why large ammunition boxes getting all the hate?

[foscor77 169]

Large supply boxes have become so useless.

 

They only resupply for once And they STILL freaking explodes.

 

Now you telling me they cant even resupply rockets? Are you fking kidding me? Rockets only have like 10 ammo units and now i cant even resupply? 

 

wtf u doing dis? 

 

Go nerf ursus, remot detonator or something. leave the only useful yellow mod alone for damn's sake.

[PotatoeGirl 218]

All the consumables were a mistake anyway imo.

May as well just remove all of them from the game.

 

Just pointless clutter for "mission rewards".

[Saxtus 497]

There are more weapons than the explosive ones. Give them some love too.

And they haven't become useless. From now on you can access your inventory from them! Win-win!

[illgot 379]

10 minutes ago, HawtGirl said:

All the consumables were a mistake anyway imo.

May as well just remove all of them from the game.

 

Just pointless clutter for "mission rewards".

I think mobile cover and epinephrine are fine.  The others aren't really needed.  I do wish satchel charge would blow open doors to end the stand off of people standing at doors waiting for the other people to kick it in.

[DoesntExistAnyMore 144]

33 minutes ago, foscor77 said:

Large supply boxes have become so useless.

 

They only resupply for once And they STILL freaking explodes.

 

Now you telling me they cant even resupply rockets? Are you fking kidding me? Rockets only have like 10 ammo units and now i cant even resupply? 

 

wtf u doing dis? 

 

 

iKnow

[ExoticZ 131]

It's time to use the good old "Field Supplier" or the "Ammo Modification" for your vehicle. 

[CookiePuss 5356]

Keep in mind, that nothing is ever written in stone.

If a change really isn't working, it can always be changed again in the future.

Best advice I can give if you want to do something is to write something up for the changes you'd like to see, and post it where LO can see it.

[PotatoeGirl 218]

56 minutes ago, illgot said:

I think mobile cover and epinephrine are fine.  The others aren't really needed.  I do wish satchel charge would blow open doors to end the stand off of people standing at doors waiting for the other people to kick it in.

Mobile cover is just useful for anything but what it is supposed to do (i.e. blocking doors and stairs and just glitching in general). Epinephrine is useful but feels kinda cheap too. Seems like it is going to be the only thing left worth using anyway. 

 

Btw, I just feel like the box should let you change weapons. I am fine with removing the infinite grenade spam. 

Edited January 29, 2020 by HawtGirl

[CookiePuss 5356]

Mobile cover is incredibly exploitable.

For good players, it's beyond cheap.

[Hexerin 1109]

Anything that reduces the effectiveness of explosives in general gameplay is a good thing. Explosives should only be a tool of last resort in very specific situations. People literally maining them as their primary weapon of choice (and being able to actually be effective in missions with that) is a very serious problem for game health.

[CookiePuss 5356]

34 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Anything that reduces the effectiveness of explosives in general gameplay is a good thing. Explosives should only be a tool of last resort in very specific situations. People literally maining them as their primary weapon of choice (and being able to actually be effective in missions with that) is a very serious problem for game health.

I think I agree with this.

Feels weird.

[vsb 6131]

32 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Anything that reduces the effectiveness of explosives in general gameplay is a good thing. Explosives should only be a tool of last resort in very specific situations. People literally maining them as their primary weapon of choice (and being able to actually be effective in missions with that) is a very serious problem for game health.

given that explosives already have a pretty low skill ceiling, i’m curious as to why you think they should receive further nerfs 

[GhosT 1301]

8 hours ago, foscor77 said:

Rockets only have like 10 ammo units and now i cant even resupply? 

 

"only"

 

Lol, be glad that the AAEPD crutches you that much.

Now come back when you play the OSMAW.

 

Even better if you witnessed the times where you could only carry one spare OSMAW rocket and consumables weren't a thing.

[Hexerin 1109]

5 hours ago, Solamente said:

given that explosives already have a pretty low skill ceiling, i’m curious as to why you think they should receive further nerfs 

I'm not asking for explosive weapon nerfs though? With the exception of the Volcano, I see no problems with the balance on any of the explosive weapons as they currently are. Unfortunately, due to how the Volcano works there's nothing that can be done about it to balance it.

 

The problem with explosive weapons is that they are freely usable. Now that they've taken the nerf to a full on removal of resupply from the ammo crates, they aren't as effective when off the streets. We're still looking at locations that can be shelled from the streets being a problem though. We're slowly moving in the right direction, but we aren't there yet.

[vsb 6131]

17 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

I'm not asking for explosive weapon nerfs though?

7 hours ago, Hexerin said:

Anything that reduces the effectiveness of explosives in general gameplay is a good thing

reducing a weapon's effectiveness would be considered a nerf, and you've asked for a direct nerf here

20 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

Clarification requested:

Does this also still extend to grenades like it already does?

Does this apply to Resupply Box (Medium), the briefcase style supplier you can purchase with Joker Tickets?

 

I feel like this should be extended to also apply to Mobile Supply Unit, Field Supplier, and Field Supplier (Wide Radius). Grenades should still be allowed from Mobile Supply Unit though, if possible to separate them... but if not, just write them off as a casualty of collateral damage because it'd be worth the cost.

 

 

17 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

With the exception of the Volcano, I see no problems with the balance on any of the explosive weapons as they currently are. Unfortunately, due to how the Volcano works there's nothing that can be done about it to balance it.

the volcano isn't really unbalanced just nonsensical, and there's an easy fix for that

 

 

17 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

The problem with explosive weapons is that they are freely usable. Now that they've taken the nerf to a full on removal of resupply from the ammo crates, they aren't as effective when off the streets. We're still looking at locations that can be shelled from the streets being a problem though. We're slowly moving in the right direction, but we aren't there yet.

i dont understand why a weapon that you apparently think has no balance problems needs to be changed in any way, positive or negative

 

also you've listed a problem with explosive balance only a sentence after saying you had no problems with explosive balance

 

 

 

Edited January 30, 2020 by Solamente
typo

[Fortune Runner 796]

Some people are forgetting that most players are silver

Because of that  , it is important to remember that  ANY weapon when switched to , guarantees a win , cant really be considered balanced and fair.

Of course skill comes into  play , but when skill of those lower threats and ranks can not possibly counter it well , then it can not be considered completely fine and  healthy for APB

And as stated by others  , if the change is not good it can always be reverted , since getting a proper balance has  many variables and not just a single weapon.

In this case , the nerf was about freely accessing ammo for certain weapons , since it is believed  to throw too big of an unbalance to have that much ammo for them.

and with so many other ways to get ammo , then it is not that drastic of a change and only means you need to adjust mods and strategys accordingly

[Mercuie 28]

14 hours ago, ExoticZ said:

It's time to use the good old "Field Supplier" or the "Ammo Modification" for your vehicle. 

So much this!  People forget the ammo mod for the car is even a thing.  It will be nice if LO can actually get the game into a state where 1 setup just isn't good enough.  That all the types of mods and vehicles in the game have a use and you may want to switch it up between or even during the mission.

[Hexerin 1109]

6 hours ago, Solamente said:

-snip-

Explosive weapons are fine. Explosive weapons having effectively infinite ammo thanks to suppliers is not. So obviously, the problem is the explosive weapons.

 

 

No, that's not how it works. That's like saying NTEC is the problem because some theoretically buffed Improved Rifling giving it 20m increased range makes it obscenely overtuned. No, the problem is Improved Rifling. Similarly, the problem isn't explosive weapons but rather the various suppliers giving them effectively infinite ammo on demand.

 

And people wonder why I'm always so frustrated with Little Orbit for listening to you people.

Edited January 30, 2020 by Hexerin

[Jilleroo 349]

20 hours ago, CookiePuss said:

Mobile cover is incredibly exploitable.

For good players, it's beyond cheap.

I laughed when OP said the ammo box was the only good consumable.

 

Mobile cover is so stupidly effective...

 

7 hours ago, Mercuie said:

So much this!  People forget the ammo mod for the car is even a thing.

With how important car spawner is (imho), I just can't afford to run it.

Edited January 30, 2020 by Evagelyne

[PotatoeGirl 218]

1 minute ago, Evagelyne said:

Mobile cover is so stupidly effective...

For all the things that it is not supposed to do.

[illgot 379]

1 hour ago, Hexerin said:

Explosive weapons are fine. Explosive weapons having effectively infinite ammo thanks to suppliers is not. So obviously, the problem is the explosive weapons.

 

No, that's not how it works. That's like saying NTEC is the problem because some theoretically buffed Improved Rifling giving it 20m increased range makes it obscenely overtuned. No, the problem is Improved Rifling. Similarly, the problem isn't explosive weapons but rather the various suppliers giving them effectively infinite ammo on demand.

 

And people wonder why I'm always so frustrated with Little Orbit for listening to you people.

 

even with "infinite ammo" explosive weapons will never be as useful as the Ntec or any standard weapon that dominates in their range category.

 

Explosive weapons are extremely effective against low skill players but once people get around high silver they stop being effective because you can easily dodge explosives.  Once people get access to Flak they become all but useless against people.  Still very effective against vehicle objectives, but not so much against players who use Flak.

 

And saying that, all rank 195 mods should have their requirement to use dropped down to rank 85.  

[PotatoeGirl 218]

1 hour ago, illgot said:

Explosive weapons are extremely effective against low skill players but once people get around high silver they stop being effective because you can easily dodge explosives. 

How is that even a good argument? Are only the top skill players allowed to have fun in this game? 

It is cheap no mater who does it and to who.

[Hexerin 1109]

5 hours ago, illgot said:

Explosive weapons are extremely effective against low skill players but once people get around high silver they stop being effective

I love when people bring this up because my mere existence proves its not true. Every time it's a full moon and I get that urge to go fuck with the golds, they consistently get pushed to raging (if not outright ragequitting) when I bring explosives to bear. If they're "so easy to dodge", why do basically no gold players (I'm talking the big names we all recognize here) ever mop the floor with me while laughing at my rockets/grenades? Instead, I get to chuckle at their sky-flying ragdolls.

 

Just like any weapon, explosives usage is a skill that can be mastered. The difference is that the skill floor for explosives can basically just reach out slightly and touch its ceiling, and both are far lower than a normal gun would be. The main thing that sets apart the plebs from the elites is map knowledge and the ability to predict the actions of the opp based on the objectives in play.

 

I'll never understand why people main them, but I fully understand why people will bring them out on occasion. It can be great fun and an excellent way to unwind from otherwise stressful play.

 

Also, the Volcano laughs at your Flak.

[illgot 379]

4 hours ago, HawtGirl said:

How is that even a good argument? Are only the top skill players allowed to have fun in this game? 

It is cheap no mater who does it and to who.

highish silvers are the average skilled.  And how is something that only works on lower skilled players cheap?

 

  

27 minutes ago, Hexerin said:

I love when people bring this up because my mere existence proves its not true. Every time it's a full moon and I get that urge to go fuck with the golds, they consistently get pushed to raging (if not outright ragequitting) when I bring explosives to bear. If they're "so easy to dodge", why do basically no gold players (I'm talking the big names we all recognize here) ever mop the floor with me while laughing at my rockets/grenades? Instead, I get to chuckle at their sky-flying ragdolls.

 

Just like any weapon, explosives usage is a skill that can be mastered. The difference is that the skill floor for explosives can basically just reach out slightly and touch its ceiling, and both are far lower than a normal gun would be. The main thing that sets apart the plebs from the elites is map knowledge and the ability to predict the actions of the opp based on the objectives in play.

 

I'll never understand why people main them, but I fully understand why people will bring them out on occasion. It can be great fun and an excellent way to unwind from otherwise stressful play.

 

Also, the Volcano laughs at your Flak.

Are you on EU?  Because on NA explosives only work on the lower skilled players that have no understanding of how the OSMAW and OPGL works.

 

Try getting lots of kills against some of the maxed out golds on NA.

 

I'm not even that great and explosive weapons are useless against me.  Too easy to hear the 1.5 second wind up of an OSMAW/Volcano and just walk out of the way with the 1-2 second travel time of the missile.  That is 2-3 second before the rocket even becomes a danger to it's target.  I don't understand how that is impossible to dodge considering the radius is 5 meters and most weapons TTK is under 0.8 seconds.

 

OPGL is a little harder to dodge because of the multiple rounds and player mobility, but still pretty easy since very few people know how to bounce grenades off walls.

Edited January 31, 2020 by illgot

[vsb 6131]

20 hours ago, Hexerin said:

Explosive weapons are fine. Explosive weapons having effectively infinite ammo thanks to suppliers is not. So obviously, the problem is the explosive weapons.

explosives already don't have infinite ammo from suppliers - its been restricted (annoyingly inconsistently) from ammo boxes, field supplier requires you to stop shooting, mobile supply isn't worth using, and both ammo boxes and field supplier are time gated

 

 

20 hours ago, Hexerin said:

No, that's not how it works. That's like saying NTEC is the problem because some theoretically buffed Improved Rifling giving it 20m increased range makes it obscenely overtuned. No, the problem is Improved Rifling. Similarly, the problem isn't explosive weapons but rather the various suppliers giving them effectively infinite ammo on demand.

 

And people wonder why I'm always so frustrated with Little Orbit for listening to you people.

maybe this analogy would make sense if every other gun was also broken by improved rifling, but if you make a change across the board and there's only one outlier that outlier is the problem

 

 

2 hours ago, Hexerin said:

I love when people bring this up because my mere existence proves its not true.

your "mere existence" is anecdotal at best, and making dethreating golds silvers rage in the bronze district does not mean explosives are super effective vs skilled players

 

 

Edited January 31, 2020 by Solamente
typo