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Complete STAR weapon system

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#1
Kewlin

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So it's not uncommon in real life for a military to commission or design an entire system of weapons based around one weapon platform, either so that all of the parts are interchangeable, so that the guns can all use the same ammunition, or to make it easier to train soldiers. For example, we can see this in how the Russian military currently uses mostly guns based around the AK, which RP mimicked with the N-TEC and N-SSW. RP also did the same thing with the VAS series as well, which has three guns (though as an aside, can we please get a AK-74-u remesh of the C2? PLEASE?!)
 
I think that it would be fitting, since the STAR is the standard issue weapon for enforcers and criminals, if Somatic designed a weapon system based around the STAR. Wouldn't it make sense, since the STAR is theoretically the most common gun in San Paro, to have a whole weapon system based around it? And lore aside, I like the STAR and STAR LCR because they're both designed for an player who is patient; whereas so many other guns are based around throwing as much lead down range as possible, the STAR series is for the calm and collected player who knows that precision is often the best tool for the job.

*EDIT* I now understand that the LCR is supposedly OP with CJ3, this is easily fixed however by selling the LCR in two-open-slot variants pre-modded with IR3 and CJ2 (basically just freeing up the non-red slots in the LCR PR2 and Old Glory.)
 
First, I propose that the STAR LCR be permanently re-implemented into the game with a different mesh, so as to allow the gun to be part of the meta whilst still keeping the old version exclusive. Note that I wouldn't overly mind the old mesh being for sale, but I think it would be overall better if a new mesh was made. I also think it's essential to make all versions of the LCR, both old and new, have 3 open slots. Let's be honest, the LCR isn't OP and nobody likes pre-modded guns, it wouldn't hurt to make all LCRs have 3 slots. A few suggestions for the design of the new LCR are below, though you'll find that there are many interesting variants of the G36 and it's easy to find inspiration (I'm assuming everyone knows that the STAR is based on the real G36.)
 
PICS:

Spoiler

 
 
Second, I think that a STAR carbine modified for CQC would be fantastic. I know, the STAR is already good in close-quarters, but I think that a CQC version would be awesome.
 
DESCRIPTION:
Spoiler

 
STATS:
Spoiler

 
PICS:
Spoiler

 
 
Third, I think that a support weapon, or LMG would be an good addition to the STAR series. It would basically be a STAR with better accuracy and a larger magazine in exchange for slower movement and handling speed.
 
DESCRIPTION:
Spoiler

 
STATS:
Spoiler

 
PICS:
Spoiler

 
Questions or comments are greatly appreciated, as are flames, but to a lesser extent.
 
Remember to rate and like this post if you like it!


Edited by Kewlin, 21 February 2016 - 11:03 AM.

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#2
Revoluzzer

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The MG-36 should be a SHAW reskin, imo. The way it functions in most games is relatively similar to the SHAW, so it would perform as many players expect.


The problem with the SMG/Carbine version is that the current STAR already resembles the G-36C more than the normal and/or G-36K version (short barrel, lowered bridge).
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#3
Lord Cashpoint

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The problem with the SMG/Carbine version is that the current STAR already resembles the G-36C more than the normal and/or G-36K version (short barrel, lowered bridge).

 

Everyone knows folding the stock of a weapon increases its fire rate.


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#4
TheFreelancer

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Jup everybody knows that jg fires faster than jg stock duh!?

#5
Kewlin

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The MG-36 should be a SHAW reskin, imo. The way it functions in most games is relatively similar to the SHAW, so it would perform as many players expect.

 
First, the SHAW is already made by Somatic, so it would be a little silly to have two guns by Somatic that functioned identically IMHO. Second, it would make absolutely no sense to have the STAR work how it does, and then a gun that looks almost identical to the STAR function like the SHAW, which is very possibly the most different gun from the STAR in all of APB. I'm relatively certain that a large percentage of guns in APB don't functions like the RL counterpart, basically, the N-SSW doesn't function like an RPK, why should a STAR LMG function like an MG-36? It would make more sense for it to be derivative of the STAR than of other games (don't forget, it would logically still be shooting the same bullets as the STAR, so 8 STK wouldn't make sense.)
 
Just my opinion though.
 
 

The problem with the SMG/Carbine version is that the current STAR already resembles the G-36C more than the normal and/or G-36K version (short barrel, lowered bridge).

 
While you are correct, if you look at them side-by-side, the barrel length is significantly different, and since APB doesn't need to follow anything to do with the real world, they could easily make the barrel/upper receiver of the gun much shorter (I'm not sure how the G36 is on the inside, I have no clue how short the barrel can be made irl.) Take of the laser-sight-thingy, change the mag, fold the stock, maybe add an angled foregrip and a sight, and it looks as much like a different gun as it logically should. Photoshopped mock-up of what I would personally do to the G36 to make it look more different on the bottom; excuse my fast photoshopping, I know it's not beautiful.
Spoiler


Everyone knows folding the stock of a weapon increases its fire rate.


Dude, at least pretend to have read what I wrote: the STAR-CC should have exactly the same RoF and Damage as the STAR, I only reduced the range, decreased accuracy, and increased mobility for the most part.

Edited by Kewlin, 17 October 2015 - 07:18 AM.

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#6
TheFreelancer

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But I certainly would like more star guns after better servers, engine update etc.

#7
Kewlin

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But I certainly would like more star guns after better servers, engine update etc.

 

Freelancer, the team who works on the engine upgrade does not work on new content, and the team who works on new content isn't equipped with the skills necessary to help with the engine upgrade.

 

Content and the engine upgrade are not mutually exclusive.


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#8
Revoluzzer

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First, the SHAW is already made by Somatic, so it would be a little silly to have two guns by Somatic that functioned identically IMHO.

So is the STAR; it wouldn't make sense to have weapon-systems based on the STAR made by another manufacturer. But their R&D for the SHAW might influence the STAR-LMG design.
Futhermore both the CR762 and SLR762 are made by Obeya; so the precedent for having a reskin "in the same house" was already set.

The S1-FA, NA and TIC also share the same base model, but have different STK values.
The VAS-C2 has 7STK, while the R2 and SW2 have 6STK.
Ergo precedents for guns based on the same model having noticeably different attributes have been set as well.
 
 
 

While you are correct, if you look at them side-by-side, the barrel length is significantly different

Spoiler

Fair enough, the second compact version does have a - slightly - shorter barrel. The first on has the same as the STAR 556, though, which only the bridge coming down earlier.

Edited by Revoluzzer, 17 October 2015 - 09:50 AM.

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#9
Caesruul

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That CQC star better not have a folded stock.

A folded stock DOES NOT MAKE IT A NEW GUN.

Either shorten it down or give it some sort of new design, it's the reason I can't play with the FAR/CBMP anymore because the weapon designers thought it would be a good idea to weld the stocks folded like that.


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#10
Kewlin

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So is the STAR; it wouldn't make sense to have weapon-systems based on the STAR made by another manufacturer. But their R&D for the SHAW might influence the STAR-LMG design.
Futhermore both the CR762 and SLR762 are made by Obeya; so the precedent for having a reskin "in the same house" was already set.

The S1-FA, NA and TIC also share the same base model, but have different STK values.
The VAS-C2 has 7STK, while the R2 and SW2 have 6STK.
Ergo precedents for guns based on the same model having noticeably different attributes have been set as well.


I suppose you're correct, RP does have no regard for making one caliber of bullet be consistant, but if the point is to make a set of weapons that are brothers to the STAR, why would you make it a SHAW? The SHAW functions in no way similar to the STAR, like, literally no way.

 

 

I think it's interesting that nobody actually seems to want to discuss the merits or demerits of the weapons I want added to the game, but are entirely concentrated on the cosmetics. The stats of a gun are just as important, if not more important, than the mesh. Do you dislike the stats I wrote up? Or do you just really want a SHAW remesh? Even if you want a SHAW remesh that's an MG-36, that really has nothing to do with this topic.

 

 

That CQC star better not have a folded stock.

A folded stock DOES NOT MAKE IT A NEW GUN.

Either shorten it down or give it some sort of new design, it's the reason I can't play with the FAR/CBMP anymore because the weapon designers thought it would be a good idea to weld the stocks folded like that.

 

Calm yourself my friend. You're aware that both the FAR and CBMP have unfolded variants, right? I just personally thought that the folded stock looked nice, that's all man. Ideally RP would release a folded and unfolded version.

 

Also, I just added my photoshopped mock-up to the OP.


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#11
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Absolutely yes. I've been thinking the same thing lately.

 

Star is a company that should have more weapons.


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#12
Caesruul

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Calm yourself my friend. You're aware that both the FAR and CBMP have unfolded variants, right? I just personally thought that the folded stock looked nice, that's all man. Ideally RP would release a folded and unfolded version.

I'm sorry, I'm a stickler for small things like that.

I know they have unfolded variants-FAR vanguard, totally impossible to get now, and the other CBMP not worth spending cash on because I already have this one.


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#13
Kewlin

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. . . the other CBMP not worth spending cash on because I already have this one.


Yes, because you already have the variant you refuse to use. ;P

3-slot PMGs are under ten dollars on sale, just sayin'.

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#14
Caesruul

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Yes, because you already have the variant you refuse to use. ;P

3-slot PMGs are under ten dollars on sale, just sayin'.

Eh, not really interested in spending right now
....

EDIT-Looks like I got on too late.

Whatevs.


Edited by Caesruul, 17 October 2015 - 08:31 PM.

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#15
Revoluzzer

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I think it's interesting that nobody actually seems to want to discuss the merits or demerits of the weapons I want added to the game, but are entirely concentrated on the cosmetics. The stats of a gun are just as important, if not more important, than the mesh.

We're at a point, imo, where enough unique weapons were added to the game, there is practically no room for more. The ideas you wrote up essentially are the ACER and N-SSW, with little quirks to make them seem different on paper. In gameplay these would be negligible, I think. Thus the visual component would become the main reason to pick up the weapon. And that's where the game still has lots of room for additional content. Reskins for weapons that already exist.

Because with different visuals you can get the looks of your outfit as accurate as you like, while also supporting the gameplay you prefer.
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#16
Kewlin

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We're at a point, imo, where enough unique weapons were added to the game, there is practically no room for more. The ideas you wrote up essentially are the ACER and N-SSW, with little quirks to make them seem different on paper. In gameplay these would be negligible, I think. Thus the visual component would become the main reason to pick up the weapon. And that's where the game still has lots of room for additional content. Reskins for weapons that already exist.

Because with different visuals you can get the looks of your outfit as accurate as you like, while also supporting the gameplay you prefer.

 

IMHO, if you don't understand the difference, especially with the STAR-CC, you aren't looking, but maybe that's just my opinion as the person who conceptualized the guns.

 

One of my favorite things about APB is the intricacies of all of the tons and tons of weapons, and how none of them do quite the same thing. Sure, you can generalize and say that the ATAC is a straight upgrade from the Condor, and a lot of people do, but a more astute player will realize that they play differently in that the ATAC is bad at hip-firing, whereas the Condor is good at both hip-firing and MM (there are other differences, but this isn't a thread about ATACs and Condors.) So yes, the Condor and ATAC fill basically the same role, but they do it in very different ways. But I guess that if you don't care about the intricacies of guns like I do, that would explain why I virtually never agree with you on the topic of any guns.

 

To me, one of the most exciting things about APB is when they introduce new guns into the game, I just like to see how they affect the game and what new things they allow players to do or do better, even if I don't buy the guns. I still get excited just thinking about the FAR, for example, even if I haven't gotten around to buying one yet.

 

 

TL;DR: If you can look at the SG-12 "Strife" and say that there's no room for new guns, I seriously question your opinion on the subject.

 

 

Eh, not really interested in spending right now
....

EDIT-Looks like I got on too late.

Whatevs.

 

Oh, it wasn't on sale, mb, I was just saying that when it does go on sale it's generally around 700G1c.


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#17
TheBlademaster1215

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I like the concepts but your numbers, aren't very fair to the series imo. I'll make a proper post when i get back from class.

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#18
Kewlin

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I like the concepts but your numbers, aren't very fair to the series imo. I'll make a proper post when i get back from class.

 

cool beans.


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#19
TheFreelancer

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Needs to happen

#20
Raptros

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I kinda like this idea

 

+1


 

WHAT DID YOU HONESTLY EXPECT THOUGH?

 

 

 


#21
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Spoiler

 

Bad (and overused) jokes apart,these STAR variants looks neat.


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Spoiler

 


#22
Opinions

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you can do this with weapon parts in blacklight retribution on steam which i think uses the same engine as apb

but actually implementing this in game sounds like a massive undertaking at a time where most, if not all of the coding resources are put into the engine upgrade


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#23
Kewlin

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you can do this with weapon parts in blacklight retribution on steam which i think uses the same engine as apb

but actually implementing this in game sounds like a massive undertaking at a time where most, if not all of the coding resources are put into the engine upgrade

 

How does adding two weapons take massive coding? What do you think I'm saying? XD


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#24
TheFreelancer

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Necro bump

#25
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you can do this with weapon parts in blacklight retribution on steam which i think uses the same engine as apb
but actually implementing this in game sounds like a massive undertaking at a time where most, if not all of the coding resources are put into the engine upgrade

yeah steal models from other games

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#26
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First, the SHAW is already made by Somatic, so it would be a little silly to have two guns by Somatic that functioned identically IMHO. Second, it would make absolutely no sense to have the STAR work how it does, and then a gun that looks almost identical to the STAR function like the SHAW, which is very possibly the most different gun from the STAR in all of APB. I'm relatively certain that a large percentage of guns in APB don't functions like the RL counterpart, basically, the N-SSW doesn't function like an RPK, why should a STAR LMG function like an MG-36? It would make more sense for it to be derivative of the STAR than of other games (don't forget, it would logically still be shooting the same bullets as the STAR, so 8 STK wouldn't make sense.)

Just my opinion though.



While you are correct, if you look at them side-by-side, the barrel length is significantly different, and since APB doesn't need to follow anything to do with the real world, they could easily make the barrel/upper receiver of the gun much shorter (I'm not sure how the G36 is on the inside, I have no clue how short the barrel can be made irl.) Take of the laser-sight-thingy, change the mag, fold the stock, maybe add an angled foregrip and a sight, and it looks as much like a different gun as it logically should. Photoshopped mock-up of what I would personally do to the G36 to make it look more different on the bottom; excuse my fast photoshopping, I know it's not beautiful.

Spoiler



Dude, at least pretend to have read what I wrote: the STAR-CC should have exactly the same RoF and Damage as the STAR, I only reduced the range, decreased accuracy, and increased mobility for the most part.


Firstly, the NSSW is not based on an RPK. It based on a PK or PKM which is not based on an AK.

To the original topic, the FAR is part of the STAR family.

You have the STAR 55y which is a versatile AR meant to be effective at many ranges. The STAR LCR which is a great long range suppression type weapon. The FAR which bridges a gap between those two excelling at mid to long range engagements.

What can they do beyond that? Possibly create a cqc varient, but the body on these guns is pretty hefty.

#27
Kewlin

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Firstly, the NSSW is not based on an RPK. It based on a PK or PKM which is not based on an AK.

 

It doesn't matter, the N-SSW is functionally based on the old N-TEC.

 

What can they do beyond that? Possibly create a cqc varient, but the body on these guns is pretty hefty.

 

Idk, maybe you can read the OP.

 

 

*EDIT*

Necro bump

 

Thanks.


Edited by Kewlin, 21 February 2016 - 11:04 AM.

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#28
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So I spent like 5 minutes just putting these together, in no way shape or form perfect at all. (Stretched textures, over subdivided on things and mismatched colors) but this is a quick and dirty visual idea of the star being reused in different configurations.

54d44a10cb.png7cdf4db940.jpg

7e8f07c053.jpg

646a6413e6.jpg



#29
Kewlin

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So I spent like 5 minutes just putting these together, in no way shape or form perfect at all. (Stretched textures, over subdivided on things and mismatched colors) but this is a quick and dirty visual idea of the star being reused in different configurations.

 

I want them so badly. . .

 

 

WHY WON'T RP TAKE MY MONEY!

 

(*EDIT* Honest though, I would consider even just buying the top one as a prettier variant of the STAR. . .)


Edited by Kewlin, 21 February 2016 - 12:00 PM.

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#30
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Top one is sick yes:)



#31
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It doesn't matter, the N-SSW is functionally based on the old N-TEC.


Idk, maybe you can read the OP.


*EDIT*

Thanks.


I did read the OP. What I'm saying is that Somatic already makes an LMG. It also fires a 5.56 round like the STAR. The Sniper might be cool, but it would need a bigger bullet. 5.56 isn't really that great. It might be cool to have a fast firing 4 shot sniper which would work but how useful it is compared to the NHVR family would be questionable. And again, that's still a large cqc weapon. It would have trouble competing with the PMG. Althou a C9 Wasp reskin might work.

I'm not saying the idea is bad. I just don't see RP taking the time to make it interesting and competitive at the same time. We all know they won't adopt your idea because reasons.

#32
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I did read the OP. What I'm saying is that Somatic already makes an LMG. It also fires a 5.56 round like the STAR. The Sniper might be cool, but it would need a bigger bullet. 5.56 isn't really that great. It might be cool to have a fast firing 4 shot sniper which would work but how useful it is compared to the NHVR family would be questionable. And again, that's still a large cqc weapon. It would have trouble competing with the PMG. Althou a C9 Wasp reskin might work.

I'm not saying the idea is bad. I just don't see RP taking the time to make it interesting and competitive at the same time. We all know they won't adopt your idea because reasons.

 

And that LMG functions in no way similar to the STAR, so there's no overlap.

 

And what do you mean it would have trouble competing with the PMG, can you be more specific? (also, the C9 is an OCA reskin.)


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#33
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And that LMG functions in no way similar to the STAR, so there's no overlap.

And what do you mean it would have trouble competing with the PMG, can you be more specific? (also, the C9 is an OCA reskin.)

But the SHAW still is a Somatic LMG. Nekrova didn't have an LMG until the NSSW. That's why it was introduced. Somatic has one of the best LMGs in the game. Why compete with themselves. I like the idea. Don't get me wrong. Having another weapon similar to the NSSW is a good thing. But why would Somatic do it?

I thought the dagger was. Idk.

As for how it competes, in order to be interesting and unique it would need to fire like a larger SMG. Not unlike the OCA. The PMG is just tough to beat. It's top of it's class in many ways. I think if they were to make the STAR variant, having it have tighter spread, hit harder, and fire slower than the smaller PMGs is the way to go. Have be stronger at longer ranges than others as well. But idk. I prefer shotguns in cqc.

Edited by BaronSaturday, 21 February 2016 - 03:05 PM.


#34
Kewlin

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But the SHAW still is a Somatic LMG. Nekrova didn't have an LMG until the NSSW. That's why it was introduced. Somatic has one of the best LMGs in the game. Why compete with themselves. I like the idea. Don't get me wrong. Having another weapon similar to the NSSW is a good thing. But why would Somatic do it?

 

Companies make lots of guns, that's just the way it is. This is comparable to the fact that FN currently makes both the P90 and FS2000, both of which are PDW/SMGs. On the other side, this LMG variant of the STAR is also based on the same platform as the STAR, so it's not really a new development, it's just changing a few parts on an existing weapon.

 

Also, like I said, two of the common reasons for making a complete weapon system around a single platform are interchangeable parts and the ability to train soldiers for a single platform which has multiple variants, the latter of which makes tons of sense for APB's setting because everyone in San Paro already knows their way around a STAR, so why make a weapon on a new platform when the STAR is already a perfectly good platform?

 

(Also, as I wrote in my description, "The STAR 'Light Support Weapon', or STAR LSW, was designed when Praetorians requested a precision support weapon." The SHAW is certainly not a precision instrument.)

 

 

I thought the dagger was. Idk.

 

Both the PDW-57 and C9 are OCA reskins, look at the stats.

 

As for how it competes, in order to be interesting and unique it would need to fire like a larger SMG. Not unlike the OCA. The PMG is just tough to beat. It's top of it's class in many ways. I think if they were to make the STAR variant, having it have tighter spread, hit harder, and fire slower than the smaller PMGs is the way to go. Have be stronger at longer ranges than others as well. But idk. I prefer shotguns in cqc.

 

First, it's not an SMG, you made that up yourself. It's more comparable to the SR-15 Carbine than anything else probably.

 

It's a STAR that is more oriented toward mobility and CQC, with slightly reduced range and accuracy.

 

 

Just curious, did you read any of my text inside of the spoilers? Because that's the majority of the meat of my post, and I feel like it answers most of your questions, including lorical reasons why the guns exist.


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#35
Lord Cashpoint

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The CQC variant is interesting.

I imagine you'd practically have to stick CJ3 on the weapon to make it competitive with other close range weapons (As well as the N-tec, FAR and ATAC). It trades magazine capacity for a small reduction in reload time (You can put a 25 round magazine on the regular STAR and it will have a quicker reload).

I guess the Marksman speed will make up for it, as well as its improved hip fire accuracy, but that just makes it seem like another ACES Rifle really. Granted, one that won't empty its magazine instantly, but the ACES Rifle's running hipfire modifier is only 1.1, compared to this proposed gun's 4.0.

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