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Several questions about melee build


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#1
Miles Archer

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Hello, I'm fairly new to this game. Currently my toon is lvl 18 and I'm halfway to S2, finishing AP missions in S1.

I read several guides and made a deceision to start a melee toon regardless of all its problems. I'm aiming for PVP mostly, but I need a high craft, as it's my only toon atm. I'm aiming to make toon with good personal damage, which relies on burst damage/dots, whatever can waste opponent faster.

 

1. So far I saw zero melee builds that are rotated around Dirty Tricks and Primal combination (which from the first look seems like a nice combination of burst/dot and control). Why so?

Will something like this

http://planer.fallen...10101B401010101

work? Or is it a better idea to swap Dirty Tricks for Group Tactics for Overwhelm and Offensive Coordination?

 

2. Do two similar auras stack? E.g. if I use Offensive coordination and my teammate uses it as well, do we get double buff? Or it works only with different kinds of buffs (E.g. Offensive Coordination + Give Em Hell)?


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#2
Reaps989

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Burst is weaker (harder) than it was before and most builds aren't posted on the forums.

The highest rank of a aura will overwrite the same weaker aura. So no Off Cord 1 won't stack with 2, as 2 will overwrite and block all lower ranks.

Different auras, however, will stack.

Your build is quite AP inefficient but in about 11 hours I'll give an example. Kinda a pain via phone.

Edited by Reaps989, 04 July 2015 - 06:38 PM.

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#3
Miles Archer

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Burst is weaker (harder) than it was before and most builds aren't posted on the forums.

The highest rank of a aura will overwrite the same weaker aura. So no Off Cord 1 won't stack with 2, as 2 will overwrite and block all lower ranks.

Different auras, however, will stack.

Your build is quite AP inefficient but in about 11 hours I'll give an example. Kinda a pain via phone.

 

Thanks a lot. It's understandable that people are not posting builds on forums.

Really nice that similar auras don't stack. I'm starting to like this game more and more.:-)

General question about Primal: is it really so bad? I understand that ranged cannot make use of it anyways, but for melee, for building "zerk" sort of melee fighter, can it be worthy?


Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 


#4
Reaps989

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Thanks a lot. It's understandable that people are not posting builds on forums.
Really nice that similar auras don't stack. I'm starting to like this game more and more.:-)
General question about Primal: is it really so bad? I understand that ranged cannot make use of it anyways, but for melee, for building "zerk" sort of melee fighter, can it be worthy?


Primal works for all weapons, it's actually in a really good spot right now if used properly.
Nysek - Mednaught : The only character in FE made of Gammina™

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#5
Miles Archer

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Primal works for all weapons, it's actually in a really good spot right now if used properly.

That sounds nice. Can you correct my build to be more efficient in terms of AP distribution, when you have time, pls?


Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

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#6
Reaps989

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That sounds nice. Can you correct my build to be more efficient in terms of AP distribution, when you have time, pls?

 

http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

Most likely something like that... but greatly depends on playstyle. I only added the rifle snare simply because it's a second snare, cheap, and lower cooldown than Kneecap.

The extra AP I sunk into endurance. Also make sure you are scaling Armor Use, based off my guide since you were wasting AP since at 55 it scales at 13.06. So 14 for the first 1%, then 13 every single time afterwards.

 

14/27/40/53/66 : 1% to 5%

79/92/105/118/131 : 6% to 10%

144/157/170/183/196 : 11% to 15%


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#7
Miles Archer

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http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

Most likely something like that... but greatly depends on playstyle. I only added the rifle snare simply because it's a second snare, cheap, and lower cooldown than Kneecap.

The extra AP I sunk into endurance. Also make sure you are scaling Armor Use, based off my guide since you were wasting AP since at 55 it scales at 13.06. So 14 for the first 1%, then 13 every single time afterwards.

 

14/27/40/53/66 : 1% to 5%

79/92/105/118/131 : 6% to 10%

144/157/170/183/196 : 11% to 15%

I checked your guide and other guides as well, yes, I was trying to balance it between purchasing nessesary powers and proper scaling.

Several questions about build you posted:

1. Primal 174 doesn't allow me to take Beast Might 6, while I was hoping to get it with Primal 180. Should I really pass on Beast Might 6?

2. Precision 141 allows Precise Hit 4, but doesn't allow me to purchase Concentration 3 (Precision 150). Should I pass on it as well? I was hoping to use it as main stance.

3. Power 183 allowes Attack Posture maxed. Do you recommend it as main stance than? What about penalty to precision? Can I use Precise Hit 4 in this case, when this stance is active?

4. What's the reason for picking melee 182 vs 180, am I missing something?

5. Need Intelligence high... Even if I pass on rifle snare, I cannot max intelligence with this distribution. Like I said It's my 1st toon. I'm crafting a lot to gear him up and to make some money as well.

 

P.S. Ended up with something like that atm (passed on rifle snare):

http://planer.fallen...10101B401010101


Edited by Miles Archer, 06 July 2015 - 03:46 AM.

Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 


#8
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I checked your guide and other guides as well, yes, I was trying to balance it between purchasing nessesary powers and proper scaling.

Several questions about build you posted:

1. Primal 174 doesn't allow me to take Beast Might 6, while I was hoping to get it with Primal 180. Should I really pass on Beast Might 6?

2. Precision 141 allows Precise Hit 4, but doesn't allow me to purchase Concentration 3 (Precision 150). Should I pass on it as well? I was hoping to use it as main stance.

3. Power 183 allowes Attack Posture maxed. Do you recommend it as main stance than? What about penalty to precision? Can I use Precise Hit 4 in this case, when this stance is active?

4. What's the reason for picking melee 182 vs 180, am I missing something?

5. Need Intelligence high... Even if I pass on rifle snare, I cannot max intelligence with this distribution. Like I said It's my 1st toon. I'm crafting a lot to gear him up and to make some money as well.

 

P.S. Ended up with something like that atm (passed on rifle snare):

http://planer.fallen...10101B401010101

1. The main point of primal is primal vigor.

2. You don't need concentration 3 as you will use power stance.

3.^ -25 precision for 125 power totally worth it, and yes you can use precise hit 4

4. 182 melee, because you will get t-shirt with +3 to melee and +10 from ap weapons. (shards or jet hammer) total 182+3+10=195

5. If you want a crafter you need 98 int 95 per and then you'd better go with support build.


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#9
Miles Archer

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1. The main point of primal is primal vigor.

2. You don't need concentration 3 as you will use power stance.

3.^ -25 precision for 125 power totally worth it, and yes you can use precise hit 4

4. 182 melee, because you will get t-shirt with +3 to melee and +10 from ap weapons. (shards or jet hammer) total 182+3+10=195

5. If you want a crafter you need 98 int 95 per and then you'd better go with support build.

1. I was going to use Beast Might and Rampage as well as they seem rather OP to me if used in proper situations.

2. & 3. just logged into game to visit vendor to check stuff again. Funny thing: Attack Posture 5 gives +76 power, but no penalty to Precision according to tooltip...

Seems like a bugged tooltip. Anyways, Attack Posture 5 must be like 125 to power with penalty to precision like 50, right?

It seems to me that it (roughly) means loosing 5% crit chance in order to get (roughly) 3% resistance ignored (almost 4%, needs 3 power to compensate), which is worthy, I agree. 

If tooltip is not bugged and it's WAI, that means roughly 2% increase, which is obviously good. Thanks for that, i will use it.

4. And thanks for that as well, now it makes sence.

5. Perception 96 is too much price to pay in order to get ability to craft all, imo...  But I may end up going with build, posted by Reaps989 in this thread: http://forums.gamers...lee-build-help/

Because meditation seems OP as well. However I don't enjoy much playing support toons....

 

Well, finally it looks something like:

http://planer.fallen...10101B401010101

 

PS. wild thought: if I fully drop precision and invest all those AP into e.g. Telekinesis...


Edited by Miles Archer, 06 July 2015 - 04:00 PM.

Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 


#10
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Tooltips need some fixing that's for sure, for example rampage gives you +stats for 15 seconds and -stats for 15 seconds(even though it says 25). Imo you don't need max lvl beast might but if you feel like you really need it go for it, there's always respecs available, not cheap but available :) I would go with nysek's build personally, everything is neat and polished there.


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#11
Miles Archer

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Tooltips need some fixing that's for sure, for example rampage gives you +stats for 15 seconds and -stats for 15 seconds(even though it says 25). Imo you don't need max lvl beast might but if you feel like you really need it go for it, there's always respecs available, not cheap but available :) I would go with nysek's build personally, everything is neat and polished there.

15 seconds is even better (10 would be the best=)), nice to know, thanks. Need to check Beast Might values, maybe it's really not needed. Nysek's build in this thread or in the other one (which I linked above)? Both builds are nice, but as I said I need tradeskills 180 (at least), and attack posture+meditation build looks a bit more like support build, maybe I'm mistaking though.


Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 


#12
Reaps989

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15 seconds is even better (10 would be the best=)), nice to know, thanks. Need to check Beast Might values, maybe it's really not needed. Nysek's build in this thread or in the other one (which I linked above)? Both builds are nice, but as I said I need tradeskills 180 (at least), and attack posture+meditation build looks a bit more like support build, maybe I'm mistaking though.

 

Meditation is more of a support aura line, yes, but hardly a "support" build.

 

Then again I never make a build, personally, without an aura :P (But will make one for someone else)

 

http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

Edit : Now if we are talking about a build I'd personally use... at least for the goal of this build.

 

http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

  • Since the idea of having 180 trade skill is kinda silly on it's own... just dropped points to get to 186 First Aid.
    • Dirty Trick's DoT is nice, but hardly going to compare to having another 3% armor penetration solo.
      • This doesn't mean it's bad, but since you're going so high into intelligence the heal outweighs the DoT as it can still be dispelled.
  • Dodge is a bit lower than I'd like, but at the same time you have an aura to make up for that in team or solo.
  • Power and Precision are lower, but you don't lose any precision while running Bloodlust 3.
  • Should be sitting at 1132 health with AP weapon (80 HP, not including the possible 48 from endurance), Brandy, and Primal Vigor.
    • If you wanted to go "full" health, not including Defensive GT Suit/Helm and no Lizard Dog Serum it would sit at 1371.

Edited by Reaps989, 07 July 2015 - 08:48 AM.

Nysek - Mednaught : The only character in FE made of Gammina™

Walls are for horses, I build gosh darning castles of logic to protect us from your constant rain of derp.

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#13
Miles Archer

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Meditation is more of a support aura line, yes, but hardly a "support" build.

 

Then again I never make a build, personally, without an aura :P (But will make one for someone else)

 

http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

Edit : Now if we are talking about a build I'd personally use... at least for the goal of this build.

 

http://planer.fallen...10101AE01010101

 

  • Since the idea of having 180 trade skill is kinda silly on it's own... just dropped points to get to 186 First Aid.
    • Dirty Trick's DoT is nice, but hardly going to compare to having another 3% armor penetration solo.
      • This doesn't mean it's bad, but since you're going so high into intelligence the heal outweighs the DoT as it can still be dispelled.
  • Dodge is a bit lower than I'd like, but at the same time you have an aura to make up for that in team or solo.
  • Power and Precision are lower, but you don't lose any precision while running Bloodlust 3.
  • Should be sitting at 1132 health with AP weapon (80 HP, not including the possible 48 from endurance), Brandy, and Primal Vigor.
    • If you wanted to go "full" health, not including Defensive GT Suit/Helm and no Lizard Dog Serum it would sit at 1371.

 

hmmm... 2nd one looks really cool!!!

Yes, going without aura seemed bad to me, xD, but I couldn't figure out how to get it all sorted.

Thanks a lot for the build! I will give it a try, because it seems to have all I need.


Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 


#14
Miles Archer

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finally decided to pass on Dirty Tricks and Primal Both due to several reasons, like:

- Dirty Steel dot can be easily dispelled as well as roots

- Primal Vigor is good, but reserves too much gamma, in 1 on 1 can be lethal for me

- Beast Might debuffs myself badly, while exp (ranged) opponent can avoid burst and than own me, when i'm in self-debuff phase.

 

http://planer.fallen...10101010101A201

 

Have several principal questions though:

 

1. Attack posture 5 tooltip seems bugged. Are proper values REALLY like +125 power -50 precision?

If it's bugged must be smth like:

183 power (to get Attack Posture 5)

+125 power (from Attack Posture)

+75 power (from Give Em Hell 4)

+12 power (from Bolster 4)

---------------------------------

totally 395 power;

395 - 194 = 201 power (buff) ~ +[6,23]% = 6% buff

(201/32,2899 ~ 6,23% (according to scaling in Reaps989 guide))

 

If attack posture is really +125 power and -50 precision, I can completely pass on precision due to the following reason:

rough damage increase from Precision ~150, if I use Attack Posture 5 is only 5% maximum,

(if i forget about dodge which my opponent has),

(- 50 penalty means that I really get only 10% crit chance, and with +50% damage on crit hit i get:

0,1*1,5 + 0,9*1 = 1,05 = 5% damage increase)

whereas Give Em Hell gives 2% rough damage increase.

 

2. If Attack Posture tooltip is not bugged and really i get +75 power without penalty to precision, then

(Bolster 4 is swapped by Gird)

183 power

+ 75  (from Attack Posture 5)

+75 (from Give Em Hell 4)

----------------------------------

= 333

333 - 194 = 139 ~ 4% increase, and there's no option to go without precision, and i need to rearrange stats again=)


Edited by Miles Archer, 20 July 2015 - 07:58 AM.

Miles Archer: I'm going to blow your head off unless I get those keys!

Marlowe Hammer: So what does this mean, Miles? You don't love me no more?

 




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