Battleye. Don't put your hopes high?

[Kast2 28]

9 minutes ago, Boba said:

That's why fairfight is really is really important. Any person with C/C++ background would understand my point, which the importance of having both server sided and client sided protection to effectively eliminate suspicious/cheating actions. Problem is a lot of people replying either didn't understand my point properly or are just commenting with 0 knowledge of how cheat detection works. They're just delusional and are going through wishful thinking that battleye alone is sufficient.

A few years ago I worked on two sites (which are currently online) that sell cheats. Out of curiosity given the new acquisition I contacted him to see if they were willing to continue with a future cheat of APB and apparently they are. For this reason the BattlEye should not be underestimated.

[LilyV3 323]

5 minutes ago, Kast2 said:

A few years ago I worked on two sites (which are currently online) that sell cheats. Out of curiosity given the new acquisition I contacted him to see if they were willing to continue with a future cheat of APB and apparently they are. For this reason the BattlEye should not be underestimated.

Some paid hundreds and even thousends of $ to play the game and risk it cheating, why would these people not even fund enough for constant cheats even with regular battleeye adjustments?

The dedication and money some of them put into it is astounishing

 

[TheAceNinja 38]

2 hours ago, MartisLTU said:

I bet MrEpicGoat is already working on how to defeat  BE. 

 

Goat couldn't even beat PB, and FF wasn't client-side. Goat is completely and utterly irrelevant these days.

[ElectroStingz 52]

5 hours ago, Boba said:

Since Battleye is coming to apb, I just wanna raise awareness to something. People who play PUBG know that Battleye alone is very far from a proper cheat detection mechanism. So, will Battleye be present with fairfight, or it's a case of either/or? I know for a fact that battleye alone is not sufficient and it will just be a matter of time before new  cheats are made, and that would suck! I'm recommending Punkbuster + Battleye + Fairfight(if possible) since it would be really hard to bypass three layers, 2 of which are client-sided injection detectors.

What are you guys' thoughts on this?

 

PUBG cheating

Quote

The full scale of cheating on the game is incredibly vast. Anti-cheating software company BattlEye said in February that it had banned more than a million cheaters in January alone – warning then that "things continue to escalate", suggesting that the numbers will be even higher now.

 

I think you need to look at it from another perspective. Cheating will not stop regardless of Battleye but consider what comes out of this. Battleye is like an antivirus program, with a detection database. Due to Battleye being used in another games their database is always growing and scan engine constantly updated to detect new cheats. The more Battleye is being used as an Anticheat solution, the more data they have to improve the database / scan engine. As a whole it is far better than FF alone and with big titles such as PUBG Battleye will only get better.

 

Quote

BE is using innovative, sophisticated detection routines, such as entirely dynamic on-the-fly scanning being controlled and altered by the backend making it impossible for hackers to develop permanent bypasses for specific client files.

 

The key part here being that cheat developers need to constantly update in order to stay ahead. Pricing (for cheats) might go up or cheat developers will start working on private cheats with a high price tag. Anything that slows down their progress and deters players away from cheating is a good addition to APB. What I hope Little Orbit do is announce how many bans per month to at least provide some form of acknowledgement that they are trying to keep San Paro clean. (no names, just figures)

Edited June 6, 2018 by ElectroStingz

[Boba 51]

1 hour ago, ElectroStingz said:

 

PUBG cheating

 

I think you need to look at it from another perspective. Cheating will not stop regardless of Battleye but consider what comes out of this. Battleye is like an antivirus program, with a detection database. Due to Battleye being used in another games their database is always growing and scan engine constantly updated to detect new cheats. The more Battleye is being used as an Anticheat solution, the more data they have to improve the database / scan engine. As a whole it is far better than FF alone and with big titles such as PUBG Battleye will only get better.

 

 

The key part here being that cheat developers need to constantly update in order to stay ahead. Pricing (for cheats) might go up or cheat developers will start working on private cheats with a high price tag. Anything that slows down their progress and deters players away from cheating is a good addition to APB. What I hope Little Orbit do is announce how many bans per month to at least provide some form of acknowledgement that they are trying to keep San Paro clean. (no names, just figures)

Agreed. Thanks for the detailed logical reply.

2 hours ago, LilyV3 said:

Some paid hundreds and even thousends of $ to play the game and risk it cheating, why would these people not even fund enough for constant cheats even with regular battleeye adjustments?

The dedication and money some of them put into it is astounishing

 

Indeed. Cheaters consider it a hobby which pleases their inner troll. Cheat-makers consider it a hobby to develop their OPP skills and make money out of it. Disgusting types of people which will always exist.

[Nymphi-DoubleDee 37]

6 hours ago, Kiida said:

I've seen maybe 3 cheaters at most in Fortnite in a few hundred hours of play time. I can log on APB right now and find that many in just one mission. /shrug

Stop grouping with them, then.

[Nymphi-DoubleDee 37]

6 hours ago, Boba said:

Since Battleye is coming to apb, I just wanna raise awareness to something. People who play PUBG know that Battleye alone is very far from a proper cheat detection mechanism. So, will Battleye be present with fairfight, or it's a case of either/or? I know for a fact that battleye alone is not sufficient and it will just be a matter of time before new  cheats are made, and that would suck! I'm recommending Punkbuster + Battleye + Fairfight(if possible) since it would be really hard to bypass three layers, 2 of which are client-sided injection detectors.

What are you guys' thoughts on this?

Savior Scott already said it will be BE+FF.

[Excalibur! 207]

I dont think it will be fully like ff when just arrived, full of hype and clean game until they learnt how to deal around with it.

I hope this time they use the tools at their hand correctly and clean these human trash for once.

 

I have no my hopes to high since there are serious psychopaths like emcitement going full blatant these days (while sucking hard when they are not toggled).

Edited June 6, 2018 by LuzExtinguido

[Boba 51]

44 minutes ago, Nymphi-DoubleDee said:

Savior Scott already said it will be BE+FF.

That's great! Thanks for the info.

[WaitWat 3]

I said it once and i will say it again.

BE is easy to baypass put pain on in the patootie to maitain in, FairFight is good internal anticheat software. Even if someone manage to baypass them both, you still have GM running around in game.

 

So I dont think we need PB+BE+FF. 

 

BE and FF is enough. 

Edited June 6, 2018 by WaitWat

[N0rbat 29]

8 hours ago, Boba said:

Since Battleye is coming to apb, I just wanna raise awareness to something. People who play PUBG know that Battleye alone is very far from a proper cheat detection mechanism. So, will Battleye be present with fairfight, or it's a case of either/or? I know for a fact that battleye alone is not sufficient and it will just be a matter of time before new  cheats are made, and that would suck! I'm recommending Punkbuster + Battleye + Fairfight(if possible) since it would be really hard to bypass three layers, 2 of which are client-sided injection detectors.

What are you guys' thoughts on this?

In PUBG you have 1.5m players online... With 1k peope online BE will crush cheaters instantly... In PUBG they ban around 6-10k people/day

[Kiida 454]

1 hour ago, Nymphi-DoubleDee said:

Stop grouping with them, then.

but I like playing with @Frosi 

[Frosi 719]

19 minutes ago, Kiida said:

but I like playing with @Frosi 

[Flaws 1031]

With BattlEye, FairFight and actual GM's roaming the districts, it's about to become a whole lot more difficult to cheat in APB. You will find a lot less public cheats for sale and their price will probably increase because of having to update it constantly to be undetectable by BE, and even if you do find one or just code one yourself, you'll still struggle to get a significant advantage over legit players and remain undetected for a long period of time. You can't get rid of 100% of cheaters, but it's the best solution and I'm grateful that LO picked the BE + FF combo.

[Cr0 328]

From what I've learned about how effective Battleye is, long term undetected cheating basically stops with that. There won't be anyone who can comfortably get away with cheating without having to worry. When the public pay-cheat developers have developed bypasses for Battleye in the past (at least in the cases I've heard), they have gotten detected so fast that it has proven to the cheat developers that it simply isn't worth it. It's a pure loss for them (time vs money). This is when they move to having expensive cheats open only for a small group, enabling them to still make a good amount of money and in theory avoiding detection in a better way. But these cheats get detected often too from what I've seen.

With a properly configured FF alongside, it means that even if someone manages to bypass an actual BE detection temporarily, they still can't ramp up their cheat settings very much. So FF is a perfect compliment to client-side anti cheat. Running FF alone though is not a good idea at all, as we've seen, even if it would be well configured, because then everyone can still use almost any cheat they like and just cheat enough to increase their performance to a certain level without getting flagged by FF, which is the case with for instance Battlefield 1 (Battlefield 4 has PB also). FF was marketed as the nightmare of cheat developers, but it's the opposite when it comes to games protected by FF alone. Cheat developers then don't need to to worry about actual detections, meaning the cheats are easier to make, maintain and sell, which leads to a much higher number of low key cheaters. The ban responsibility then falls on the cheat users, which is also perfect for the cheat developers.

 

TL;DR: With both a good client side anti cheat like BE and a well configured FF alongside, there is no need to worry much. It's one of the best anti cheat combinations you can have (if you don't count custom anti cheat).

 

 

Edited June 7, 2018 by SilverCrow

[SelttikS 223]

I would never install punkbuster, that is pure malware garbage right there.

[Boba 51]

43 minutes ago, SilverCrow said:

From what I've learned about how effective Battleye is, long term undetected cheating basically stops with that. There won't be anyone who can comfortably get away with cheating without having to worry. When the public pay-cheat developers have developed bypasses for Battleye in the past (at least in the cases I've heard), they have gotten detected so fast that it has proven to the cheat developers that it simply isn't worth it. It's a pure loss for them (time vs money). This is when they move to having expensive cheats open only for a small group, enabling them to still make a good amount of money and in theory avoiding detection in a better way. But these cheats get detected often too from what I've seen.

With a properly configured FF alongside, it means that even if someone manages to bypass an actual BE detection temporarily, they still can't ramp up their cheat settings very much. So FF is a perfect compliment to client-side anti cheat. Running FF alone though is not a good idea at all, as we've seen, even if it would be well configured, because then everyone can still use almost any cheat they like and just cheat enough to increase their performance to a certain level without getting flagged by FF, which is the case with for instance Battlefield 1 (Battlefield 4 has PB also). FF was marketed as the nightmare of cheat developers, but it's the opposite when it comes to games protected by FF alone. Cheat developers then don't need to to worry about actual detections, meaning the cheats are easier to make, maintain and sell, which leads to a much higher number of low key cheaters. The ban responsibility then falls on the cheat users, which is also perfect for the cheat developers.

 

TL;DR: With both a good client side anti cheat like BE and a well configured FF alongside, there is no need to worry much. It's one of the best anti cheat combinations you can have (if you don't count custom anti cheat).

 

 

I'm 100% with you.

25 minutes ago, SelttikS said:

I would never install punkbuster, that is pure malware garbage right there.

Because you've never seen proper implementation of Punkbuster. APB's out-dated PB was shit. Look at games like BF4 were PB does a very good job when properly configured and kept up-to-date.

Thanks guys for confirming the presence of FF alongside with BE. This makes me even more optimistic about the update. To add, I wish LO informs us beforehand to remove our advanced launchers so we don't get banned suddenly after the upgrade.

[kendric2000 21]

So...maintenance was pushed back to Thursday this week. Think maybe Battleye patch is dropping tomorrow? or maybe the pre-patch? We can only hope.

[Regenance 59]

I don't mind seeing cheaters lasting a day instead of months and years and obviously ruining other's experience within the game, BattlEye has to be the signature to all those cheaters to not keep staying where they're not belongs to. Hope it will clean the mess we had before. and I really hope and passionate about a new era to APB.

[Asparii 50]

1 hour ago, Boba said:

I wish LO informs us beforehand to remove our advanced launchers so we don't get banned suddenly after the upgrade.

Considering the communication Matt Scott and the rest of the LO team have had with us lately I'm willing to bet they'll put an announcement out a day or two before the actual patch drops so we get time to be notified about it so there are no unnecessary bans. 

[SelttikS 223]

11 hours ago, Boba said:

Because you've never seen proper implementation of Punkbuster. APB's out-dated PB was shit. Look at games like BF4 were PB does a very good job when properly configured and kept up-to-date.

 

 

No that would be because PB is trash and acts more like malware than an anticheat. Mass bans for lines of text in chat being one of the reasons why it is garbage that i would never install.

[Snjezana 22]

Sorry for a bit OT, but when I read the title I thought "Which hopes?". Personally, I couldn't care less which or how many anti-cheat programs are running. Majority of people will continue with their hackusations in the district chat as soon as they get killed and the ego's scratched. As if the implementation of BattlEye would significantly reduce the number of false reports. That annoys me more than actually facing a hacker. 

Edited June 7, 2018 by Mazikeen90

[Nymphi-DoubleDee 37]

16 hours ago, Boba said:

I'm 100% with you.

Because you've never seen proper implementation of Punkbuster. APB's out-dated PB was shit. Look at games like BF4 were PB does a very good job when properly configured and kept up-to-date.

Thanks guys for confirming the presence of FF alongside with BE. This makes me even more optimistic about the update. To add, I wish LO informs us beforehand to remove our advanced launchers so we don't get banned suddenly after the upgrade.

The problem with Punkbuster is true false bans. Using a China mouse with DPI software? Seen as an injection, and could potentially get you banned. PB had a huge banwave when Logitech did it with their G series mice.

[iLowSec 1]

15 hours ago, Asparii said:

Considering the communication Matt Scott and the rest of the LO team have had with us lately I'm willing to bet they'll put an announcement out a day or two before the actual patch drops so we get time to be notified about it so there are no unnecessary bans. 

With the integration of the admin tracker directly into the forums its just a matter of forcing yourself to look at that before running apb.

1 hour ago, Mazikeen90 said:

Sorry for a bit OT, but when I read the title I thought "Which hopes?". Personally, I couldn't care less which or how many anti-cheat programs are running. Majority of people will continue with their hackusations in the district chat as soon as they get killed and the ego's scratched. As if the implementation of BattlEye would significantly reduce the number of false reports. That annoys me more than actually facing a hacker. 

I fear this will still happen even after BE+FF. People cant just be better than you, that's just not possible I have played for x amount if time and I know what all  guns do under every scenario known to the living. (APB Logic) :^)

[Boba 51]

8 hours ago, SelttikS said:

 

No that would be because PB is trash and acts more like malware than an anticheat. Mass bans for lines of text in chat being one of the reasons why it is garbage that i would never install.

Would've been banned from BF4 a long time ago buddy..