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Dear Gold rank players who inhabit Silver and Bronze districts...


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#61
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I didn't read it, but I just wanted to point out. I don't inhabit a silver district because I want to. I'm a gold who actually clicks on the big button to automatically recommend a server for me and it pops me into a silver district itself. So honestly, half of us golds aren't in a silver district cause we want to be, even though it can be a curse to be a gold. Some of us just happen to be put into a silver district.

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#62
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View PostKimiko, on 21 April 2012 - 07:22 PM, said:

The segregation is far from ruining the game. The reason that mid- to high-golds get opp regularly now isn't because the game throws low-threat players at them more often, matchmaking is essentially the same as before segregation (I actually think matchmaking was tightened up, meaning now it takes less of a gap before you're able to call backup, which is a good thing). We get more opp now because there's more higher threat players in the same district, which means matchmaking can actually find players to put against us.

Before segregation, with roughly 10% of the population gold, that means an average server had 5 gold players per side. I forget the exact numbers at the time, I can go look them up if you like, but it was something like 36% of the pop was silver, and 41% bronze, with 13% green. That means the average district had 18 silver per side, ~20 bronze per side, and ~7 green per side. Since there's only 5 gold on each side, and it was easy for one side to be in the middle of a mission when the other finished, so they'd rarely actually be able to be pitted against each other. The game then had to either not give them anything to do for 30+ minutes, or throw scores of low-threat players at them, which is what happened most of the time when we'd actually get opp. This is terrible for the bronze and green players, as if you think you have it bad as a silver, imagine their position.

Silver players spent most of their time fighting other silvers and bronze players, which means they were winning more than the average (note that at the time, gold players were winning ridiculously more than average, I won something like 90-95% of my matches). This is bad for the game, because for every individual that wins over 50%, there's someone losing over 50%. Anyone in the lower half of the skill bracket had to fight people better than them for the majority of their games, which leads them to quit pretty quickly.

Now, with segregation, most bronze players actually fight other bronzes for most of their matches. They'll get the occasional green, gold or silver, but on an average, it's far better for them. Silver players were getting a pretty even split of gold and silver, because there weren't enough gold players to keep a gold district running 24/7, which is what the most recent patch addressed. Now, you should be seeing more matches with silvers, with the occasional gold and occasional bronze/green. You should be much closer to a 50% win/loss ratio, which is better for the game as a whole.

Most people have a hard time accepting that they're not supposed to win the majority of their matches. After segregation, most golds I know went from winning 90-95% of their matches to winning ~70%, and now that there's enough golds to go around, I'm actually seeing 55-60%. District segregation is a great idea, and the more they tweak it, the more effective it gets. There simply needs to be a way to keep the better players away from the worse players in order for the worse players to have an enjoyable time, and district segregation is doing a much better job of it than without it.
I appreciate you taking the time to reply in full like this.... But it's definately not my experience with the game since threat segregation and it won't get the people back who left because of it.

Before 1.70 I was bordering silver/gold for months and it didn't matter where I went, gold/silver/bronze district, the opposition was always at least partially gold, it's still like that, the only difference now is that you don't know if the gold players you're facing are going to be good or not because there's just too many of'em. So yeah, I'm still bordering silver/gold meaning I went from the old gold 2-3 to the old silver 9-10+ in a matter of days, I don't feel like I've gotten worse though, not that that really matters, I don't care all that much about my own color, I do care about my friends quitting the game because they got fed up with the hassle of trying to find a district where we can all get full rewards without it being empty or very one-sided: last two nights recommended dropped us either in a close too empty gold district or a full bronze (!) one when all of our team were high silvers/low golds, both of those situations suck pretty much for anyone involved really.

In order to have fun we have to manually choose a fully populated gold or silver server meaning there's always people in our group who have to take a reduction in rewards and guess what? We don't like that, at all.

Before 1.60 we just played, had fun, end of story. I don't see how that was worse.

/edit: So yeah, what I'm really annoyed with mostly is the money-making, I mean like: I buy a 4-slot car on Armas and I want to fill those slots, back in the days I would have done some ram-raiding on my crim, not really an option now with the trollfest laundry has become (can be fun at times though, it just doesn't get you rich anymore) so the only real option left is doing missions and there I feel I got two choices, get full rewards but no fun or have fun and get pathetic rewards. When the matches still are mixed gold/silver teams against mixed gold/silver teams wherever we go why do we need to take a hit in moniez just because somehow the game decided the district where those matches happen isn't appropriate? It just doesn't make sense...

Either you get rid of the matchmaking trying to balance things because you know what rating your district is and that should keep the balance (don't think that's a good idea) or you get rid of the rated districts because matchmaking will try to balance the matches anyway (would suit me just fine): having both those system going against eachother just leads to very ugly results as far as I see it.

Edited by oblo, 21 April 2012 - 11:15 PM.

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#63
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View PostKimiko, on 21 April 2012 - 03:15 PM, said:

and does a much better job at keeping green/bronze players from having to face us. That's definitely a win on both accounts.

Verifiably false with every thread like this one or complaint in district chat that higher threat players are stomping around in lower threat districts. The segregation is an illusion created by penalty driven colored districts that are still chalked full of players of all threats regardless.

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#64
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View PostPoperon, on 21 April 2012 - 07:18 PM, said:

What if they're better players than you are?

That was her point, she's saying she's listed as gold, but shouldn't be.

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#65
StopRuiningTheGame

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Golds should gosh darn off into the GOLD SERVERS. They're ruining the game completely, they're gosh darning SCUM and they should all die in real life

#66
Eruka

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You know I'll never play in gold district because of 2 reasons:

- One you already know from a different threat, because of the fail matchmaking 90% of all missions I get there are 1v1 (or if I'm with a friend it's 2v2. A bit better but still crap). I like massive fights with more than 5 people at each side. This is a MMO right? So I want to see masses in action and to be a part of them.

- 2nd one may sound a little bit selfish but it is.... fun. I like when everything happening in games is close to reality. It's not real when everyone is just so skilled and good as in gold district. Everyone knows what to do, no one ever makes mistakes etc. I like when teams are mix of good and not-so-good players, it makes things fun. Yes there are many golds in silver district but most of the time matchmaking puts several of them in one team BUT also in the other team too. Complete imbalance when there are only golds on one side and only silvers in the oposite are rare. Very rare. So yes I like to have several silvers and several golds in one team, this is the most fun game setting I can find in APB. I want to go in fight, meet a couple of silvers and squash them like bugs only to meet their gold after and sink in a dangerous duel.

And by the way don't worry about being killed by golds in your silver district. By fighting a stronger enemy you learn much faster and sooner will become gold too. :)

Edited by JWhisper, 22 April 2012 - 12:32 AM.

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#67
GodsLikeMe

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I looked and checked multiple times at when OP posted this thread to figure out if you are actually lagging behind on what's actually happening in APB.

Edited by GodsLikeMe, 22 April 2012 - 12:39 AM.

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#68
Rebelliousness

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View PostKaryl, on 21 April 2012 - 04:35 AM, said:

district recommendation put me two times yesterday in bronze districts (even tho there were at least silver districts available).. trololol.

And what do I do then? Right, since I don't have any other choice and it's "working as intended" I stomp the crap outta noobs. Sorry 'bout that. Thank the developers for that.


^THIS is APB. And THIS mommyty behavior by the vast majority of players is WHY they have to create a green/bronze district for less than rating 100 (on ENTIRE account), as well as find some way to eliminate the game of noob-stomping, progression blocking, and easy unbalanced wins. I am a lousy bumps between bronze and low silver player which gets DESTROYED. If I join a silver server as a low silver, I get forced losses as am kicked from almost every mission even before I drive to an objective. I also get kicked while bronze on bronze districts by the flaming high silver and gold idiots that are trolling.

All this system does is SCREW the lower end casual and new players HARD and UNFORGIVINGLY, while nearly every post caters to the unique problems of the GOLD assholes.
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#69
Rebelliousness

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View PostJWhisper, on 22 April 2012 - 12:29 AM, said:


...And by the way don't worry about being killed by golds in your silver district. By fighting a stronger enemy you learn much faster and sooner will become gold too. :)


This is such a load of patootie! Especially for the Bronze districts just as rolled by golds (and silvers) We keep geting screwed in so many ways. Our ranking suffers. Our progression is blocked. We get hopelessly rolled. We get team kicked repeatedly as players try desperately to get the higher silver and gold ranks on their missions. We get trashed, insulted, ROFLStomped...

this doesn't help anyone learn anything. It's just a real stumblingblock to the lower level players. Who knows how well or poorly we actually play since so many gold opponents with unlocked power weapons like nade launchers and OSMAWs roll us off the map.


It WOULD be worthwhile to have an open threat level district choice, with advanced rewards. But also should have at least a protected noobie district, as well as one protected mid-range bronze/silver district in which NO GOLD on an account nor lvl 150 or higher would be allowed on.

AT LEAST!~ Let the gimpier players have a damn chance to actually get better and not be non-stop rolled.

Edited by Rebelliousness, 22 April 2012 - 02:39 AM.

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#70
Eruka

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Rebellious do you think it was different before the new district system? No it was even more unbalanced because the district were all the same - greens and golds were boiling in one jar. And guess what? From that jar good players you can see now were born. They are good not because they were given a chance and tools to play in peace from all those already skilled players. They are good because they managed to get better no matter what? beat those bad players and becomes good themselves.
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#71
Rikard86

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You guys have yet to understand that whenever a Gold joins a Silver district the rating goes up, and whenever a Green joins a Gold district the rating goes down. All you need is a Trainee in a Gold district to screw up the district TL in a way that it shows up Silver. At that point, any silver player joining that district is going to be matched against Gold oppositon all the time and blame them for playing in a 'Silver' district, while it's actually a 'Gold+1 trainee' district.

Same thing goes for the opposite, too - a bunch of Golds in a Silver district will bring the rating up so much that any Gold playing via Recommended will end up there. The district is now a Gold district and Gold players have all the right to stay there.

I routinely get placed in Silver districts as a Gold (I usually group with Silvers) and find people of all colors there, to the point that I'm starting to think that the whole "Gold GTFO" thing is an excuse.



The game determines district TL via mathematical average which does not distribute skill levels in the correct way, and while a computer will not fail its calculations, it will always answer wrong if you feed it BS. Remember that.

Edited by Rikard86, 22 April 2012 - 11:11 PM.

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#72
n3xn3x

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there might be also people who are friends and want to play together.. so one is silver.. one is gold..
ahhh so they are not allowed to play together?? seriously that would fu*k up this game sooo much..
and if the gold one is maxed there is no reason that the other one gets reduced rewards.

cheers

edit...
kicking players from missions is actually some issue that must be fixed in some way..
if they are afk or giving up that mission -> thats a reason for me to kick them
also if you tell them stop rushing in kill task and the next thing is they take a car and run into a group of 3 or 4 is pretty anoying -> so ignoring the team is also a reason to kick...

but i also have to say i am quite pissed of all the flaming and griefing.. always you get confronted with that.. would be so nice to see more friendly gamer in san paro.

Edited by n3xn3x, 23 April 2012 - 01:54 AM.


#73
SpanishGamer

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I personally go to a bronze district because ltl is underpowered to mommy and even at bronze i sometimes will get killed by a rating 9 with the allmighty STAR XD silver maybe but than again silver is full of golds and i cant wish to stun a gold unless their those golds -.- who have gold but dont deserve it.
Now golds beying in silver district well thats just g1's fult, why put seperate districts for golds / silvers / bronzes if ur gona let anyone join any district? its so fking pointless. and only now with the 1.7 update and the new contacts we are seeing gold district get more full cos golds dont want to lose standing to lvl up the new contacts just for beying in a silver district. but after they all get to 215 theyll go back to silver district to make sure they dont lose their presious !!!!! GOLD ( which is just nathing but a gold symbol beside ur name...) gold is overated.
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#74
Shaolinie

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Solution to this would be:

1. Hard locked instances by threat - no matter who is in the district threat will stay the same
2. Rewards based on opposition not on instance threat - not fair to get reduced rewards in silver playing gold vs gold and yet if that is 1v1 gold v silver then gold should get reduced rewards while silver - increased
3. Instances for players below certain rank - this way they will get to know game mechanics better before they get to face people that know this game in and out - 10 matches to determine threat is not an option - people roll with better players or cheaters to start gold and then get rolled or players get lucky get rolled and then just leave game and all those threats appear - EU2 has no players (yeah and who's fault is that - darned "elite" players)
4. Increase in rewards when facing equal or harder opponents - will be great incentive to play in own threat level because even if you lose you still get decent rewards because not it is easier to go to silver and considering you are good then you will get more kills and more often wins making you getting bigger rewards than having hard match just to earn a tiny bit more and that is if you win.
4. Hide threat level from player and then add more uncertainty to accounts. I am really sick of being gold - either no opposition, 1v1 or getting hard match and likely a loss meaning lower rewards
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#75
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View PostShaolinie, on 23 April 2012 - 04:15 AM, said:

Solution to this would be:

1. Hard locked instances by threat - no matter who is in the district threat will stay the same
2. Rewards based on opposition not on instance threat - not fair to get reduced rewards in silver playing gold vs gold and yet if that is 1v1 gold v silver then gold should get reduced rewards while silver - increased
3. Instances for players below certain rank - this way they will get to know game mechanics better before they get to face people that know this game in and out - 10 matches to determine threat is not an option - people roll with better players or cheaters to start gold and then get rolled or players get lucky get rolled and then just leave game and all those threats appear - EU2 has no players (yeah and who's fault is that - darned "elite" players)
4. Increase in rewards when facing equal or harder opponents - will be great incentive to play in own threat level because even if you lose you still get decent rewards because not it is easier to go to silver and considering you are good then you will get more kills and more often wins making you getting bigger rewards than having hard match just to earn a tiny bit more and that is if you win.
4. Hide threat level from player and then add more uncertainty to accounts. I am really sick of being gold - either no opposition, 1v1 or getting hard match and likely a loss meaning lower rewards

i don't like the logic behind your post. Hard locking instances is fine, though the total amount of golds is far too low to sustain such a system.
I can stand my own in a golden instance, but we all grow tired of fighting the same group/person constantly.
If you would really deny all acces to lower threat instances then gold players would only be able to join 1 or 2 instances per map and those are either full or empty. If we're lucky there is one with a decent pop.

The other problem i have with your system is that it will make playing with friends impossible. Just say you want to tag along with a group of silvers, to have some good old fun. But you either can't or will get even less reward because you are fighting other silvers. That's just messed up.

So far, the best idea i have heard is to lock the instances up to R50 (or R100) where they can join IF they want. Don't force them but if they want to fight along people of the same R level then let there be one. Make it account wide, as suggested before, so you can't join anymore when you passed the R50 (or 100) mark.

I say R50 because most people tend to know at least a bit of this game when they're halfway through the contact tree...

#76
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segregation is a biotch eh!?



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