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before i start...

 

please read this as informational. take it in. it's not meant to be negative. it's not meant to deflate spirits.

 

it's just an experience i have had that i wanted to share. you can be your own judge. but for me, the journey was stark and revealing.

 

 

 

 

 

in the past 8 hours i've been taken on a tour of the "dark side" of APB. a brief peek to see some things i kinda wish i hadn't even seen.

 

i literally feel like someone took me down into the sewers and i saw a sub-culture. i saw code and videos i simply couldn't find using conventional searching. and frankly, it makes me sick... 

 

but, it explains SO much. the oddball, exaggerated "left-to-right" character movement. the "insta-kill" i am always experiencing. how some people (an alarmingly high count of people) simply can't be beat. and their shooting ability defies all logic. all these people exhibit the same exact profile.

 

the only thing i can say to this community is the cheating... when the veil is lifted... you can see that it is so very real. and very prominent.

 

it is a practiced art. it extends far beyond using macro's to control weapon shots. triggerbots are now inclusive of other hacks. rolled nicely into an "memory space" executable that runs wild below the detection of anti-cheat software.

 

and this sub-culture of people who are using it? many of them are spiteful. suppressed. angry people. they even stalk specific players in the game and share their video clips like taxidermy mounts on their wall. i saw cultural rifts that are being addressed through the means of cheating.

 

while i feel vindicated for seeing this, i also feel so depressed. i love APB. it means a lot to me. much more than a simple video game. it's a unique experience. a unique culture. i hate seeing things degrade like this.

 

i only pray EAC can address some of this stuff. those folks there are sharp and aggressive at solving issues. they have a proven track record of being able to isolate unique, quirky violations and convert them to ban material.

 

the catch... it seems to me... will LO take action on the data and ban? banning is not a failure, but failing to ban is...

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Try too keep in mind that at this point some players have 10,000 or more hours in the game and hundreds of thousands of kills.

Not saying there are no cheaters, but a lot of the ladies and gentlemen left are hardcore veterans.

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3 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

Try too keep in mind that at this point some players have 10,000 or more hours in the game and hundreds of thousands of kills.

Not saying there are no cheaters, but a lot of the ladies and gentlemen left are hardcore veterans.

I think what he's mainly trying to say is that he visited a cheat forum out of curiosity and was shocked at how many of these shit bags currently exist in the game, and how rotten their attitude is towards everything including other players..  That's what I got from it anyway.

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11 minutes ago, BrandonBranderson said:

I think what he's mainly trying to say is that he visited a cheat forum out of curiosity and was shocked at how many of these shit bags currently exist in the game, and how rotten their attitude is towards everything including other players..  That's what I got from it anyway.

cheat forums show up in google results tho, i assume that’s what op means by “conventional searching”

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27 minutes ago, BrandonBranderson said:

I think what he's mainly trying to say is that he visited a cheat forum out of curiosity and was shocked at how many of these shit bags currently exist in the game, and how rotten their attitude is towards everything including other players..  That's what I got from it anyway.

That's what I got out of reading the OP's post.

 

I suppose we could try and derail the OP's topic into something completely different

that is not relative to the subculture of APB cheaters that openly share their experiences.

 

 

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i agree 110% with @CookiePuss about veteran players. and you know it when you engage one. i am generally left with a grin because the gun fight or engagement was just so good! it makes you love the game, even getting beat you know it's just one awesome, genuine beating 🙂  can be tough to experience but in the end, you know it is fair game play.

 

what i was exposed to was not that... it was pretty hard to watch as some people i personally know... that are good players, were hunted and killed over and over to help make montage videos by elusive/shady salesmen who are hocking their magic software (which appears to be bit of c++ using memory isolation).

 

and yes... i have never seen nor heard of any of these people or sites. they are not search-engine indexed. but when you see it unfolding on your screen, the overly accurate shots, those run-n-gun oscar players in fight club... it's sobering to say the least.

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2 minutes ago, gordIsMyName said:

i agree 110% with @CookiePuss about veteran players. and you know it when you engage one. i am generally left with a grin because the gun fight or engagement was just so good! it makes you love the game, even getting beat you know it's just one awesome, genuine beating 🙂  can be tough to experience but in the end, you know it is fair game play.

 

This was so painful to read it might as well be a shill post. The reality is most likely you getting min ttk'd then calling the dude some name in either /d or /w. 

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Cheaters were an issue since ever, at least since I started to play this silly game five to six years ago. First off, I'd disagree all cheaters are the same, they cannot fit into a single stereotype or definition, everyone cheats for different reasons, but I can agree on the fact cheating in any way is dishonest, unfair, straightforwardly wrong, even in some cases illegal. What company can or can't do regarding it, I am unsure of, as I am clearly not a savvy in this field, but there are things the community can do. 

 

We should stop giving them such importance directly, most cheaters I met are feeding on your anger and frustration, remaining calm and emotionless is often the key. Getting emotionally hijacked has no beneficial effect, quite on the contrary, and it's something cheaters usually enjoy to see. I prefer not to give them that kind of satisfaction, it's just one match, or few, simply ignore them. Granted, without feedback they constantly get, there would be less of them. Ultimately, it makes no sense to come online to have some fun, yet to leave frustrated, one should not let themselves to get too emotional over this issue for their own sake. 

  

Also, most players are accusing each other of cheating too much, legitimate and often less experienced players are more tempted to start cheating themselves when all they read on the forum or in district chats is related to cheating, they feel if they do not cheat ("like everyone else") they will surely lose out, which is one of the reasons they periodically grow in numbers . If we stop assuming whoever is better than us must be cheating and accusing publicly each other so often, things may change for the better. 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Bambola said:

snip

couldnt agree more, especially with the last point. hackusations towards innocents hurt the game much more, partially due to new players reading it and adopting that habit or being like "ah the game is full of cheaters" - which it most definitely is not - it's not an actual cheatfest.

 

cheater feeding on rage etc... eh. i think some are but - i'd say many of them are just too bad to play legit and rely on cheats instead. (partially because they think everyone else cheats, as you said - best example: see ray 🙂 )

or because they think, ah, a small triggerbot isnt too bad. or i'll just use my esp as warning system when some of those lamers try to backstab me again instead of facing me like a real man... as well as those filthy campers, damn them! how dare they stay close to the objective. (the former warning system reason has actually been used by a few individuals on ffbans lol)

 

this is also why i like that matt is totally against broadcasts. though some people embarrassing themselves trying to justify cheating was good to see. although i do not miss certain people and their behavior from there (what was that "detective" called again?)

Edited by neophobia
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1 hour ago, BrandonBranderson said:

I think what he's mainly trying to say is that he visited a cheat forum out of curiosity and was shocked at how many of these shit bags currently exist in the game, and how rotten their attitude is towards everything including other players..  That's what I got from it anyway.

Correct. That's what I though too.

And that's exactly my standpoint too.

1 hour ago, Glaciers said:

cheat forums show up in google results tho, i assume that’s what op means by “conventional searching”

Well conventional searching shows forums for this people who usually go full blatant. They are least of problems as they are easy to get caught.

I'm afraid more of secret societies. In age of Discord and Telegram it's not hard to organize such in known web and nobody would really know (except people inside).

I mean it sound farfetched sure. Paranoid - yeah (cause I am). But it doesn't seem too hard to organize such stuff outside of game, you just find trusty people (they might be your friends even), create some Telegram group under false or even true name (doesn't even matter as long as it's private group and link ain't shared nobody gonna find out as it's all encrypted...) and organize your "pack" around that one guy who will provide you with unique cheat.

The only way for them to ever leak is to one member to snitch, which is very unlikely if they are in that operation too.

42 minutes ago, gordIsMyName said:

what i was exposed to was not that... it was pretty hard to watch as some people i personally know... that are good players, were hunted and killed over and over to help make montage videos by elusive/shady salesmen who are hocking their magic software (which appears to be bit of c++ using memory isolation).

You mean this "montages" which show how their paid cheat works and is undetectable?

Most of time it's stolen material of other paid cheats which were banned before, it's hilarious as most of them are scams probably.

 

 

Well my only real concern is that everyone around me keep passing further and further in "skill cap" - now you can't make mistake, you need to be pinpoint on target or you will die, you need to know shit which you don't see so well... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ...clearly unbased paranoia by me. And there are way too many players like that. Many which I never saw playing before. (That said there are still normal players and it must look for them even more horrible than for me who somehow still keeps up but I keep getting further and further back as well.)

It's either them or me being in some case of arrested development. But dunno how am I supposed to be even 99% accurate at all times.

Edited by Mitne
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1 hour ago, BrandonBranderson said:

I think what he's mainly trying to say is that he visited a cheat forum out of curiosity and was shocked at how many of these shit bags currently exist in the game, and how rotten their attitude is towards everything including other players..  That's what I got from it anyway.


Exactly this 😃

I've been contemplating posting screenshots of conversations from a very popular APB cheat forum....

Just to show people how active that forum is... it's honestly, almost equally active as this one, and that says a lot with how few players APB has left, that the cheat forum is literally as active as the official one lol.

Only reason I didn't post any conversations yet, is not wanting to promote that site... but i suppose i could take some time to remove all links and all identification parts of each image and just leave the conversations they're having.... I bet a LOT of folks would be shocked how there's so many people in this tiny community who has accounts on this forum and has been members for years and years (as many years as APB reloaded exist)

Personally, I don't have an account there, probably since I never needed to download any files... any random person can google their site and can freely browse their forum and read their conversations (which is funny, since i assume thats an oversight in their security or they really just plainly don't care).

It also shows why they are so tightly knit in this game and you can see a lot of things they got in common when talking about APB and their opinions on cheating lol...

I honestly can't imagine what kinda' shitty and boring gaming experience you have provided for yourself, when you're a proud member of a 7y+ account, on a cheating forum for the game you play. Even shooting yourself in the foot, doesn't begin to cover how re*arded you must be really.
 

Edited by Tigrix

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59 minutes ago, Mitne said:

Well conventional searching shows forums for this people who usually go full blatant. They are least of problems as they are easy to get caught.

I'm afraid more of secret societies. In age of Discord and Telegram it's not hard to organize such in known web and nobody would really know (except people inside).

I mean it sound farfetched sure. Paranoid - yeah (cause I am). But it doesn't seem too hard to organize such stuff outside of game, you just find trusty people (they might be your friends even), create some Telegram group under false or even true name (doesn't even matter as long as it's private group and link ain't shared nobody gonna find out as it's all encrypted...) and organize your "pack" around that one guy who will provide you with unique cheat.

The only way for them to ever leak is to one member to snitch, which is very unlikely if they are in that operation too

given op's weird exaggeration of normal apb play im inclined to think he stumbled onto some old public cheat pages and is either unintentionally or intentionally ignoring that the advertised cheats are no longer available

 

but if we give him the benefit of the doubt and he's been invited into several private cheat groups i have to wonder why he bothered to post a vague alarmist thread on the forums instead of taking his code and videos to little orbit directly

 

 

54 minutes ago, Tigrix said:

Just to show people how active that forum is... it's honestly, almost equally active as this one

are we talking about the one that's had 3 posts today or the one that hasnt had a post since last week? i think this thread alone has more current activity than both of said forums put together 

 

im not really trying to downplay the cheating issue since, as posted above, there are clearly some working cheats options (although i have my doubts that colorbots can ever truly be eliminated) - i just don't see the need to overexaggerate

 

 

5 minutes ago, CookiePuss said:

Sick a triggerbot with 250ms delay... better hope your opp is standing still.

im far from a coding expert but it looks like it set to pause for 250ms before repeating, which would give you decent rof on semi auto weapons

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4 minutes ago, Glaciers said:

given op's weird exaggeration of normal apb play im inclined to think he stumbled onto some old public cheat pages and is either unintentionally or intentionally ignoring that the advertised cheats are no longer available

 

im not really trying to downplay the cheating issue since, as posted above, there are clearly some working cheats options


It's hard to enjoy APB when you know there are insiders, supposedly trusted veterans who sough out volunteer jobs and have no good intentions for the game.

Imagine a situation, where a community has dwindled so far due to rampant cheating (AND lack of progress/content of course)... but imagine that some of the "most known" veteran names, are also veteran names on the upper cheat forum and even have scripts/configs posted in the same name they use in APB and on APB forums....and these are names that are  "veterans and well liked by the community" ... oouff 

Idk how someone posting configs to remove fog in APB and have a massive advantage over other players....can also at the sametime be a well liked veteran and working as SPCTs and

testing the things they'll later break to have an advantage over the rest of the mortal players trying to enjoy a game without any external skill modifiers.
PS.... i mentioned no names, so don't delete this   (ppl are welcome to PM me, if they want source links and names)

Edited by Tigrix
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Still nice to see some heavy try-harding here to present the cheater /hacker happening as minor and rare issue.
Its kinda been enough of insulting people's intelligence with "you gotta have on mind there are hardcore veterans, ppl with 10k + hours,  100k+ kills"  as an only reply to "we have a cheating problem suffocating this game" .

All hardcore players ppl are referring and implying at here, are GONE from this game!  WAKE UP!  We got few left and no, you ain't gonna face them x1000 per day every working day. You will face them randomly maybe for weekend and maybe once per month. Thats it! 
That doesn't justify the constant 24/7  literal "gods"  running around FC, Riot turning them into hacker fest.  Missions are just top of an iceberg. 

There is obvious and big difference between entirely legit veterans with 10k+ hours and those "godlike" veterans that excuse their cheating with "i am pro".  No you are not, you are cheater. Not hacker but a cheater. 

No name n shame policy but literally majority "famous" apb players used macroing at daily basis, used overlays, used this "aim helpers" and large quantity of them always knew behind which corner you are coming from even before you yourself decided which path to take randomly not cuz they lived in a game, but cuz wh. (because wallhack is detectable only if you test enemy yourself by not peeking random corner and he still prefires you already and if he does that consantly in the match. I rest my case.  And many of old very known veterans used it but excused it with : "i play this 4 years, i just know your own thought before you do.  Its not legit simply better player than u veteran, its called cheater. Maybe a veteran cheater but still a cheater. Period. )

I got 10k+ gameplay hours, I never used any form of help aside default vanilla apb application. Funny how almost nobody managed to simply keep same agenda but always needed some "improvements" you later call "skill".   I never even used advanced launcher!  Thats what legit veteran stands for and i am still good player, but it was never my main goal to be. I came for customization, design and creativity goals.

 

I dont have ego issues about inability to accept defeat from simply better legit player, i dont have to be mvp every match and i dont bother my real life with kill /death ratio in 2010 old video game; 

so pls stop  falsely convincing everybody into hackers/cheaters being a minority in this game, and excuse it with "they are just old better playing veterans".   

LEGIT veterans are minority in this game, not the hackers/ cheaters subculture.

 

@MattScott Pls do observe the simplicity of google search Tigrix implied about apb cheating forums, and just read those public forums. They are talking as we speak, because half of them are on this forums as well.

They bypassed EAC not even full month after you put it on if not even same night! 
If client side anti cheat, and more strict severe bans will lead to population dropping for  w/e  percentage lets say 40%,  do it! 
You will have player base of 100 ppl make it maybe 200 ppl...but at least those 100-200 will be legit loyal paying customers satisfied with your game. I will continue to invest in premium's and I ll continue to support  your company with smile on my face... but i dont want to do it while i see hackers and cheaters mocking our legit player base as we speak!


Just be aware that without anti cheat, regardless new engine or any new mod You would like to add  Matt, its a fact this game gonna die because cheater issue is unbearable already, especially after unban wave where people still keep doing it, just this time mocking everybody publicly, even LO staff.  It will die  or it will become entirely f2p game held by hacker community who aint gonna invest in your game, they just gonna exploit farming cash with triggerbots and aimbots, getting new guns and wasting their lives until there wont be apb anymore. Tnx for reading it in advance Matt, sorry for bigger essay. 😕

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my favorite part is "trigachi fucking kek"

coders are funny sometimes

 

 

its important to mention that at no point does the coder claim you wont be caught and banned

and of course when you do, its not like they will give a shit anyways

Edited by CookiePuss

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i'm sorry if this upset the apple cart so to speak...

 

i wish there was a way to add more value/resolution to the issue and as such, i'm inclined to put my faith in the new anti-cheat team and LO. give them some more time to bag-n-tag.

 

and, i stand behind my fellow players now more than ever. crims and enforcers alike.

 

what else can you really do? certainly not stir up a "beat a cheat with a cheat" approach.

 

i support the game and i will continue to play. and honestly, i feel a bit better about things knowing what is truly going on.

 

you just can't get upset at this junction with gameplay. you "hit the ball where it lies", give it a "that was interesting..." moment and just go on.

 

maybe we'll see some healing come our way in the coming weeks?

 

and in the meantime, just think how good we are all getting playing against some cyborgs :^0

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5 minutes ago, gordIsMyName said:

i wish there was a way to add more value/resolution to the issue and as such, i'm inclined to put my faith in the new anti-cheat team and LO. give them some more time to bag-n-tag.

any particular reason why you aren't using your apparent access to private cheats to report information to little orbit?

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Just now, Glaciers said:

any particular reason why you aren't using your apparent access to private cheats to report information to little orbit?

I don't think he have any. It was just my personal thoughs.

Don't attack him for what I said.

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1 hour ago, Kitty Yekaterina said:

[...]

I got 10k+ gameplay hours, I never used any form of help aside default vanilla apb application. Funny how almost nobody managed to simply keep same agenda but always needed some "improvements" you later call "skill".   I never even used advanced launcher!  Thats what legit veteran stands for and i am still good player, but it was never my main goal to be. I came for customization, design and creativity goals.

 

I dont have ego issues about inability to accept defeat from simply better legit player, i dont have to be mvp every match and i dont bother my real life with kill /death ratio in 2010 old video game; 

so pls stop  falsely convincing everybody into hackers/cheaters being a minority in this game, and excuse it with "they are just old better playing veterans".   

[...]

Really hate (even though reminds me of good old drama) to bring this to the forum but the way you try to present yourself to justify your post I just cannot accept.

No, you're not as good as you think you are and you have severe ego problems so don't even try to play that card.

Both you and your friend @Tigrix (cute how you post together to support each other btw.) are known for being salty losers that can't handle being beaten by people simply better than you. 

So sorry to bring that to you but the majority of people you have accused and punished with afking are indeed "just old better playing veterans".
Pretty sure most of the old Citadel veterans can attest to that.

Edited by TheJellyGoo
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1 hour ago, Tigrix said:

Idk how someone posting configs to remove fog

fog:

7ujQgO5.jpg

 

 

no fog:

p1UYXbG.jpg

 

How is this an advantage? Its only done because on potato computers it can be a difference of 20fps.

 

1 hour ago, Tigrix said:

testing the things they'll later break to have an advantage over

Come on man, thats literally the opposite of what we do. You are better than this.

 

 

Edited by CookiePuss

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1 minute ago, CookiePuss said:

[...]

How is this an advantage? Its only done because an potato computers it can be a difference of 20fps.

[...]

It's probably about the time when the Headless Horseman event was premiering and people removed the fog to snipe people in the distance.

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2 minutes ago, TheJellyGoo said:

It's probably about the time when the Headless Horseman event was premiering and people removed the fog to snipe people in the distance.

Ahh... Ive not seen configs advertised for that one.

But yeah, that is absolutely cheating.

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