. The game is devoid of players, a shadow of its former self. I guess everybody chose to leave instead of finding ways to put up with the boredom. I don't blame them for not trying to salvage a broken game for entertainment where none can be found anymore.

 

What was fun in the past has been rendered obsolete and pointless.

 

 

  •  
  •  

I did, 2nd to last paragraph in post #64.

 

I don't know the full details of what Outpost has to offer. I got the vehicle and armor books and got out of dodge.  That place is horribly unfinished.

Ok...first off...I do NOT disagree with you that the game is dying...we all know this...it's obvious. That is not the issue for me at all. I completely agree, and I thought...hope...I made that clear.

 

As far as the devs are concerned, I also feel they have to step up and get involved in this game again, if it is to be saved...I'm just not holding my breath for this to happen. I also feel it is not ALL on them and that very few of us have the complete story, if any of us do.

 

Where I disagree with you is that the game itself lacks the ability to captivate anymore. I still enjoy playing FE, even in its incompleteness. Not everyone left because of BOREDOM and that's where you and I part opinion. You keep insisting that everyone is BORED with FE, and that's not necessarily the case. Did quite a few get bored with FE? Absolutely. Others left due to finding games that covered genres they enjoy more. Others left because of RL issues; yet others left for social reasons, as I did: These new players have never heard of KAOS, never heard of Saints, never heard of BoS, hardly know of Heretic, Crouching Tiger, Condemned...know nothing of the first clans or the great clans. The great names of the game are gone now...and I miss those names, if I even knew them myself. I lost my sh*t when I ran into Pidian in LA last year because I was like "holy sh*t...is he really on here?" I did the Iron Sights MC ride (and dammit, my laptop actually overheated after we got to Stronghold..) just so I could hang with the likes of Kyotan and Holy Elite (and was so disappointed that Nerlani didn't make it...I miss you, hunny!). For me...playing with those great personalities made the experience great for me. Without them, FE is a shadow of itself.

 

http://forums.gamers...h/#entry4358621

 

That's all I'm saying...it's not about boredom for me.


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#76
Jager Wolfe

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Before claiming your build can't, link it.

We had this topic during closed and open testing for Dome.... if your build isn't optimized then it's your fault for not allocating AP properly. If you use Bloodlust, you save hundreds of AP. If you use Attack Posture then you need to raise melee to 182 (which makes you far tigher on AP but still doable) and obviously for any other stance choice.

 

 

Wrong and it is this type of reasoning on why I ignore your advise.  My build is fine.  I should not be punished for allocating my AP the way I like.  I should not have to respec to do Dome.

 

I have FA and no empathic.  I don't play anymore, so unless some miracle happens I am not logging just to provide my build that works for me.

 

You have an opinion, but that is all it is and I do not agree with it.  Get off your high horse.  IMO all you really do is provide justification for bad content delivery.

 

J


Edited by Jager Wolfe, 07 June 2016 - 11:04 AM.


#77
LilRedhare

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Wrong and it is this type of reasoning on why I ignore your advise.  My build is fine.  I should not be punished for allocating my AP the way I like.  I should not have to respec to do Dome.

 

You have an opinion, but that is all it is and I do not agree with it.  Get off your high horse.

 

J

J, I would normally not say anything...Nysek can defend himself just fine, but...

 

I do agree with you in spirit, but unfortunately game mechanics are what they are...IMO, several types of builds can handle Dome but there are builds more suited to it. If you choose to build in a way that is less suited to Dome, you have to accept that fact. I wish it wasn't so, but it is.

 

Also, Nysek is not on a high horse...he's stating fact. He means no insult...but the results are bearing themselves out. Even you said that your build didn't effectively handle Dome...does that mean the dev team needs to change DOME so your build is more viable there? What do you think will happen first? They change Dome or you change your build? And if neither is going to happen, what will you do to adapt to Dome? What are some of the challenges your build faces in Dome? And are there consumables that will help you overcome those challenges?

 

Again, I agree in spirit, but I disagree in practice and Nysek's work has born itself out, so no...it's not a high horse he's on.


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#78
Jager Wolfe

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J, I would normally not say anything...Nysek can defend himself just fine, but...

 

I do agree with you in spirit, but unfortunately game mechanics are what they are...IMO, several types of builds can handle Dome but there are builds more suited to it. If you choose to build in a way that is less suited to Dome, you have to accept that fact. I wish it wasn't so, but it is.

 

Also, Nysek is not on a high horse...he's stating fact. He means no insult...but the results are bearing themselves out. Even you said that your build didn't effectively handle Dome...does that mean the dev team needs to change DOME so your build is more viable there? What do you think will happen first? They change Dome or you change your build? And if neither is going to happen, what will you do to adapt to Dome? What are some of the challenges your build faces in Dome? And are there consumables that will help you overcome those challenges?

 

Again, I agree in spirit, but I disagree in practice and Nysek's work has born itself out, so no...it's not a high horse he's on.

 

I don't think you need to defend him either.  It is not like we haven't had this discussion before.  I know his views, I just don't care for his "if you did not build your character the right way (based on the Gospel According to Nysek) you are wrong" attitude.    Basically this:

 

 

 if your build isn't optimized then it's your fault for not allocating AP properly

 

I also do not subscribe to his facts, as I find them biased.  You can believe in them if you want, that is your choice.

 

The original design of the game, did not allow for respecs.  You built your character and if you made mistakes you lived with the flaws.  The original game did not allow every faction to have empathic or nano.  Each Faction had their mutation lines.  Many of us Beta players built our characters along these lines and we were not wrong to do so.  Do not tell me I am wrong now.  Respec and Mutations changes did not come till much later.  I did get my ap reset a couple of times, but I was fine with my character for the most part so I never changed much.  Was my charcter optimized, i doubt it, but the game was challenging enough for me that I enjoyed it.

 

And nowhere in any official document I ever read stated that you must have Empathic or Nano.  As I stated before FE was to be a classless-system.   It is the players who decided optimization was necessary (some players).  And lets be fair it is more important in PvP than PvE.  Which is were some of the attitude comes from.

 

I understand that the mechanics are at fault, but we should want balance not too gimmick the system. 

 

I could respec my character, go pistols instead of melee or remove crafting, but I wanted recipes so that would have been moot.   I have plenty of injectors so I could play around.  Likely my current build could do some of the rounds, but i decided if the Dome was not balanced I would not hamper a partner with a gimped melee build, most of the players i knew were long gone.  And I also look at it from a community perspective,  not everyone can respec, which means Dome is limited to a select few.  This IMO is wrong.  But it is just an opinion. 

 

If people are ok with that then fine, but then do not tell us that Dome is for everyone.  In the end the Dome was a poor design and falied to do what it was meant to do.  We have what we have and it was a disappointment to many.  That is all. 


Edited by Jager Wolfe, 07 June 2016 - 03:08 PM.


#79
AgentNoir

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My build is the same damn build I have had since Beta.  Lightbearer healer/crafter. My play style has not changed. The game has.  All my specialty Caps are now gone along with the whole point of having dedicated healing mutations as a LB. Now anyone can heal...Sort of changed the game midstride.  Gore, Dome and AP races  are just fillers not for most of the old crowd.  We did our AP the hard way, doing missions and flipping thru every faction just to get those few extra AP points. Then came all the mutation changes and the free AP races.  Changed the game way to much to quickly. Then Gore and Dome came after we busted to get our faction points maxed out to get the BEST gear in game. Faction gear..only to have that now worthless.   Its a wonder any of the old players like myself still even pop back in. Especially since no one at Gamers First has given us a 2016 State of the Game update or replied to requests of one...

Actually to be fair the only people who couldn't heal before(at launch) without a wheel flip were chota(telepathy doesn't count as healing lol and gt was available to everyone so its a mutation focus). emp covered vista/lb and travs/techs got nano and enfo got both. And the general pvp meta was a wheel flip...pve didn't need to do a flip(don't know if they did or not) because to beat pve back then you stacked dodge and laughed your way through pve(which in turn required investing into gt which gave you your on the move stamina heal for the first 6 months of the game).

 

And even then all people did was do the wheel flip which wasn't midstride it was just out of the gate. And then they just coupled nano/emp and gt for ridiculous healing(in other words launch enfo). And the only healing capstones I remember were the aoe reses although that was after the first change so i dont remember the original ones(wasnt the 2 mount ones that got changed).

 

Yeah they changed the mutation changes so you started out with them innately and added races. This was due to the fact that in pvp a flip was needed for all mutations at bare minimum and getting ap required doing every ap mission throughout all of s1-deadfall. Both were good changes at the end of the day especially considering this was in reality a quality of life change stemming from the fact you had to reroll if you rolled a garbage build and this reduced the chances of it and made it more tolerable. Was also good for pve as pvers were now required to actually play the game due to the dodge nerf. And to point this out no one playing back then really liked the wheel flip it was just boring(decent the first time around cause you will do anyways most likely but on the 2nd time even it's a bore).

 

And actually dome/gore had little to do with impacting faction gear. By the time either of those had been added 720k faction gear was an aesthetic choice or an easy to achieve choice while you worked on your proper armor. Gore was pure weapons so didn't touch faction as factions hadn't received new weapons since launch and dome was also weapons. Stage 3 and gt and dt armor had all reduced faction armor to meh status(dt originally as dreadnought had proper bonuses where as faction suits had meh garbage bonuses that didn't even really work as themed bonuses).

 

And don't get me wrong I preferred pre-1.9 in all forms, but it wasn't as simple or some things weren't as detrimental for others as you make it out to be. And there were definitely huge developer errors in approaches and changes all throughout fe.

 

 

Except that I am a melee/crafter and require the Intelligence and ummm... what was it Perception? So I could not respec empathic without impacting my Crafting skills.  So that is a big no.  I have a dozen or so respec injectors, but have no interest in redesigning my characters that worked for years because G1 is incapable of balancing the Dome.

 

If I would have known, perhaps I would have made some changes at the start, but there was really no way of knowing back then.   Respeccing wasn't a thing at the start and you lived with your choices.  Not to mention that one of the original selling points of the game was Classless-system and build your character the way you want.  I did, but the Dome came around and said oops you built wrong.

 

 

 

Except that Dome was meant to keep the PvE community, as a whole, engaged until the Outpost came out.  That was its original purpose.  And it failed miserably.  You may see it in another light, but how you see it was not the actual intent.

 

J

Umm any game like this says 'build your character how you want' and this doesn't say 'any character build is viable to do everything'. And that's the catch, because no game that has a system like this makes any build viable in every situation. The fact fe did for the vast majority of the content shows just how much of a pushover and pathetic pve was...now it's not as bad as at launch where you only required dodge to roll over every and all pve.

 

Actually it was you deal with your build or you reroll. Although for most it was reroll or quit. And all you got with dome was 'your build isn't ideal and finally encountered a situation where it wasn't what will you do now?' Which is nothing special at the end of the day especially when going melee in pve.


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#80
Jager Wolfe

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Umm any game like this says 'build your character how you want' and this doesn't say 'any character build is viable to do everything'. And that's the catch, because no game that has a system like this makes any build viable in every situation. The fact fe did for the vast majority of the content shows just how much of a pushover and pathetic pve was...now it's not as bad as at launch where you only required dodge to roll over every and all pve.

 

Actually it was you deal with your build or you reroll. Although for most it was reroll or quit. And all you got with dome was 'your build isn't ideal and finally encountered a situation where it wasn't what will you do now?' Which is nothing special at the end of the day especially when going melee in pve.

 

NO worries, I am enjoying GW2 and that happens.  Some quests are easily solo-able on one class and not for another (so I grit my teeth through it or bring a friend), but there is plenty of other content too.

 

But in FE, at the end, all there was was Citadel and Dome.

 

And I decided to leave it.  Which is fine.  As many others have stated, I did not want Dome.  It would have been a minor distraction. I just  decided the hassle of recreating my character didn't interest me enough to do the Dome.

 

I came back to check out Outpost, but by then my interest had waned.

 

I still think FE was one of the best games of its time, it just did not live up to what it could have been.

 

If they truly wanted the Dome to be challenging and for everyone they should have made repecs free or allowed players to respec just for the Dome itself.  That would have allowed others to try things out and get the right feel for what they should work towards

 


Edited by Jager Wolfe, 07 June 2016 - 03:32 PM.



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